Need help picking a Vintage MX bike for racing.

[larryboy]

Originally Posted by nachtflug

he's 6'6, 270 pounds...

That's why I was suggesting open classers. He isn't gonna be happy on anything under a peppy 465.

[stainlesscycle]

definitely not a 125... he'd be running it like a weedeater! you can learn lotsa skills with a 125 though... wot and clutch like crazy. burning up clutches and pistons every other race.

yz465 makes maybe 42-45 hp. about the same as a cr250 of the same era. yz465 is not the greatest example of a big bore 2 stroke (not syaing it was a bad bike, just different than many big bore 2t's) - it was not a big torque motor - much more hit/violent to ride.


if you want torque and hp the can-am 500 is the way to go. but you'd spend a ton on suspension and brakes to make them work...


overall any of the 250+ 2 strokes will make enough power to haul a 270lb beginner around....it's all in how you utilize the power...

here's a dude that's crazy fast on a 125...(modern..)

[Garthe]

Here is my concern about the 250 or 400/480/490 thing.

I think that too much power is not my friend...especally if it is a on/off power. I've ridden bikes like that and they make me feel like a stupid ass. I just don't know how to control it. I've been spoiled by four stroke smooth power. If I HAD to deal with that on/off thing, than a 250 makes more since to me...why would I need MORE power that I don't know what to do with.

Now, I've been told by others that 'some' of the open class bike have a great low and mid power band. My buddy that has experience is racing these vintage open class bikes, tells me that those bikes would be the best for me due to them being similar in power delivery to my XR 650 R.

This 250 or 400 class bike is one of the hardest decisions that I have to make.

Right now, I'm leaning toward either a Honda 250 or 480 OR Maico 250 or 490.

Thanks again guys for all your help. I'd really be lost without your input...Jim

[stainlesscycle]

in mx, smooth power is not really optimal. you need to explode out of corners. it's not like the woods where you end up off the trail if you goose it too much...


i think you'd be happier with the cr's.. the maico will be a moneypit (not saying that's a bad thing...) + the 89 cr will be significantly better than any maico.. the cr480 is 2 year only.... the cr250 will be easier to get parts for...

[Garthe]

Good point on power and turning...I think like a off roader. The Honda 480 that I was thinking about was a 1983..

The money pit with the maico doesn't bother me. ALL my bikes are that way
I like building, playing with them. I'll do the same thing with a Honda ...

[Thumpermeister]

Originally Posted by anotherguy

Honestly I had that model as a Triumph in '75. The bung plug on the tank still said BSA as did a few other parts. Hmmmmmm..................oh yeah Triumph called it The Avenger...........I think??????

As noted that's Jeff Smith on a BSA Goldstar scrambler.
That's about as classic as classic racers come... and were used for every thing from MX to dirt track, roadracing and trials as bikes tended to back then.
They ceased production in 1963 and were never sold as a Triumph! Some of the later unit-construction singles shared different name plates however.

[stainlesscycle]

Originally Posted by Garthe

Good point on power and turning...I think like a off roader. The Honda 480 that I was thinking about was a 1983..

The money pit with the maico doesn't bother me. ALL my bikes are that way
I like building, playing with them. I'll do the same thing with a Honda ...

it helps if you think like this. classes are 78 to 89. they just put 1978-1983 in there for the hell of it. you want the very last of the model years that are legal for the class. the best of 1987-1989.... in vintage bikes, the years matter. there was a lot of technology and money going into improving mx bikes at the time. a 1989 cr250 is worlds beyond a 1978 or 1983 cr250. think about it this way, in 1980 the cr250 was still twin shock. in 1983 they were really figuring out monoshock. by 1989 they kinda had it down.

[Thumpermeister]

Originally Posted by Garthe

* I've ridden 4 strokes all my life, but, I'm open to trying a 2 stroke.

* I am a Honda guy, so if the first bike could be a Ride Red bike that would be a plus...but, I'm willing to consider other brands... I've been looking at Maico's. I was looking at Honda CR 250's, what do you guys think of that bike. The Maico 400, 440 and 490's caught my eye as well.

Something to remember about racing vintage bikes is that they are a passion full of highs and lows...and not a logical choice by most standards! Ride the machine and class you are most interested and passionate about (two or four stroke) to keep you motivated through those "lows"! An open class bike is a great choice for a larger rider and often offers an advantage in maintenance and durability...but there are many to chose from as noted here!

[Garthe]

Originally Posted by stainlesscycle

it helps if you think like this. classes are 78 to 89. they just put 1978-1983 in there for the hell of it. you want the very last of the model years that are legal for the class. the best of 1987-1989.... in vintage bikes, the years matter. there was a lot of technology and money going into improving mx bikes at the time. a 1989 cr250 is worlds beyond a 1978 or 1983 cr250. think about it this way, in 1980 the cr250 was still twin shock. in 1983 they were really figuring out monoshock. by 1989 they kinda had it down.

Classes for AVDRA, link... http://avdra.com/classes.html


All below classes are listed as either 125 OR OPEN class.


GP2 78-81

GP3 82-84

GP4 84-89



So, my twisted logic of SC thoughts are...

OLD SCHOOL choice...1981...really cool looking bikes...technology...not so much

NEW OLD SCHOOL choice...1989...cool looking bikes...technology...much better



This is such a hard choice...

[Garthe]

Originally Posted by Thumpermeister

Something to remember about racing vintage bikes is that they are a passion full of highs and lows...and not a logical choice by most standards! Ride the machine and class you are most interested and passionate about (two or four stroke) to keep you motivated through those "lows"!

VERY wise statements...

Which is why this is such a hard choice for me...old school...or...new old school.

[stainlesscycle]

also, you need to consider what you think your body can handle... suspension is everything....

i'm 41 and regularly race 7"/4" suspension stuff and it can be brutal. it's nice to jump on a modern bike after that..

and you need to be happy with your choice. i have not researched much mx bikes post 1983-ish, so i'm not 100% on who was clearly ahead technology/handling/power wise in that era. now if you were looking for pre-83 or pre-77 cross country bikes that's easy, as there are some bikes that were clearly ahead of everyone else.....

[Garthe]

Originally Posted by stainlesscycle

also, you need to consider what you think your body can handle... suspension is everything....

i'm 41 and regularly race 7"/4" suspension stuff and it can be brutal. it's nice to jump on a modern bike after that..

and you need to be happy with your choice. i have not researched much mx bikes post 1983-ish, so i'm not 100% on who was clearly ahead technology/handling/power wise in that era. now if you were looking for pre-83 or pre-77 cross country bikes that's easy, as there are some bikes that were clearly ahead of everyone else.....

My body at 48 years old and being in construction...is starting to show signs of issues (lower back, knees).

That is why (suspension wise), of the 1981 bikes, I am attracted to the Maico's. They seemed to be ahead of their time as suspension goes...AND because of my physical size (6'6") would seem to have a better chance of fitting me...

I could NEVER ride the class bikes you do...you could give me one of them and it still wouldn't happen. I would need surgery after that ride...

[Garthe]

Originally Posted by stainlesscycle

now if you were looking for pre-83 (EDIT MX bikes) bikes that's easy, as there are some bikes that were clearly ahead of everyone else.....

I replaced CC with MX...what are your thoughts...?

[stainlesscycle]

i'm a cross country guy (none of these would i pick for cross country...). but off the top of my head:

the 83 cr480 was good handling and good low-mid power. drum brakes. don't know if the 480 had detonation issues...

the 83 yz250 had the best front drum brake going. first year water cooled i think.

the 82/83 kx250 had a disc brake...

the 83 cr250 is super desirable, and one of the best out there. parts can be tough/expensive.

he 83 rm250 was water cooled, but drum brakes. the 82 rm250 was better power wise.

[Garthe]

the research continues...Thanks