Is Mexico Safe?

[mark883]

Originally Posted by crashmaster

I apologize in advance if this has been posted here before.

Not sure of the accuracy as I think the New Yorker is generally a pretty far left publication, and I am generally suspicious of anything in print, but I found it a very interesting read: http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2...urrentPage=all

Too long.


still reading.......

[MikeMike]

PirateJohn, I wouldn't be so much worried about missing items from my body at a cookout like that, I'd be more worried if they had one of those whiz bang defibrillator devices on site!
Texans really know how to throw a barbecue party.

[Katze]

According to this, 111 Americans were killed in Mexico in 2010

http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/mex...co-1357703.php

According to this, More Americans died in Chicago than Iraq in the Summer of 2008

http://forums.military.com/eve/forum.../2500089791001

I couldn't even find a stat for Americans being killed in Canada (although the Bears are dangerous). So my choice is to travel in Canada this year. Not Mexico or Chicago.

Of course that's just me....

[tricepilot]

I subscribe to the New Yorker on Kindle - but only for the cartoons

[SchizzMan]

Statistics are generally misinformation when uncoupled from socio-political dynamics. For example, if a traveler is concerned about becoming a victim of drug violence in Mexico then the 110 fatalities in 2010 would only be relevant if broken down into categories describing the context of each fatality. Remove from the 110 deaths all fatalities of people involved in the drug war (users, dealers, transporters, law enforcement, reporters, bloggers, gov't officials) and you have a much smaller number. Then remove those fatalities involving poor judgment and reckless behavior and you end up with a few traffic fatalities and some unlucky souls. Just the kind of stuff that happens in the US.

Unless a traveler is somehow involved in the illegal drug industry or is planning on lingering in areas of known drug violence the probability of becoming a victim is likely no greater than in the US. Rent a jet ski and ride into the middle of a known drug corridor where drugs are transported by jet ski, however, and your chances increase considerably.

Personally I do consider riding México to involve greater risk than riding in the US, but mainly due to road and traffic conditions. Drug violence can be effectively factored out of any trip by applying the wisdom & experience of travelers in this thread.

[MikeMike]

Originally Posted by tricepilot

I subscribe to the New Yorker on Kindle - but only for the cartoons

Don't bother, they're here.

[tricepilot]

[MikeMike]

[crashmaster]

Originally Posted by SchizzMan

Statistics are generally misinformation when uncoupled from socio-political dynamics.

True. I dont pay too much attention to the statistics because as you mention, they can be misleading wrt your actual safety if the picture of the entire context is left out.

I thought the article was interesting how it talked about the players in the political arena the their ties to various cartels. Obviously its a much more complex situation than most people understand.

In any case, I thought it was a good read to get a better picture of whats actually going on in Mexico.

[jimmex]

^^+1 I thought it was a good article and unsettling as well. The only part I raised my eyebrows about and questioned the accuracy of was the statement that the Zs and Sinaloa are having pitched battles in the Sierra of Sinaloa to see who gains control of each town. That is simply untrue, but good piece other than that.

[MikeMike]

Originally Posted by crashmaster

. Obviously its a much more complex situation than most people understand.

Exactly.
And that is why until a news agency decides to imbed some reporters here (and they survive) nobody outside of Mexico will ever know what is really happening. Some Spanish news agencies have stringers here, and have sent some decent reporters. But most don't have the massive background knowledge required to really understand what is going on.
AP is likely one of the worst for reporting, yet their stuff is wire service stuff and goes worldwide and people believe it.
And those same people are not getting the full story.
Al Kooper, the musican, summed this up best when he mentioned in his autobiography (which is a really good read if you like background info) that sometimes a story is created to fit a profile and then repeated by other writers and it then becomes "fact". His take on what happened when Dylan went electric is 180 degrees different from many others because he was there, standing right there, when it all went down around him. Until someone comes here and sticks it out for a long time, the story will never be told.
From Guadalajara to Dylan to...?...who knows where the "IMS" thread will go.
Until then the world is getting only half-truths, rumors, innuendo, gossip, etc... between the commercials for ambulance chasers, cooking aids, hearing aids, slimming aids, etc...

[PirateJohn]

Originally Posted by tricepilot

I worked in a pizza joint in college. The memories of what goes on in a restaurant will make the hair on your head stand up.

I hear ya. I lasted about 2 weeks at a Wendy's when I was in college and wouldn't eat at a Wendy's for about 20 years following that experience. Hint: I know how they get the meat for the chili and it was disgusting.

[PirateJohn]

Crash, a couple of weeks ago someone posted a link to US citizen deaths as reported to the US State Department. What struck me was that a person was literally twice as likely to accidentally drown in a hotel pool in the Yucatan as to be killed in a homicide in Tamaulipas, which is the border state that I have been living next to.

Schizz sorta hit the nail on the head that you are much more likely to become a victim of a traffic accident although I do disagree with Schizz on one aspect of his comment - I am phobic about people not seeing me when I ride and I generally feel that Mexican drivers are more alert to motorcyclists than US drivers.

[MikeMike]

Originally Posted by PirateJohn

I generally feel that Mexican drivers are more alert to motorcyclists than US drivers.

True, except for that nasty little stretch of tarmac that runs from Naolinco to Xalapa. LOL!

[SchizzMan]

Originally Posted by PirateJohn

Schizz sorta hit the nail on the head that you are much more likely to become a victim of a traffic accident although I do disagree with Schizz on one aspect of his comment - I am phobic about people not seeing me when I ride and I generally feel that Mexican drivers are more alert to motorcyclists than US drivers.

Well, PJ, "sorta hit the nail on the head", is about as good as it gets for me.

We actually don't disagree about Mexican drivers being more aware of riders. But overall road and traffic conditions are, IMO, considerably more challenging than in the US, especially on the mountain roads where you are far more likely to be passed on a two-lane while approaching a blind hair-pin turn than you are in the States. Or having some little box truck trying to race you down the Espinazo del Diablo out of pure machismo. Not as much of that here either. In my experience, at least. Nearly got splatted by a motor coach that entered my lane to pass some cars slowing down for topes. In a dense fog. Tricepilot still can't figure out how I got around the bus. As for me, I had my eyes closed.

Worse of all I have recently witnessed the increasing use of cell phones rapidly degrading the usually high attentiveness of Mexican drivers all over the country. A very very bad combination right there.