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Old 10-19-2011, 02:58 PM   #256
Sumi
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I was at my KTM dealer today with my 640ADV, to carry out an oil change and a valve check. (I did the job with the dealers supervision on me - we're kind of friends..)

However, he told me that I don't need to bleed the frame, only put in the 600ml oil, and thats it. I couldn't believe him (asked him three times), but I did that. Then I came home with the bike (~20miles), and realized that it has developed a knocking sound (it might just be my paranoia though).. Have I just messed up the conrod bearing? Do I need to bleed the frame? Is it too late already?

Oil level in the sight window is OK, and it took about 2l-2.1l oil with the 600ml included in the frame.

Thanks..
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Sumi screwed with this post 10-19-2011 at 03:40 PM
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Old 10-19-2011, 04:52 PM   #257
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paranoia probably...


But on another note ...just a friendly reminder.. check your sprocketbolts and countershaft bolts.. all of you... and since its a oil thread.. check your oil drainplugs
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wrk2surf screwed with this post 10-19-2011 at 07:07 PM
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Old 10-20-2011, 01:08 AM   #258
Sumi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrk2surf View Post
paranoia probably...


But on another note ...just a friendly reminder.. check your sprocketbolts and countershaft bolts.. all of you... and since its a oil thread.. check your oil drainplugs
thanks:)
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Old 10-20-2011, 11:43 AM   #259
makazica
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sumi View Post
I was at my KTM dealer today with my 640ADV, to carry out an oil change and a valve check. (I did the job with the dealers supervision on me - we're kind of friends..)

However, he told me that I don't need to bleed the frame, only put in the 600ml oil, and thats it. I couldn't believe him (asked him three times), but I did that. Then I came home with the bike (~20miles), and realized that it has developed a knocking sound (it might just be my paranoia though).. Have I just messed up the conrod bearing? Do I need to bleed the frame? Is it too late already?

Oil level in the sight window is OK, and it took about 2l-2.1l oil with the 600ml included in the frame.

Thanks..

Oh, for God's sake!

Does your owner's manual say that you have to "burp" the frame/oil system? Why do you think people around the world wrote how-do's for an oil change on a LC4? Maybe cause it's a bit different from many other bikes??

I'm sorry if my words come out a bit sharp......but if it's in the manual why would anybody not do it??

After all it makes sense to do it - if you understand how the oil circuit on the LC4 works.....

At 20 miles you haven't developed a knocking sound related to not burping the frame, but at 350 miles you might, if an air pocket has developed in the oil system.....

And BTW....what does your owners manual say about the oil quantity required by an LC4 engine?

Cheers!

M.
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Old 10-20-2011, 12:02 PM   #260
Sumi
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Originally Posted by makazica View Post
Oh, for God's sake!

Does your owner's manual say that you have to "burp" the frame/oil system? Why do you think people around the world wrote how-do's for an oil change on a LC4? Maybe cause it's a bit different from many other bikes??

I'm sorry if my words come out a bit sharp......but if it's in the manual why would anybody not do it??

After all it makes sense to do it - if you understand how the oil circuit on the LC4 works.....

At 20 miles you haven't developed a knocking sound related to not burping the frame, but at 350 miles you might, if an air pocket has developed in the oil system.....

And BTW....what does your owners manual say about the oil quantity required by an LC4 engine?

Cheers!

M.
No problem because of the sharp words:)

Well, I kind of trust my KTM dealer as he already did probably more oil changes on the LC4s than all of us here.. But you are right, it's in the manual, to blurp it. That is why I'm in a doubt.
Cheers!
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Old 10-24-2011, 02:40 AM   #261
Alik
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Hi there,

just read something new about burping the frame.

Short story: friend of mine bought a KTM Military 400 LS-E/Mil. I went to the dealership to aks them about any possible documentation as she intends to work herself on the bike. She wants to learn it if the need arises somewhere down the road to repair it.
Anyway I have now an official engine repair manual from KTM 400 - nice reading. I began to trace any differences in the Repair Manual from my 640ADV Repair Manual.
To my amazement the 400 Mil Manual states (in German) to fill the frame with 0,6 oil, tighten the filler plug with new copper gasket and to burp the frame by (Attention please!) loosening the bolt on the left (clutch side) engine cover. As soon as it leaks oil tighten the blt with 10 Nm.

Here is a picture of the said manual:



So… what do You guys think about it? Does it make sense? Is it the way we should do it too? Is the 400 Mil so different than 640 ADV?
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Old 10-24-2011, 04:15 AM   #262
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrk2surf View Post
paranoia probably...


But on another note ...just a friendly reminder.. check your sprocketbolts and countershaft bolts.. all of you... and since its a oil thread.. check your oil drainplugs
Good advice. I limped back to camp on the second day of the Shenandoah 500 DS ride with only two sprocket bolts. I must have forgotten the Loctite when I was switching sprockets with my 200.
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Old 10-24-2011, 12:50 PM   #263
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alik View Post
To my amazement the 400 Mil Manual states (in German) to fill the frame with 0,6 oil, tighten the filler plug with new copper gasket and to burp the frame by (Attention please!) loosening the bolt on the left (clutch side) engine cover. As soon as it leaks oil tighten the blt with 10 Nm.

...
So… what do You guys think about it? Does it make sense? Is it the way we should do it too? Is the 400 Mil so different than 640 ADV?
If you look at the oil circuit flow diagram on p1 of this thread you can see that the oil line that the 400 manual tells you to bleed comes out of the frame from the filter. Compare it to the diagram in your 400 manual & you will probably find they are the same.

It looks like both methods are doing the same thing - bleeding out air until the frame is filled with oil, just at different points.

Cheers
Clint
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Old 10-26-2011, 08:05 PM   #264
Sumi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sumi View Post
No problem because of the sharp words:)

Well, I kind of trust my KTM dealer as he already did probably more oil changes on the LC4s than all of us here.. But you are right, it's in the manual, to blurp it. That is why I'm in a doubt.
Cheers!
It's been a while since I've did this oil change, and because of the forum + manual, I've did the blurping the other day.. When I undid the bolt on the frame, oil immediately came out there, so I've retightened it to 25nm, and everything was well..

Now my problem is, that it's leaking oil all over the frame / engine, it's a mess everywhere:) Is there a trick on that washer under the frame plug? Do I have to change it every time when I undo that bolt?
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Old 10-26-2011, 11:34 PM   #265
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It was my problem too - are You sure that You don't overfilled oil?
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Old 10-27-2011, 03:16 AM   #266
Sumi
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It was my problem too - are You sure that You don't overfilled oil?
Yeah, it's not overfilled, and is leaking from the frame plug (the bolt where you fill the frame with oil)
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Old 10-27-2011, 03:53 AM   #267
Alik
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Ten why not put a new copper ring there ;)
Eventually add a dab of hi-temp silikon to the last few threads just to be sure.
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Old 10-27-2011, 07:06 AM   #268
laramie LC4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clintnz View Post
If you look at the oil circuit flow diagram on p1 of this thread you can see that the oil line that the 400 manual tells you to bleed comes out of the frame from the filter. Compare it to the diagram in your 400 manual & you will probably find they are the same.

It looks like both methods are doing the same thing - bleeding out air until the frame is filled with oil, just at different points.

Cheers
Clint

625's and i think some of the 620's do the same thing. they are just bleeding the system in a diff place.

on another note, the "adding 600cc of oil to the downtube" was not added to the manual until later models. previously it just said to dump all the oil into the case, loosen the "burp" bolt on the frame, start the engine and wait for it to come out. when it does, turn off the bike, tighten the bolt, and your good.

many arguments have taken place about whether or not this is a good idea. does this cause wear on the top end? does it cause damage while waiting for the oil to circulate? or does it really matter? all i know is that i "inject" 600cc of oil into my downtube, then i burp it like the manual says. take that for what its worth....

laramie
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Old 10-03-2012, 09:50 PM   #269
Leviticus
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Creeper, much thanks for the write up! Picked up an 04 625 and am ready to change the oil this weekend. Should be a breeze now... or a mess to clean up. Although I think the guys at the local hardware store think I am building a meth lab, I kept telling them its a tool for an oil change
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Old 10-03-2012, 10:54 PM   #270
bmwktmbill
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It's been said before...
Tighten the dipstick before starting the engine...

Or prepare for a big fuckup oil explosion.
bill
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