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Old 03-10-2011, 05:01 PM   #226
DRONE
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xymotic View Post
I haven't looked at drone's file yet, but I'm thinking that the WABDR might have a few segments that are routed off road (point to point). Can anybody confirm if that's correct?
Not according to the maps I'm using. With both City Navigator 2009 and Topo U.S. 2008, all the waypoints on the WABDR are within 100 feet of a road. If you've ever used a GPS to follow a Forest Service road, then you know that 100 feet is pretty much a bullseye when you're out there in the woods. It's not like you're in the city anymore. If you're riding down a road, and your GPS says you're riding through the woods 100 feet from a road, then you can be pretty sure that there are not two roads 100 feet apart, or that your road has "migrated" 100 feet! No--you're on the road alright.
This pic that Iain posted shows that I was wrong in the above post. You can clearly see that there is a point-to-point section where the route crosses the creek. No road there in City Navigator. Good call, Xymotic! I guess I just didn't zoom in far enough. That certainly explains part of the mystery.

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Old 03-10-2011, 05:25 PM   #227
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point to point confusion on toats coulee crick

I'm 5th generation up here and I've been playing in these woods my whole life. I know these roads.

That "point to point" blue route is correct. It is a big road, and its newer (within the last 5 or 10 years). It isn't on the Forest Service or State maps, but its there.

There is a bridge where it crosses the stream.

The blue road also has a nice photo oportunity... there is a boulder the size of a house that is split down the middle and you can walk down through the rock. You can also climb the rock and jump the crack to get on top, makes a great picture.

The pink route was closed down some time ago because they were worried about sediment (dust) getting into the creek from the road. That is when the built the "blue road". So the pink road won't let you hook up with toats coulee and on to 14 mile/ chopaka lake etc.

Hope to meet up with some of you guys out there!

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This pic that Iain posted shows that I was wrong in the above post. You can clearly see that there is a point-to-point section where the route crosses the creek. No road there in City Navigator. Good call, Xymotic! I guess I just didn't zoom in far enough. That certainly explains part of the mystery.

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Old 03-10-2011, 06:00 PM   #228
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I'm 5th generation up here and I've been playing in these woods my whole life. I know these roads.

That "point to point" blue route is correct. It is a big road, and its newer (within the last 5 or 10 years). It isn't on the Forest Service or State maps, but its there.

There is a bridge where it crosses the stream.

The blue road also has a nice photo oportunity... there is a boulder the size of a house that is split down the middle and you can walk down through the rock. You can also climb the rock and jump the crack to get on top, makes a great picture.

The pink route was closed down some time ago because they were worried about sediment (dust) getting into the creek from the road. That is when the built the "blue road". So the pink road won't let you hook up with toats coulee and on to 14 mile/ chopaka lake etc.

Hope to meet up with some of you guys out there!

Thanks for that feedback! It's great to have local knowledge for routes like this.

That is proof that when the GPS is relying on it's road data (rather than recorded track logs), if it isn't 100% perfect the route won't work right.
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Old 03-10-2011, 06:01 PM   #229
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Edit - I forgot to add, thanks for the modification around the lake from Hwy 12. I am going to use your modification when I ride WABDR.
Iain,
When are you going?

Dave S and myself are planning end of July.
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Old 03-11-2011, 10:52 AM   #230
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Hey Jason, I will probably be riding some time in August when work slows down a little. Mid July is the best time to do it in my opinion becuase its the best combination of good weather and light dust with little chance of snow on the high passes.
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Old 03-11-2011, 09:16 PM   #231
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Looking for Adventurers

Two weeks August 21st through Labor Day Sept. 5

Looking at riding from:

Madras, OR to southern start of WABDR
Oroville Wa (end of WABDR) Across northern WA or Southern BC to:
Tour of Idaho from Upper Priest Lake to Challis
Challis, ID to Weiser ID.
Weiser ID to Unity, OR
OBCDR from Unity to Prineville. then home

I'm working on my connecting routes now.

Trying to avoid pavement as much as possible, motel about every 4th night or so. I like to not plan my evening stops so I don't have to be anywhere at any specific time, just ride until we feel like stopping.

Looking for 1-3 other riders who may be interested.

I ride a DR350SE and did the ride in my sig line last year about the same time.
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Old 03-11-2011, 09:49 PM   #232
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The routes I created from the WBDR tracks were done in Basecamp. From my understanding Basecamp assumes you are on foot and so the route is point to point and doesn't necessarily follow established streets. This is what the route looks like when I pull it into Mapsource, and this is also what it looks like on my Nuvi 500 in off-road navigation mode.

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Old 03-11-2011, 10:05 PM   #233
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I was able to use my Garmin Quest2 for the Montana 1k last year.

Here's some info on it.
https://sites.google.com/site/mt1k20...current-routes

I also had it loaded onto a flash drive for use in my netbook.

OBTW, I will proabably be joining in on the ride at the end of July after the Montana 1k-version 2 and WestFest.

Storage space is not an issue with the Muell. Too bad it can't be hacked.

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Old 03-12-2011, 07:58 AM   #234
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Laugh The Muell looks great!

Don't know if I've seen it with those panniers on. You didn't have them on at WestFet 2010, did you?

I'll have to get a shot of Precious with the HT panniers and the Pelican case installed. NOW all I have to do is learn how to ride it properly in the dirt! But if other OF's can do it, so can I.

So you're planning on MT1000, WestFest, then WABDR. Impressive! I hope to get in Expo Rallye and attend the Rawhyde Adventure riding class, then jump into WABDR on 7/31. Hope to run into you somewhere along the trail Brian.
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Old 03-12-2011, 08:21 AM   #235
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Had the Gobi's at WF. Have now gone to a much leaner, lighter set-up with Wolfman Expeditions. I may also be doing Wetfest in Bend, OR, time and $$$ permitting.
See you out there
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Old 03-13-2011, 03:20 PM   #236
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Connecting WABDR to Tour of Idaho

Here's my thoughts for connecting the WABDR with the Tour of Idaho.

All you Washington riders, let me know if you see any issues with this route.

Thanks


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Old 03-14-2011, 02:47 PM   #237
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WABDR on Urals

Mr. Cob,

Sorry that I missed this post. I thought I was getting all posts thru my emails but missed some so I discovered this by going back a few pages in this thread.

I am not offended by your comments at all. I'm actually excited for people to ride this route in Urals. Timmer was correct that I think the entire WABDR initial team would agree that this can be ridden by Urals. There are a few sections that will provide you challenges but hey that's part of the fun. The section from the Wenas Valley that climbs up to the top of Umtanum ridge is steep and loose in a few places and off camber in places too. On my bike it provided me a few scary moments but I made it clean - it's not terrible. On the summit of the ridge there is one other challenging spot with a steep left curving road that just happens to be loose and rocky on the approach and has a big root as you are turning at the top. It bounced my FJ Cruiser all over the place, but 2 wheeled bikes can pass this obstacle by keeping up momentum and rolling thru on the high side (right side). On a Ural it might be interesting. This point is shown on the Butler map.

You'll need to take your time through the deep rutted section of road 325 on Bethel Ridge but the Ural will make it no prob. Part of the road in that area is rocky as well but again passable (very fun and very scenic too).

The overgrown section approaching Lake Chelan might be tough as the small trees could get caught up in the middle of your rig but again slower speeds will probably make this a non-issue. The section before the "jungle" is very exposed too. Be careful there.

You'll see in the movie that I'm good at running my panniers into stuff (did so 3 times) so having an extra wide side would be hard on me but then again I probably wouldn't be riding as hard and fast as I did with just 2 wheels. My comment for not wanting to do it on a Ural are purely mine. All bypass sections are shown on the Bulter map and they are very easy sections (boring in comparison to the main route though). If someone is not experienced in riding a Ural (like I am not) then they might want to consider those "boring" sections to be safe.

-Bryce


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Howdy SeattleTrails,

I don't know you, to my knowledge I have never met you or rode with you, I don't know if you have any Ural riding experience or have ridden with Ural's in the dual sport environment, that being the case what follows is NOT to be taken personal, its a request for information.

You stated in an earlier post that you wouldn't take a Ural on this ride, I watched all of the videos you posted and unless the grades are much steeper then they appear in the video and I know that this can happen, or you didn't include film of the nasty sections of the route I didn't see anything that a Ural shouldn't be able to do. I have ridden my Ural in the Dirty Face Dual Sport Rally a couple of times, I have ridden it in the Black Dog Dual Sport Rally for the last five years, have ridden it OVER Mengel Pass in Death Valley, have ridden it in Moab and many other places most folks consider impossible for the Ural.

That being the case I am asking this question in all seriousness, do you honestly think that it is un-wise to take a Ural on this dual sport ride? I do NOT want to go on this ride if it is honestly unsafe or if doing so would pose a burden for others that we may ride with; on the other hand it looks like it would be a lot of fun.

My plan if I and other Ural riders do this is to HAVE FUN and NOT be in a race, I would rather take six days to do this and enjoy the ride, the views, the camp fire and the camaraderie of others rather then dash from one end to the other and miss the beauty of the area and photo opportunities the ride will present.
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Old 03-14-2011, 03:09 PM   #238
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Originally Posted by SeattleTrails View Post
Mr. Cob,

Sorry that I missed this post. I thought I was getting all posts thru my emails but missed some so I discovered this by going back a few pages in this thread.

I am not offended by your comments at all. I'm actually excited for people to ride this route in Urals. Timmer was correct that I think the entire WABDR initial team would agree that this can be ridden by Urals. There are a few sections that will provide you challenges but hey that's part of the fun. The section from the Wenas Valley that climbs up to the top of Umtanum ridge is steep and loose in a few places and off camber in places too. On my bike it provided me a few scary moments but I made it clean - it's not terrible. On the summit of the ridge there is one other challenging spot with a steep left curving road that just happens to be loose and rocky on the approach and has a big root as you are turning at the top. It bounced my FJ Cruiser all over the place, but 2 wheeled bikes can pass this obstacle by keeping up momentum and rolling thru on the high side (right side). On a Ural it might be interesting. This point is shown on the Butler map.

You'll need to take your time through the deep rutted section of road 325 on Bethel Ridge but the Ural will make it no prob. Part of the road in that area is rocky as well but again passable (very fun and very scenic too).

The overgrown section approaching Lake Chelan might be tough as the small trees could get caught up in the middle of your rig but again slower speeds will probably make this a non-issue. The section before the "jungle" is very exposed too. Be careful there.

You'll see in the movie that I'm good at running my panniers into stuff (did so 3 times) so having an extra wide side would be hard on me but then again I probably wouldn't be riding as hard and fast as I did with just 2 wheels. My comment for not wanting to do it on a Ural are purely mine. All bypass sections are shown on the Bulter map and they are very easy sections (boring in comparison to the main route though). If someone is not experienced in riding a Ural (like I am not) then they might want to consider those "boring" sections to be safe.

-Bryce
Howdy Bryce,

Thanks for this information. Information like this is what was needed, the only way the Ural's can get up some of the steeper grades is to ATTACK the grade and DON'T slow down, this being the case if it was difficult for two wheeled bikes it would be fool hardy to attempt such a grade with the Ural and using the by-pass would be not only the wise but safe choice. I enjoy a challenge but there is a line between reasonable challenge and ignorant bravado.

The off camber areas you speak of, as the sidecar is on the "right" side of the bike would the slope put the sidecar "UP" or "down" slope? If it puts the sidecar up slope from the bike this is NOT good as it invites tipping the rig over, if it places the sidecar down slope unless its extreme it usually doesn't pose a problem. The section that is "exposed" ( for the record I HATE riding along the edge of cliffs ) is it wide enough for regular Jeep type vehicles, is it off chamber, is it steeply up hill, is the surface loose? Any further information you can share will be appreciated, thanks.
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Old 03-14-2011, 03:45 PM   #239
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Originally Posted by 88NX250 View Post
Hey Jason, I will probably be riding some time in August when work slows down a little. Mid July is the best time to do it in my opinion becuase its the best combination of good weather and light dust with little chance of snow on the high passes.
Cool...

Hey as a thought if you are not already thinking it...maybe you guys could put together a little talk/show etc....at the NW Adventure camp?

It would be great to go over the map with Paul, Tom and whoever one time before we head out in July.
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Old 03-14-2011, 04:13 PM   #240
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Dave,

I'll be glad to escort you around the difficult areas.

Tim

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Cob View Post
Howdy Bryce,

Thanks for this information. Information like this is what was needed, the only way the Ural's can get up some of the steeper grades is to ATTACK the grade and DON'T slow down, this being the case if it was difficult for two wheeled bikes it would be fool hardy to attempt such a grade with the Ural and using the by-pass would be not only the wise but safe choice. I enjoy a challenge but there is a line between reasonable challenge and ignorant bravado.

The off camber areas you speak of, as the sidecar is on the "right" side of the bike would the slope put the sidecar "UP" or "down" slope? If it puts the sidecar up slope from the bike this is NOT good as it invites tipping the rig over, if it places the sidecar down slope unless its extreme it usually doesn't pose a problem. The section that is "exposed" ( for the record I HATE riding along the edge of cliffs ) is it wide enough for regular Jeep type vehicles, is it off chamber, is it steeply up hill, is the surface loose? Any further information you can share will be appreciated, thanks.
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