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Old 05-27-2011, 03:49 PM   #646
duck
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbuzzy View Post
but having in your roadcraft toolkit
I can't afford that Aerostich ch1t.
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Old 05-28-2011, 10:07 AM   #647
Jim in Texas
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Thanks

I am about to take up riding for the first time, and I just finished reading this thread. Despite the occassional pissing contest, which seem inevitable in most conversations, it's been very helpful. Thank you to all of the forum participants who took time to help we new riders out.

I have an insured bikes, good gear, with the MSF course scheduled for next week, and then a trip to the DPS for licensing. I will just be biking for fun, mostly on the country roads around where I live, in the daytime.

Thanks.
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Old 05-28-2011, 10:41 AM   #648
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^^^^ What he said ^^^^^

Welcome, Jim.
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Old 05-28-2011, 12:38 PM   #649
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standing up on pegs

[QUOTE=bomber60015;12512280]Things like..."Standing up on the pegs or at least putting more pressure on them makes the bike less top heavy and better to control at low speed".

this is simply untrue -- raising up on the pegs will elevated the center of mass of the bike/rider combination.


I beg to differ, from my experience standing up LOWERS the center of gravity to down around the bottom of the feet, thereby making it much easier to balance and control at low speed. This info comes by way of the BMW GS Off-Road instructional dvd from RawHyde Adventures. Practical application is the easiest way to prove this, sit down (center of gravity down around cylinder heads of GS) and balance at low speed, next stand up and do the same thing: major difference. Hope this helps...
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Old 05-28-2011, 01:48 PM   #650
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[QUOTE=Prodaddy;16027368]
Quote:
Originally Posted by bomber60015 View Post
Things like..."Standing up on the pegs or at least putting more pressure on them makes the bike less top heavy and better to control at low speed".

this is simply untrue -- raising up on the pegs will elevated the center of mass of the bike/rider combination.


I beg to differ, from my experience standing up LOWERS the center of gravity to down around the bottom of the feet, thereby making it much easier to balance and control at low speed. This info comes by way of the BMW GS Off-Road instructional dvd from RawHyde Adventures. Practical application is the easiest way to prove this, sit down (center of gravity down around cylinder heads of GS) and balance at low speed, next stand up and do the same thing: major difference. Hope this helps...




Should nOObs use synthetic or dino oil?
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Old 05-28-2011, 04:40 PM   #651
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@prodaddy and @bomber60015 and @duck...

THIS IS A NOOB THREAD and as such, I don't know that this conversation should be discussed here. I'm wondering if Perfect Line would be a more appropriate place for the discussion of whether standing on the pegs would raise or lower the center of gravity. Either way, not too many noobs will be standing up at first. Thanks for your cooperation in this. Let's stay on topic, if we could please. No sense in confusing us noobs.
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opaque_machete screwed with this post 05-29-2011 at 12:59 AM Reason: add duck to the mix now
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Old 05-28-2011, 05:34 PM   #652
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The center of gravity of the combination of the rider and bike rises when the rider stands up. Even people who work for BMW can't change the laws of physics.

A more accurate statement would be that when the rider stands up and detaches himself from the seat that the center of mass (a more appropriate term than center of gravity) of the bike is lower than the center of mass of the bike and rider was when the rider was seated. When standing the rider can move the two centers of mass (bike and rider) independently for better control. (Or something to that effect.)
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Old 05-31-2011, 04:29 AM   #653
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A few tips...

Here's a few tips...in no order at all...

1- If you get a nagging voice in your head telling you that whatever it is you're doing is not good then listen to it and back off.

2- Don't lean too much across painted lines in the wet. If you're turning out onto a main road then make your tightest part of turn when you're across the painted lines.

3- Take it easy after the first rain following a long run of dry days. It's greasy at that first downpour.

4- Don't take anything that will impair your normal logic or reflexes...ie no drugs or alcohol.

5- Remember that your family, quite likely, loves you.

6- There might be a second set of lights. Just because you made it through the intersection on the amber does not mean you will make it through the second set of lights... which you did not see... because you were concentrating on whether or not you'd beat that first amber.

7- Yes the guy parked, who is clearly looking at you and who is waiting for you to pass by, is still going to pull out in front of you. Yes he will.

8- You will learn how fast you can go into a corner once you've not made it, once.

9- If you've been in for major repairs then do check your wheel bolts/nuts or anything that they may have touched that might be essential for your safe riding. The mechanic may have got distracted at a critical part of reassembly.

10- (Similar to 2)... observe the road surface, if it's wet and really 'glossy', compared to the other parts of the same road, then it might have you off in a millisecond.


alzrider screwed with this post 06-01-2011 at 05:18 PM
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Old 05-31-2011, 12:22 PM   #654
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duck View Post
The center of gravity of the combination of the rider and bike rises when the rider stands up. Even people who work for BMW can't change the laws of physics.

A more accurate statement would be that when the rider stands up and detaches himself from the seat that the center of mass (a more appropriate term than center of gravity) of the bike is lower than the center of mass of the bike and rider was when the rider was seated. When standing the rider can move the two centers of mass (bike and rider) independently for better control. (Or something to that effect.)
Or even more accurately, by separating himself from the seat he reduces the moment of inertia of the mass that needs to rotate around an axis to turn the bike.
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Old 05-31-2011, 12:23 PM   #655
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[QUOTE=Prodaddy;16027368]
Quote:
Originally Posted by bomber60015 View Post
Things like..."Standing up on the pegs or at least putting more pressure on them makes the bike less top heavy and better to control at low speed".

this is simply untrue -- raising up on the pegs will elevated the center of mass of the bike/rider combination.


I beg to differ, from my experience standing up LOWERS the center of gravity to down around the bottom of the feet, thereby making it much easier to balance and control at low speed. This info comes by way of the BMW GS Off-Road instructional dvd from RawHyde Adventures. Practical application is the easiest way to prove this, sit down (center of gravity down around cylinder heads of GS) and balance at low speed, next stand up and do the same thing: major difference. Hope this helps...
They are wrong. It raises the center of gravity.
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Old 05-31-2011, 06:29 PM   #656
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Center of gravity...up on the pegs raises (or lowers) the center of gravity...hmmm...Newton where are you when we need you?

And so, the argument continues...
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Old 05-31-2011, 10:58 PM   #657
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Originally Posted by DAKEZ View Post
There is no argument. Mass goes up so does COG. Pretty simple actually.

just enjoying the show
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Old 06-01-2011, 09:19 AM   #658
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duck View Post
The center of gravity of the combination of the rider and bike rises when the rider stands up. Even people who work for BMW can't change the laws of physics.

A more accurate statement would be that when the rider stands up and detaches himself from the seat that the center of mass (a more appropriate term than center of gravity) of the bike is lower than the center of mass of the bike and rider was when the rider was seated. When standing the rider can move the two centers of mass (bike and rider) independently for better control. (Or something to that effect.)
This.

By standing and keeping your arms and legs flexed you decouple the masses of the bike and rider. Movement of one will have less effect on the stability of the system.

It's a bit like kayaking in waves. A good paddler keeps their hips loose and lets the boat move under them while their torso stays centered. A poor paddler tries to keep the boat rigidly upright and so feels much less stable.
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Old 06-02-2011, 03:53 AM   #659
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darfibulax View Post
This.

By standing and keeping your arms and legs flexed you decouple the masses of the bike and rider. Movement of one will have less effect on the stability of the system.

It's a bit like kayaking in waves. A good paddler keeps their hips loose and lets the boat move under them while their torso stays centered. A poor paddler tries to keep the boat rigidly upright and so feels much less stable.

What's a practical application of the 'decoupling' effect???
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Old 06-02-2011, 04:21 AM   #660
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MotoMusicMark View Post
What did you wish someone told you about motorcycling when you first started out?

Thanks. Mark Tillack
Brinkhaven, OH(USA)
It is addictive. One is not enough. You will spend a lot of money on bikes.
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