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Old 10-30-2010, 04:41 PM   #1
Tray OP
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Joined: Nov 2001
Location: Mississippi
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How to test F650 fuel pump?

When you turn the key on, shouldn't there be a whine from the fuel pump? I have turned on and off several times and nothing to be heard from the pump. I have tried repeated crankings but nothing. When I pull one of the hoses from the pump (no the return line) There isn't a drop of fuel in the line. I get right at 12 volts at the white plug on top of the pump housing.

How can I test the fuel pump? What else can I check that would keep the fuel pump from energizing?

I looked thru F650.com FAQ and see how to reset BMC but no indication of how to test the pump itself.
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Old 10-30-2010, 04:52 PM   #2
jonkem
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tray
When you turn the key on, shouldn't there be a whine from the fuel pump? I have turned on and off several times and nothing to be heard from the pump. I have tried repeated crankings but nothing. When I pull one of the hoses from the pump (no the return line) There isn't a drop of fuel in the line. I get right at 12 volts at the white plug on top of the pump housing.

How can I test the fuel pump? What else can I check that would keep the fuel pump from energizing?

I looked thru F650.com FAQ and see how to reset BMC but no indication of how to test the pump itself.
You can very carefully remove the hose at the injector to know you have fuel pressure or not. You can easily remove the pump from the tank for manual testing and also to check the wiring at the pump which can be an issue.
Just in case you haven't already....watch the dash lights when you turn the key to "on". The sequence for the lights is an important tell tale.
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Old 10-30-2010, 05:15 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonkem
You can very carefully remove the hose at the injector to know you have fuel pressure or not. You can easily remove the pump from the tank for manual testing and also to check the wiring at the pump which can be an issue.
Just in case you haven't already....watch the dash lights when you turn the key to "on". The sequence for the lights is an important tell tale.
Hose at the injector is a pain tor remove so I removed the one from the pump to the filter. Dry, no gas in line.

What wiring do I check at and one the pump?

What light sequence is abnormal? This bike sat for 3 years and I am trying to bring it back to life. All new hoses and cleaned the gas tank.
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Old 10-31-2010, 10:02 AM   #4
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From what I have read, black connector on top of fuel pump is power for the fuel pump. White connector is fuel level indicator. I have 12 volts at the white connector but not at the black. Seems something is telling it not to power up the pump. I assume if pump is bad the computer senses no gas flow and shuts power down.

Anyone with a manual care to share what to check? I am not certain how to test just the pump. There is no places I can find to check power on straight at the pump.
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Old 10-31-2010, 10:30 AM   #5
jonkem
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tray
From what I have read, black connector on top of fuel pump is power for the fuel pump. White connector is fuel level indicator. I have 12 volts at the white connector but not at the black. Seems something is telling it not to power up the pump. I assume if pump is bad the computer senses no gas flow and shuts power down.

Anyone with a manual care to share what to check? I am not certain how to test just the pump. There is no places I can find to check power on straight at the pump.
There is a set sequence of dashboard lights before start up. When you turn the key on, the water temp light should be lit for a couple of seconds and then go out. You should then be left with oil light, neutral light and fuel light.

If the water temp light doesn't illuminate during this sequence check the 15amp fuse in the fuse box. That is the main power for the ecu. If the fuse is good and stilll no W/T light, test for 12v at pin 25 (red & white) at ECU.

Pin 9 on the ECU is the common ground for all the functions so this is a critical good quality earth connection.

Pin 27 at the ECU is fuel pump feed, the colour of the wire at that point is Green & Brown. I haven't tested whether it's a permanent live with ign on & don't know if it is controlled by fuel pressure switch other than inside pump.

"in-tank" pumps (in general) are prone to wiring connection issues within the tank. Simple visual check with pump out of tank is usually all it takes to identify. Earth tag break off that kind of thing.

You can power up the pump with made up "jumper" leads when it's out of the tank but don't run it for very long as it needs the fuel in the tank to lubricate and cool it whilst it's running!!

Report your test results?
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Old 10-31-2010, 06:03 PM   #6
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Thumb

Lights check out fine, normal sequence according to your post. Fuses are fine, verified with meter. I will visually inspect pump tomorrow and attempt to power up out of tank. I know I get minimal power at the black connector to the pump. It's as if the computer has cut power to it.
Thanks for the detailed info. Much appreciated!

Quote:
Originally Posted by jonkem
There is a set sequence of dashboard lights before start up. When you turn the key on, the water temp light should be lit for a couple of seconds and then go out. You should then be left with oil light, neutral light and fuel light.

If the water temp light doesn't illuminate during this sequence check the 15amp fuse in the fuse box. That is the main power for the ecu. If the fuse is good and stilll no W/T light, test for 12v at pin 25 (red & white) at ECU.

Pin 9 on the ECU is the common ground for all the functions so this is a critical good quality earth connection.

Pin 27 at the ECU is fuel pump feed, the colour of the wire at that point is Green & Brown. I haven't tested whether it's a permanent live with ign on & don't know if it is controlled by fuel pressure switch other than inside pump.

"in-tank" pumps (in general) are prone to wiring connection issues within the tank. Simple visual check with pump out of tank is usually all it takes to identify. Earth tag break off that kind of thing.

You can power up the pump with made up "jumper" leads when it's out of the tank but don't run it for very long as it needs the fuel in the tank to lubricate and cool it whilst it's running!!

Report your test results?
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Old 11-01-2010, 02:48 PM   #7
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Did some testing.

With key on I get nominal power to the black plug on the fuel pump. Hit the starter switch and I get 12 volts.

Pulled the pump out of tank, left connected to bike, turn key on, I can feel something happening with the pump but not much. A small "twinge" so to speak in the pump. There are 4 wires. 2 for power and 2 that goto a small canister that I think could be for the low fuel warning. All the wires were fine and connected securely.

Pull pump from bike, wire jumper wires, touch jumper wires to the pump connections and get a small spark. Check with meter and I get continuity between the connections on the pump. Seems the motor is shorted out.

I think a new fuel pump is needed.
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Old 11-01-2010, 04:19 PM   #8
jonkem
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Did you confirm that it's 12v output from the ECU to the pump or a switched earth within the ECU and external 12v supply to the pump? I mean whether pin 27 is switched earth or 12v output?

If you're likely to change the pump you might as well have a play first. Hit the pump a few times - the small surge sounds like it could maybe be stuck / siezed?? Was it run for a time with no fuel in the tank, maybe before you got it?

I'd be very interested, if you did change it, to know exactly whats inside the pump housing
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Old 11-01-2010, 05:07 PM   #9
Tray OP
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I know its 12 volts to the pump when the starter is engaged for sure. That is the voltage I read at the connection to the pump. Its nominal voltage (less that 1 volt) when key is turned on.

I have the fuel pump assembly on the work bench now. If I can figure out out to get the $)+#!(#*$&#@(*! fuel strainer off the bottom of the pump I will gladly share pictures.
I did try to whack it a couple of times with a rubber mallet, while energized and not. No difference.
The problem is the bike has been sitting for around 3 years with gas in the tank (no fuel stabilizer) without being run. I bought it knowing this and hoping the fuel pump was still good. I've installed new fuel lines, verified fuel filter still good and cleaned the gas tank. Seems I need to order new pump as well!


Quote:
Originally Posted by jonkem
Did you confirm that it's 12v output from the ECU to the pump or a switched earth within the ECU and external 12v supply to the pump? I mean whether pin 27 is switched earth or 12v output?

If you're likely to change the pump you might as well have a play first. Hit the pump a few times - the small surge sounds like it could maybe be stuck / siezed?? Was it run for a time with no fuel in the tank, maybe before you got it?

I'd be very interested, if you did change it, to know exactly whats inside the pump housing
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Old 11-02-2010, 11:31 AM   #10
jonkem
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Just cut the f*&ker up Have you fould a price yet?

Was it still green & brown at the multi plug that livened up with starter? Very interesting if that's the case, there would need to be a seperate "starter" program in the ECU to prime the system when the key is turned initially.
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Old 11-06-2010, 06:58 AM   #11
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Not sure of the color at the plug from ECU. I was checking voltage at the plug powering the pump. I can check thatvand lrt you know. I tried spraying some penetrant spray into top on pump but no luck after sitting for almost 2 days.
I have new starter on order. Should be here next week.
I'll tear into the pump and let you know what I find.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jonkem
Just cut the f*&ker up Have you fould a price yet?

Was it still green & brown at the multi plug that livened up with starter? Very interesting if that's the case, there would need to be a seperate "starter" program in the ECU to prime the system when the key is turned initially.

Tray screwed with this post 11-06-2010 at 07:03 AM
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Old 11-20-2010, 07:20 AM   #12
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New pump came in and np installing. Started after about 8 seconds of cranking.

I have bled the old brake fluid out and taken for a test ride. Previous owner changed the rear sprocket to lower rpms at interstate speeds so you have to feather the clutch to take off without stalling.

I have new plugs to install. Soon as I figure out hot to get the plug caps off. Seems you have to remove the air box to get them off!

I am going to change antifreeze today and order new sprockets. Any suggestions on where to order steel 15t and 47t sprockets?

I stll need to check the wires for you Jokem.

Here is the old pump:



And new:


Tray screwed with this post 11-20-2010 at 07:29 AM
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Old 11-20-2010, 08:09 AM   #13
Ditch
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Spark plugs

If you have the 2 plug motor the coils are on top of the plug assembly. They have to be rotated to be removed, and it is easier to take off all the crap above it. Fortunately, changing plugs is a rare thing on this motor.
I used sprocketcenter.com last time I bought sprockets.
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Ditch screwed with this post 11-20-2010 at 08:17 AM
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Old 10-06-2014, 04:58 PM   #14
outonmybike
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WT light question

Quote:
Originally Posted by jonkem View Post
There is a set sequence of dashboard lights before start up. When you turn the key on, the water temp light should be lit for a couple of seconds and then go out. You should then be left with oil light, neutral light and fuel light.

If the water temp light doesn't illuminate during this sequence check the 15amp fuse in the fuse box. That is the main power for the ecu. If the fuse is good and stilll no W/T light, test for 12v at pin 25 (red & white) at ECU.

Pin 9 on the ECU is the common ground for all the functions so this is a critical good quality earth connection.

Pin 27 at the ECU is fuel pump feed, the colour of the wire at that point is Green & Brown. I haven't tested whether it's a permanent live with ign on & don't know if it is controlled by fuel pressure switch other than inside pump.

"in-tank" pumps (in general) are prone to wiring connection issues within the tank. Simple visual check with pump out of tank is usually all it takes to identify. Earth tag break off that kind of thing.

You can power up the pump with made up "jumper" leads when it's out of the tank but don't run it for very long as it needs the fuel in the tank to lubricate and cool it whilst it's running!!

Report your test results?

Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but it seems I have a problem you may be able to help me with:
I have a question on the lighting sequence of the F650. I've got an 05 Dakar, and the water temp light flashes a few times quickly then goes out. It doesn't stay on for a few seconds like you mention it should. What problem would this be indicative of? The bike is having some kind of fuel issues. It's hard to start and when I pull the throttle quickly or all the way open, it loses power. I have to slowly roll the throttle open to get the tach up, and slowly release the clutch once the tach is around 4-5k to get the bike moving without killing it. Any thoughts?
Thanks.
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