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Old 04-20-2015, 04:31 AM   #1
Gas Hog OP
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KTM's make too much power?

And to think I almost bought one at Xmas
Thank god that I settled for a Busa..
Main reason was the insurance was double the Busa and the KTM was up on a box for display.
The day I showed up they were over the top busy and I am a impatient fucker. Grabed the vin for the insurance quote and that was that.
So glad too as now we find out they are dangerous

http://therideadvice.com/no-more-sup...-public-roads/

Gary
Quote:

Just to make sure he was hearing things correctly, Cathcart pressed the KTM CEO and asked if there would be at least a homologated version of this machine? In answer, Pierer again said “No, because we at KTM think that a sportbike with such performance doesn’t have any place on the public roads.”
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Old 04-20-2015, 11:42 AM   #2
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Bet it has something to do with liability or the cost of getting that motorcycle past all the regulatory requirements for being street legal.

If they are not going to sell such a motorcycle, why invest in a GP series superbike at all? Only amateurs incur the cost to race just for the fun of it, professionals do it for the investment return.
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Old 04-20-2015, 11:56 AM   #3
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Saving face instead of saying the RC8 was a total loss. Mind you, he seems to have forgotten the new 1290 series of bikes which are upping the ante in terms of KTM HP.

You've got to remember KTM designed the RC8 as their MGP bike. Then when they opted out, it was redesigned to be their WSC bike. When they decided to run it, it was only in certain domestic series. I don't think they even have a full factory effort anywhere anymore.

KTM streetbikes do not sell well. The reasons are simple and the same as Aprilia; except Aprilia probably moves a few more units since they have titles behind their superbike. Wait long enough and the KTM streetbike of your dreams will depreciate right on the sales floor into your price range. You rarely see depreciation like that.
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Old 04-20-2015, 12:41 PM   #4
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The RC8 was never intended for Moto GP. It was an outgrowth of the 950-990 bikes and the street version, the Duke.
KTM did build a 992cc V-4 for Moto GP , It was used by Team Roberts for a while.
They're going to build a new V-4 to lease to others for Moto GP in 2016, or so I read.
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Old 04-20-2015, 03:51 PM   #5
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I think it's absolutely hilarious reading the outraged responses to that article.

As a matter of principle, I would not want to see the government impose a horsepower limit on bikes. On the other hand, I honestly cannot, for myself, imagine what I would do with a bike making more than 150 HP, or maybe even 125 HP. My slightly modified BMW airhead makes probably 75 HP and it goes pretty damned fast. My Monster makes 100 HP and it is arguably a fast motorcycle for the street; I have to restrain myself on it from rampant speeding. If I had a 150 HP bike, I would constantly feel I was wasting the engine's potential.

I sincerely think if you can't have all the fun and danger you can stand riding a 175 HP bike on the street, you have probably turned into an adrenaline junky and may very well be a danger to yourself and to the public. KTM has to size up their market position and business strategy. If they think the liability issues, regulatory issues, and R&D costs make it a losing proposition for them to engage in the horsepower wars, then all the more power (no pun intended) to them. Nobody forces you to buy a KTM. If you prefer a more powerful bike than KTM sells, you can buy a different brand.

I remember when I was getting started in bikes and 100 HP was considered superbike territory.

I don't want the government deciding, "Nobody needs a 200 HP bike," because that's just the start of a slippery slope to, "Nobody needs a 100 HP bike," or, "Nobody needs a bike without airbags," or... But I have no problem at all with KTM deciding they don't want to be in the market for ever-more-powerful superbikes. It's their decision.

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Old 04-20-2015, 04:05 PM   #6
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I have a 1290 Superduke R and with some minor mods and a custom FI map, it makes 164hp and 102 ftlbs of torque at the rear wheel. I also have a KTM 500 EXC that makes around 50-55hp. I prefer the 1290 for the street

I rarely use most of the 1290's power but I really enjoy the endless torque and the motor just loping down the highway. The bike is a brute if you want it to be, but it is also fantastic for just cruising around.

Back in the 1970s I had BMW 900 and that engine was pretty weak for the displacement. I would get passed by average passenger cars doing long climbs over passes in Colorado. I don't miss that!
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Old 04-20-2015, 04:13 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Velociraptor View Post

I rarely use most of the 1290's power but I really enjoy the endless torque and the motor just loping down the highway. The bike is a brute if you want it to be, but it is also fantastic for just cruising around.
Yup, the beast wears a tux if you aren't flogging it, but if you DO decide to flog it, HHHHHHHHHHHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL LLYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY SSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE ETTTTT!!!!
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Old 04-20-2015, 06:27 PM   #8
op48no1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Velociraptor View Post
I have a 1290 Superduke R and with some minor mods and a custom FI map, it makes 164hp and 102 ftlbs of torque at the rear wheel. I also have a KTM 500 EXC that makes around 50-55hp. I prefer the 1290 for the street

I rarely use most of the 1290's power but I really enjoy the endless torque and the motor just loping down the highway. The bike is a brute if you want it to be, but it is also fantastic for just cruising around.

Back in the 1970s I had BMW 900 and that engine was pretty weak for the displacement. I would get passed by average passenger cars doing long climbs over passes in Colorado. I don't miss that!
Precisely. Now, imagine if you had 125 HP and 135 ft. lbs...

Oh, yes, also... My R100 has 11.2:1 pistons and a sport cam and acclerates briskly to redline in top gear (at which point it is so terrifyingly unstable that I have to hang on for dear life).

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Old 04-21-2015, 09:48 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by op48no1 View Post
I think it's absolutely hilarious reading the outraged responses to that article.

As a matter of principle, I would not want to see the government impose a horsepower limit on bikes. On the other hand, I honestly cannot, for myself, imagine what I would do with a bike making more than 150 HP, or maybe even 125 HP. My slightly modified BMW airhead makes probably 75 HP and it goes pretty damned fast. My Monster makes 100 HP and it is arguably a fast motorcycle for the street; I have to restrain myself on it from rampant speeding. If I had a 150 HP bike, I would constantly feel I was wasting the engine's potential.

I sincerely think if you can't have all the fun and danger you can stand riding a 175 HP bike on the street, you have probably turned into an adrenaline junky and may very well be a danger to yourself and to the public. KTM has to size up their market position and business strategy. If they think the liability issues, regulatory issues, and R&D costs make it a losing proposition for them to engage in the horsepower wars, then all the more power (no pun intended) to them. Nobody forces you to buy a KTM. If you prefer a more powerful bike than KTM sells, you can buy a different brand.

I remember when I was getting started in bikes and 100 HP was considered superbike territory.

I don't want the government deciding, "Nobody needs a 200 HP bike," because that's just the start of a slippery slope to, "Nobody needs a 100 HP bike," or, "Nobody needs a bike without airbags," or... But I have no problem at all with KTM deciding they don't want to be in the market for ever-more-powerful superbikes. It's their decision.

-Henry
I agree with everything you said, I've had bikes with 40-something hp and a 105hp ZZR600 and everything in between. That's still very low power, 105hp is probably less than any young kid would like to have as a beginners bike but to me it was more than enough.
The most fun bike I've had was the Honda NX 650

I think it all just boils down to if you enjoy the ride or if you just feed on the adrenaline.
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Old 04-21-2015, 12:07 PM   #10
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What a disturbing attitude to be coming from the CEO of ANY motorcycle manufacturer. I guess the new slogan will be "Ready to surrender".

Of course nobody NEEDS a 200 H.P. bike but, if money was no object who wouldn't have a Dodge Tomahawk or a Y2K turbine jet bike?
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Old 04-21-2015, 01:55 PM   #11
op48no1
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Originally Posted by Wallachian Spikes View Post
What a disturbing attitude to be coming from the CEO of ANY motorcycle manufacturer. I guess the new slogan will be "Ready to surrender".
It's not disturbing at all. It's bloody common-sensical.

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Of course nobody NEEDS a 200 H.P. bike but, if money was no object who wouldn't have a Dodge Tomahawk or a Y2K turbine jet bike?
Uh... Me?

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Old 04-21-2015, 10:02 PM   #12
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I can see his point if they want to build a "ready to race" sport bike, that's fine. But are they going to offer something else street legal in its place or just give up on a sport bike for the street? In light of their 1290 Super Adv bike I think his argument doesn't hold a lot of water.

I believe they really don't want to be confined by gov't regs in developing the "ready to race" bike, fine. Maybe they don't really want to sell street bikes anyway? They are a dirt bike company after all.
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Old 04-22-2015, 12:40 AM   #13
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Is KTM doing some sneaky PR here and you are all fallowing like puppets?
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Old 04-22-2015, 01:57 AM   #14
Gas Hog OP
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Originally Posted by EddyB View Post
Is KTM doing some sneaky PR here and you are all fallowing like puppets?
Maybe..if I knew what fallowing meant I could confirm though.
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Old 04-22-2015, 06:40 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by op48no1 View Post
It's not disturbing at all. It's bloody common-sensical.
It may be common sense coming from a business man who only cares about profit & nothing at all about actually riding a motorcycle. However, as the CEO of a high performance motorcycle manufacturer it' seems similar to the CEO of Harley Davidson saying that "Cruisers are for nerds who got beat up in high school & as an adult feel a need to change their self image".

I find it disturbing the number of videos on youtube with stunter douche bags shutting down public roads & running from the cops. It wouldn't bother me a bit if the cops started shooting those guys off their bikes. In fact I'd prefer that over the Nanny State setting limits on how much H.P. I can have in a motorcycle.

My hope is that Stefan Pierer is only saying this in an attempt to head off intrusive Nanny State regulation, which makes a whole lot more sense to me.
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