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Old 04-14-2012, 02:34 PM   #12256
eram310
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bross View Post
That's just a fuse block, you still need a relay, connectors, wire etc.


Yes you can for sure. The reason so many of us like using the Eastern Beaver stuff is because Jim uses Made in Japan components, not from China, quality connectors and he does them right. Have you ever looked at his connections, then compared your own? I'll take Jim's any day. Sure they're not cheap, but they're not expensive either. Add up the components and then a bit for your time and I'll bet you're pretty close to what you'd pay for EB stuff.

Plus his kits make it easy for the electrically challenged to hook up stuff "the right way" and have it run for the life of the bike. There's a price for quality that some of us are willing to pay.
I need to understand the relay theory. I thought the relay energizes through 12 volts and closes a circuit. If the relay is connected to the battery, it's always on and always switched on.
Please help me understand this.

Thanks,
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Old 04-14-2012, 02:38 PM   #12257
Mercury264
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eram310 View Post
I need to understand the relay theory. I thought the relay energizes through 12 volts and closes a circuit. If the relay is connected to the battery, it's always on and always switched on.
Please help me understand this.

Thanks,
There are basically 4 connectors for a relay. 2 for the power (1 connector from the battery - hopefully via a fuse, and the other to the circuit/device to be powered) and 2 to actually energize the relay (12V 'signal' and ground) So, as soon as the relay is energized, it then allows power from the battery to flow to the other power connector and hence to the circuit/device to be powered.

I hope that made sense and helped...
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Old 04-14-2012, 03:19 PM   #12258
bross
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Originally Posted by eram310 View Post
I need to understand the relay theory. I thought the relay energizes through 12 volts and closes a circuit. If the relay is connected to the battery, it's always on and always switched on.
Please help me understand this.

Thanks,
A relay allows you to turn accessories on/off with a switch. You're probably thinking I can just turn my heated grips on and off with the switch that came with them. Yes you can, but that means you're pulling all the current the accessory needs through the switch. The relay is connected to the battery with higher gauge (thicker) wire to handle the maximum fused load that could go to the accessory, but is controlled by your switch which now can be lower gauge (thinner) wire. Your switch doesn't have to handle the high current load of the accessory because it's simply telling the relay to either let current through or don't.

It's very easy to burn out your horn button (switch) if you run an accessory horn like a Stebel and lay on the horn for a good blast. Using a relay is just good electrical practice. You can wire things up without one and they may all work, but for how long. You run the risk of burning up your switch or melting something if you're running any high draw accessories.

Here's a better explanation than I can give... (should've searched first )

what is a relay?
-a relay is a device that allows you to control a high-current electrical load with a low-current electrical 'signal'. they are usually electro-magnetic, but are also available in solid-state forms. they can be used with a switch (to allow control of a high-current load with a small switch) or they can be hooked up to a switched power source in the car like the ignition or accessory power circuits (to allow power to be switched on/off automatically with the ignition key).

Why do I need a relay?
-when hooking anything up to a car's factory wiring, it's important to remember that factory wires are designed to carry the load of only the factory installed components. they are not 'general use' power circuits like the power outlets in your house. for example, the ignition (IGN) circuit is designed to power the car's ignition system and nothing else. hooking up a high-current device to this circuit can create a fire hazard. by using a relay, you can use the IGN circuit to control a high-current device without directly powering it from the IGN circuit itself.
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Old 04-14-2012, 10:44 PM   #12259
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I needed a new helmet to wear with my Tiger.

Bell Vortex Flying Tiger.

[IMG][/IMG]

I built a lot of models as a kid.

While I like the look of the Shoei DS Hornet (Dirt bike style helmet). I usually find myself riding at speeds that the "Dirt" Visor is a pain in the neck.

Vzuke screwed with this post 04-14-2012 at 10:47 PM Reason: insert image
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Old 04-15-2012, 07:41 AM   #12260
eram310
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Originally Posted by bross View Post
A relay allows you to turn accessories on/off with a switch. You're probably thinking I can just turn my heated grips on and off with the switch that came with them. Yes you can, but that means you're pulling all the current the accessory needs through the switch. The relay is connected to the battery with higher gauge (thicker) wire to handle the maximum fused load that could go to the accessory, but is controlled by your switch which now can be lower gauge (thinner) wire. Your switch doesn't have to handle the high current load of the accessory because it's simply telling the relay to either let current through or don't.

It's very easy to burn out your horn button (switch) if you run an accessory horn like a Stebel and lay on the horn for a good blast. Using a relay is just good electrical practice. You can wire things up without one and they may all work, but for how long. You run the risk of burning up your switch or melting something if you're running any high draw accessories.

Here's a better explanation than I can give... (should've searched first )

what is a relay?
-a relay is a device that allows you to control a high-current electrical load with a low-current electrical 'signal'. they are usually electro-magnetic, but are also available in solid-state forms. they can be used with a switch (to allow control of a high-current load with a small switch) or they can be hooked up to a switched power source in the car like the ignition or accessory power circuits (to allow power to be switched on/off automatically with the ignition key).

Why do I need a relay?
-when hooking anything up to a car's factory wiring, it's important to remember that factory wires are designed to carry the load of only the factory installed components. they are not 'general use' power circuits like the power outlets in your house. for example, the ignition (IGN) circuit is designed to power the car's ignition system and nothing else. hooking up a high-current device to this circuit can create a fire hazard. by using a relay, you can use the IGN circuit to control a high-current device without directly powering it from the IGN circuit itself.
Thanks for the explanation. So If I understand correct, I need a source (12 v battery) and close a circuit (Turn on GPS) to get the power to the GPS from the Relay.
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Old 04-15-2012, 08:08 AM   #12261
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Originally Posted by eram310 View Post
Thanks for the explanation. So If I understand correct, I need a source (12 v battery) and close a circuit (Turn on GPS) to get the power to the GPS from the Relay.
No. A relay is simply an electronic switch, or think of it like a robot. So you would say, Robot, please turn on power to my accessories (GPS etc.). Except a relay can't hear, so you use something else to say that. On a bike you use anything that gets powered when you turn on the key, typically a tail light. So you tap into the tail light wires (positive and negative) and send those signal wires to your relay. Now, whenever you turn on the key, your tail light power "tells" your relay to turn on power to your accessories.

So how does the Relay turn on power to the accessories? The negative (black) wire runs directly from the battery to the accessories. But the positive (red) wire runs from the battery to the relay, and then from the relay to your accessories, or usually to a fuseblock that then runs to the accessories. That way, the power running through the red wire can be turned on or off by the relay, whenever you use the key to provide power to the tail light.
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Old 04-15-2012, 09:00 AM   #12262
helotaxi
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Originally Posted by RichardU View Post
So you tap into the tail light wires (positive and negative) and send those signal wires to your relay.
Actually you just need to tap the (+) wire. The relay should use its own ground.

The 4 wires that you need for a standard relay (single pole, single throw or SPST) are the high current source (typically straight from the battery), ground, output (to the item that is being switched on) and the trigger (a low current source that is "hot" when you want power to the switched item).

The whole point of a relay is to allow a small switch or low current trigger to control a larger current. It's basically a small electromagnet that trips a switch of the proper current rating when power is applied to the trigger. You can do some really cool things with relays if you know what you're doing.
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Old 04-15-2012, 09:26 AM   #12263
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vzuke View Post
Bell Vortex Flying Tiger.

[IMG][/IMG]

I built a lot of models as a kid.

While I like the look of the Shoei DS Hornet (Dirt bike style helmet). I usually find myself riding at speeds that the "Dirt" Visor is a pain in the neck.
WebBikeworld had a review of this one, which looks to match the orange tiger pretty closely:

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Old 04-15-2012, 09:46 AM   #12264
helotaxi
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WebBikeworld had a review of this one, which looks to match the orange tiger pretty closely:

Cool brain bucket, but European market only.
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Old 04-15-2012, 10:23 AM   #12265
RichardU
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The relay should use its own ground.
Why is that?
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Old 04-15-2012, 10:56 AM   #12266
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I have read all the talk of getting extra 12v power to run accessories, not to state the obvious but why not buy the extra accessories socket from Triumph, there's a plug under the seat for it? That's just me try to find and easier way to do it.
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Old 04-15-2012, 11:39 AM   #12267
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I have read all the talk of getting extra 12v power to run accessories, not to state the obvious but why not buy the extra accessories socket from Triumph, there's a plug under the seat for it? That's just me try to find and easier way to do it.
That'll do one accessory, what if you need more?
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Old 04-15-2012, 12:44 PM   #12268
Mercury264
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Originally Posted by ssevy View Post
WebBikeworld had a review of this one, which looks to match the orange tiger pretty closely:

I have an older Roof Boxer. I like it - not my main helmet, more my 'fucking around' on my Speed Triple helmet. Seems to be very good quality.
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Old 04-15-2012, 03:21 PM   #12269
Windy Rider
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That'll do one accessory, what if you need more?
Thanks bross, that answered my question, I was thinking GPS off the one next to the ignition and phone charger off the one under the seat the other way round.
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Old 04-15-2012, 04:05 PM   #12270
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Why is that?
Just good wiring practice. Everything should use its own ground. Shared ground wires cause problems. If the battery (-) is wired to the frame of the bike, a short jumper to the frame is all it takes. If you're wiring a bunch of things at once, making a "ground bus" works fine but tapping grounds is just asking for problems.
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