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Old 11-29-2010, 01:01 AM   #196
Padmei OP
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Looking good Padmei. I'm in awe of your skills & dedication to the project.
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Old 11-29-2010, 01:15 AM   #197
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Originally Posted by Padmei
Looking good Padmei. I'm in awe of your skills & dedication to the project.
Why thanks,that's very nice of you to say.

Since you're interested I'll share some thoughts.
I've been looking at old Dakar bikes & HPN new ones & I have to say they are geil.

The longer suspension models just transform the bikes to look very...ummm...geil

I would like to eventually get a new shock - Ohlins unfortunately are way too expensive for this tightwad so I've been researching Wilbers, Hagon & YSS. Hagon & YSS are pretty economical but I'm wondering what I'd achieve from a more sophisticated shock. I'm not really an adjustable type person - more set & forget. In fact if I had to adjust something I'd forget which way to turn it or what it did.

In my mind I'm thinking that a shock set to my weight ready for gravel oneup riding and the occasional knarly track would be a better idea. I don't think I'll ever be inspired to ride round the world two up with luggage or otherwise.

Maybe I'll look at a fork transplant at a later stage - more for looks than anything - those usders are... yep... geil.
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Old 11-29-2010, 01:20 AM   #198
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Just talk among yourself for a while
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Old 11-29-2010, 01:23 AM   #199
Padmei OP
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Shhhh Padmei ...... did you hear that?.... I think there's someone in here with us...
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Old 11-29-2010, 01:25 AM   #200
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Originally Posted by Padmei
Shhhh Padmei ...... did you hear that?.... I think there's someone in here with us...

BOO
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Old 11-29-2010, 01:41 AM   #201
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Padmei
I would like to eventually get a new shock - Ohlins unfortunately are way too expensive for this tightwad so I've been researching Wilbers, Hagon & YSS. Hagon & YSS are pretty economical but I'm wondering what I'd achieve from a more sophisticated shock. I'm not really an adjustable type person - more set & forget. In fact if I had to adjust something I'd forget which way to turn it or what it did.
I've had a couple of Hagons on G/S's. They keep the rear subframe off the rear wheel but thats about it. Go for a WIlbers or something where you can have some input into it's setup up front based on your riding style, weight, usage etc and can have the shock shimmed and sprung accordingly.
Even if it doesn't have all the twiddly knobs, which as you rightly alude to are mostly set once and forgotten, if the shock is setup for you it will make a huge difference.

You don't get that option with Hagon and they are pretty rudimentary shocks in their performance. Unless your shock is totally poked and you can't ride the bike I don't believe you would gain anything from one of those.
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Old 11-29-2010, 05:34 AM   #202
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Does anyone have a ballpark figure on a rebuild/revalve/respring for an Ohlins shock?
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Old 11-29-2010, 11:04 AM   #203
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Originally Posted by igormortis
Does anyone have a ballpark figure on a rebuild/revalve/respring for an Ohlins shock?
Mr Robert Taylor at CK technical would be able to tell you off the top of his head. He's the man.
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Old 11-29-2010, 11:07 AM   #204
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddieb
I've had a couple of Hagons on G/S's. They keep the rear subframe off the rear wheel but thats about it. Go for a WIlbers or something where you can have some input into it's setup up front based on your riding style, weight, usage etc and can have the shock shimmed and sprung accordingly.
Even if it doesn't have all the twiddly knobs, which as you rightly alude to are mostly set once and forgotten, if the shock is setup for you it will make a huge difference.

You don't get that option with Hagon and they are pretty rudimentary shocks in their performance. Unless your shock is totally poked and you can't ride the bike I don't believe you would gain anything from one of those.
Thanks Eddie. Anyone else had experience with any of these shocks?
Eventually I'd like to swap forks so maybe it would be a good time to buy before that expensive exercise.
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Old 11-29-2010, 12:27 PM   #205
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Think very carefully about what you do here. This will impact on the whole feel of the bike. What are you going to use it for? Not an area to bodge or skimp on. How much do you want to invest in the bike.

If you are thinking of replacing the front forks then you really need a plan. I was surprised at how good the (stock) front forks were. I haven't played with them at all. I am not sure that they really 'need' replacement.

The bike has some issues with ground clearance. A big spend on a shock means you will likely stay with the paralever. The paralever u-joints limit any further rise. Wisdom of hindsight I may have been better to think about a mono conversion, for simplicity & to ability to raise the height of the bike.

I bought the Ohlins on the basis that the driveshaft & FD pivot bearings had a fix. These fixes have proven not now to be the final solutions.

I had a Hagon on the Mono R100RS. Also have a friend with one on his R100GSPD. Best advice - don't bother. They make an okay replacement shock if yours is leaking, & you only ride on the road. I've seen reports of them breaking at top & bottom mounts, and leaking badly. They are thin wall bodies, and are just not robust enough for the (GS) bike.

There are also mixed reports on the YSS shocks, but are much better than the Hagon.

The Ohlins was built to my weight & riding specs, & is rebuildable. It performed well for the weekend straight out of the box. It didn't 'transform' the bike. We rode at speed along a bumpy trail on the 42nd, and I know my heels brushes the tops of some of the major corrugations (even with the high pegs), but it didn't give me any 'bottom outs'. It didn't lose its damping when it got a workout. We were fully loaded at one point. But I still likely need to tweak it a little.
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Old 11-30-2010, 12:06 AM   #206
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMWRSNUT
Think very carefully about what you do here.



I bought the Ohlins on the basis that the driveshaft & FD pivot bearings had a fix. These fixes have proven not now to be the final solutions.
Good call Steve. I do read too many bike rebuild threads & get all fired up. I'm not after too much performance wise but the airheads do look good with some nice looking forks on.

Would your ohlins handle the treatment I give to the KLR?

I guess what's going thru my head is i'd love my GS to do what the KLR can do. I already know it will truck up hills a lot easier as i've gone up slippery bits on Schmidtty the KLR wouldn't find purchase on. If I could get it to a point where it was comparable to Gonzo I'd be more than happy.

Just breifly what do you mean re the driveshaft & final drive vs the mono?
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Old 11-30-2010, 12:44 AM   #207
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Padmei
I'm not after too much performance wise but the airheads do look good with some nice looking forks on.

Would your ohlins handle the treatment I give to the KLR?

I guess what's going thru my head is i'd love my GS to do what the KLR can do. If I could get it to a point where it was comparable to Gonzo I'd be more than happy.

Just breifly what do you mean re the driveshaft & final drive vs the mono?
Mark S & I were discussing exactly this during the weekend. Do the airhead really need the USD front end? Or is it really a little for posseurs? Of course he might have been making a play for the YZ forks for his KLR...

The (uncorked big bore) KLR & GS are already really quite similar in power output. They'll go similar places. The GS loses on some ground clearance & also weight (albeit that its weight is held very low). It gains on on-road comfort (assuming the seat /peg relationship is fixed), ability to cart pillions, & torque (especially good at tractoring up hills).

The standard mono driveshaft only has one u-joint. The swingarm is also 50mm shorter than the paralever (which makes it more twitchy). It has a less extreme angle between transmission & FD (?), which means that the driveshaft has a reputation for going on forever. It has more final drive options because all mono FDs fit.

The mono swingarms are extended 50 or 100m to give more stability, and also the ability to increase ground clearance. But uphill the mono stiffens up under power, & isn't compliant just when you need it.

The Paralever U-Joints have a reputation for wearing quickly, especially if the FD splines aren't kept lubed (40k km replacement seems to be bandied around a lot). The FD pivot bearings also flog out - they don't seem as (big or) robust as they should be. Overall the initial iteration of the Paralever is seen by some as being a design failure by BMW. Look at modified / HPN bikes. Many either go back to mono (extended), or go to the better R1100GS Paralever (where BMW had an opportunity to remedy issues experienced with the R100GS paralever).

I accepted the issues with the Paralever because I considered the bike overall a better base than the G/S, & because:
  • The rebuildable driveshaft seemed to address some of the Paralever issues, mainly by offering grease nipples to allow you to lube the U-joint bearings, rather than the OEM driveshaft with sealed for life bearings, which you couldn't service or easily replace.
  • There was also a bushing being sold by a BMW Guru to replace the Pivot bearings. However that bushing is now considered by some buyers to be junk.
Oh well, I've bought the Ohlins - I'm a bit committed there.
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Old 11-30-2010, 02:02 AM   #208
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Quote:
Originally Posted by igormortis
Does anyone have a ballpark figure on a rebuild/revalve/respring for an Ohlins shock?
Bit of an open-ended question. 2 years ago I was quoted $700 to re-valve and re-spring both ends of the KTM (WP). Pretty reasonable I thought.

On the Ohlins stuff with Dr Robert... Last service I had done a couple of years ago was near $250 including shipping, but included a couple of minor replacement parts. Previous services cost more like $150 shipped.

During a service minor valving changes can be made, often at no cost, especially if he already has data. A custom job would likely cost some labour to develop. If you buy the shock from him, he will usually swap springs gratis. And also will ship it with the correct (best guess) spring to start with, ditto valving. That is his value-add.

Full rebuild? Well some years ago (ok 10) I bought a used Ohlins for my Honda NX650 Dominator. Paid $200 for it sight unseen and it was completely and utterly fcuked. Cost $600 for Dr Robert to do a full rebuild on it, replaced virtually every internal part, and included a new spring and bottom end-eye. Those latter two bits were free, as he had a row of them on the shelf that were standard parts in Suzuki road race bikes he'd just upgraded, he was never going to shift them otherwise. Commonality of parts across the range can be an advantage. All up $800 for an as-new shock instead of $1600. Transformed the bike.
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Old 11-30-2010, 03:20 AM   #209
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Thanks Colin.

I've myself gone over the same arguments that Steve mentioned re. the paralever. I'd convinced myself I'd live with the relative shortcomings because overall I believed it a better bike. My GS came with an Ohlins shock which will need rebuilding, revalving and respringing, I'm sure.

Now I'm having second thoughts and pondering replacing the para with a mono.

I either spend big money for mono piece of mind and mono pose/cool factor (including new Ohlins) or I spend slightly less big money and give the para a recon'd driveshaft, new bearings and a rebuilt shock.

My instinct says screw the naysayers with the latter and have fun with the damn thing. But something still nags... Time for another airhead build thread methinks.
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Old 11-30-2010, 10:54 AM   #210
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Thanks for taking the time to explain Steve. What do you mean by stiffinging up under power? It won't get traction? The suspension bounces?

So if you are contemplating going mono you'd be on the lookout for an old ST wreck or similar? There was a good looking bolt on extension kit on a thread I was reading the other day - can't remember where.

It's funny how propaganda works - I was blissfully unaware of the distinction between mono & para coolness, thinking airheads were the height of coolness. Now there's a class within a class

Now I'm thinking i'll have to get a mono to be cool
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