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Old 06-07-2011, 08:22 AM   #286
Charla OP
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Originally Posted by DirtySantana View Post
When is your next compitition, maybe we can make a weekend of it or something?
July 10th is our next Moto trials event but I'm sure we'll be riding sometime before then. I tend to not be too interested in the bicycle when the opportunity to ride motos is there.
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Old 06-07-2011, 08:24 AM   #287
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Trackstands are great to learn balance... But don't worry about hopping and nose pivots for a while. I would encourage new riders to learn no to slow speed bike control and pedaling (rolling) through a section for a quite while. As a beginner, there's no need to hop or try to backwheel through obstacles.. New riders often put the cart before the horse learning tricks before they master basic biketrial skills, and then get lost and stalled when they try to move up. You can't build the house before you finish the foundation.
If competition is in your son's future, I'd suggest going to a lumberyard or hardware store and getting some red and blue surveyor's ribbon, and laying out sections the same way that he's likely to encounter at an actual trial. It doesn't need to have any serious "ups" or obstacles... Just tight turns and opportunities to use basic bike control skills (ie braking, pedaling through tight areas, picking lines, navagating through and / or around loose rocks) and getting used to reading the section prior to riding. Get him in the mud, and let him learn how to carry momentum and find traction. Small logs need to be taken without a second thought before he'll need to trouble himself with getting over a 3 footer.
Try to get him used to the idea that the ribbons are pretty fragile and if he breaks one, he's done... Also, it'll get him used to the idea of "right on red, blue on left" and it'll prevent him from getting "lost" in a section.
I used to marvel at kids who would freak out when riding between the ribbons and course markers and drop a 5 just because their head overheated while in a section. They rode more difficult obstacles on the loop between sections and didn't think a thing about it because they weren't "In the section" and there wasn't a checker there with his hand up...
In the beginning, there's no real need to spend big $$$ on a specialized trials bicycle... You can go a long way on a BMX bike with a small front chainring, some decent brakes and some fat tires. Same goes for 26"... loose the outside chainring, use the middle one for a rockring and ride on the inside gear.. And try to get a short cage derailleur, or you can eliminate it all together.. At first, there's little need for more than one gear, anyway.
If you want really good rim brakes, you can grind the brake tracks on the rims for some serious grab.. Kinda hard on pads, but a lot cheaper than getting a frame and fork that's disk compatable or messing around with hydros. A set of nice thick sidewall tires (2 " front and a 2.35 rear) and you should be good to go from beginner through intermediate with out spending much at all.
I've read alot of discussion in this thread about this bike and that, and I'm gonna say the obvious... You can't buy success in trials. Take what you've got, set it up right and practice, practice, practice.
When you get to the point that you think that the bike is what's holding holding you back, ride it another 3 months and then go shopping for a 17 pound wunderbike.
Have fun, and remember.... chicks dig scars.
Thanks for the great input Ed.

Practice is definitely where it's at, I haven't been doing enough of it lately.
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Old 06-07-2011, 08:26 AM   #288
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July 10th is our next Moto trials event but I'm sure we'll be riding sometime before then. I tend to not be too interested in the bicycle when the opportunity to ride motos is there.
Same here. Maybe the moto trials instead?
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Old 06-07-2011, 11:35 AM   #289
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My son retired from National Competition in 02 after he came home from the BIU worlds ( he rode and won the one and only event he went to in "06, in Baltimore, I believe), but he pulled some strings and schwagged a new bike from Tarty bikes last year.. And this year, he's messing around riding brakeless.. He trials rides a couple times a week and does about 20 or more miles a week on his mountain bike to shape up for the Mototrials Nationals.

Practice pays off.
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Old 06-08-2011, 06:59 AM   #290
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Hey ArticEd, what is your son's name? That's awesome he got a bike free from Tarty. He should go to the Raccoon Rally coming soon up there in the NE, PA I think.

Yes, trackstanding is the foundation of trials balance, I agree. But to not want to hop your front wheel and rear wheel or roll over obstacles is like saying don't ride it. Blending balance skills should include a variety of riding as well as track standing. Otherwise you will be bored to death and lose interests.

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Old 06-08-2011, 07:29 AM   #291
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Originally Posted by AteamNM View Post
trackstanding is the foundation of trials balance, I agree. But to not want to hop your front wheel and rear wheel or roll over obstacles is like saying don't ride it. Blending balance skills should include a variety of riding as well as track standing. Otherwise you will be bored to death and lose interests.

well that and the way i balance is to move the bike around some. so i have to hop
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Old 06-08-2011, 08:48 AM   #292
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What would be the best way to go for a beginner mod or stock?
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Old 06-08-2011, 11:25 AM   #293
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Originally Posted by AteamNM View Post
Hey ArticEd, what is your son's name? That's awesome he got a bike free from Tarty. He should go to the Raccoon Rally coming soon up there in the NE, PA I think.

Yes, trackstanding is the foundation of trials balance, I agree. But to not want to hop your front wheel and rear wheel or roll over obstacles is like saying don't ride it. Blending balance skills should include a variety of riding as well as track standing. Otherwise you will be bored to death and lose interests.

JJ Gregorowicz... Google it, or check my post in the Trials Video thread on this forum.

The Racoon Rally is held in Salamanca NY, I believe. Rocks the size of houses.. Literally.

As for hopping, I never said that it wasn't necessary... I simply stated that before a rider worries about learning to do tricks and more advanced stuff, they should focus on developing solid basic bike handling skills. A big part of the reason that Biketrial competitions are few and far between now compared to when we were involved is that it's gone urban... New riders concentrate on learning to get onto the biggest obstacle that they can find, and are GOOD at it, but then go to to a comp and 5 everything because while they were capable of conquering some huge up, they couldn't get through the rest of the section in 2 minutes or they go outside the boundary because they couldnt make a slick downhill turn. Good riders, but they get disheartened because they can jap zap a 4 foot ledge but still end the day without a clean anywhere... So they get frustrated and quit, and eventually the venue doesn't have bicycle trials anymore because there's no rider turn out.
As I stated, over the years I've seen loads of riders who spent so much time refining advanced skills and trying big moves that they neglected to learn how to ride simple stuff. A dab is a dab, no matter what you're doing when you get it. I know that the basics are boring to practice, but if you want to do something really well, you have to wanna do it real bad.....

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Old 06-08-2011, 11:34 AM   #294
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Originally Posted by DirtySantana View Post
What would be the best way to go for a beginner mod or stock?
I would say that that depends on budget and body size (age?)
An adult can get started on a stockbike really cheaply and go a long way before he NEEDS to upgrade to trial specific equipment.
For a youngster, say 7- 11, I'd suggest a mod bike or modified BMX frame. By virtue of the compact size and lighter weight, it's safer and easier for a little guy (or girl) to control. Less mass, less stand over height, less chance of a sketchy dab going way bad.
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Old 06-08-2011, 02:35 PM   #295
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As I stated, over the years I've seen loads of riders who spent so much time refining advanced skills and trying big moves that they neglected to learn how to ride simple stuff. A dab is a dab, no matter what you're doing when you get it. I know that the basics are boring to practice, but if you want to do something really well, you have to wanna do it real bad.....
This is a common scenario in moto-trials too.
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Old 06-09-2011, 11:07 AM   #296
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Who are the American brand of trials bikes? Are there any? Seems that Europe and Canada are big in this game but I'm not very educated in this style of bike?
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Old 06-10-2011, 02:07 PM   #297
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Hello,...anybody in there order a Echo trials bike...................................HELLOOOOOOO OOO
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Old 06-11-2011, 07:59 AM   #298
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Originally Posted by DirtySantana View Post
Who are the American brand of trials bikes? Are there any? Seems that Europe and Canada are big in this game but I'm not very educated in this style of bike?
Not really, Meta produces a bike out of Toronto but me thinks the frame is made in China, but not sure. Monty, Koxx (France), Inspired (UK) and Rockman are independent manufactures and also maybe Bionic - I think. The rest of the frames are made by Deng in Hong Kong. This includes off the top of my head - Echo/Zoo, ZHI, Adamant, Onza, GU, Neon, Yabba, Born and likely a few others.

There are 2 very well known frame builders in the USA - Frank The Welder = WTF frames and RCP Fabrications. RCP is making a serious run at the trials market by building custom frames based on your specifications. There is also Marino that are made in Peru. Out of business now is Simtra that were actually fabricated in Canada and Planet X which was Australia.

As for the top world cup, the main brands seems to be Koxx and Monty. Ryan Young is selling Monty mods at @ $2300 however the rumors about Monty is they are not designing anything new and many say their components are sheeeet. Monty makes everything from bars to cranks, I think this is a mistake. Koxx frames are way out there in costs as well. Rockman is also very expensive and they have struggled with some frame cracking issues in the past due to very little research & testing. Plus the China frames generally are made out of American beer cans, very thin and light.

As for components - there are many brands now to choose from, no longer are trials riders using heavy duty down hill components. Echo of course makes many components, Trialtech is awesome and Tryall. Gavin Hertritch has red Bionic cranks on his Echo mod and they look so bling and there are many other sub components; Tensile, Hope, Magura (brakes), Chris King (hubs and headsets) and a huge selection of tires but are now very trials specific and also specific to urban or natural (natty) riding.

My bike is a Meta, I have a Meta stem with Trialtech high riser bars & Echo pressed headset. Magura Hs33 rear hydraulic brake with TNN aluminum backings and LGM pads, Echo half brake booster. Front brake is a Magura BB7 mechanical disc brake, with an Avid G2 Clean Sweep rotor, Jaguar cable housing and Shimano XTR cables and a Shimano XTR lever. Cranks are Trialtech with Premium magnesium platform pedals, Trialtech bottom bracket (BB) with a White Industries front free wheel (FFW). Tensile chain tensioner due to vertical drop outs with a KMC Kool chain. Wheels, Trialtech rims with Echo hubs and DT Swiss spokes, red anodized nipples, running Maxxis Minion on the back and a DT Maxxis Larson on the front. Tryall lock on grips and Echo brake mounts on the rear with miscellaneous anodized and Ti bolts. The point is the only thing that remains stock on my bike is the frame and the stem, everything else has been slowly replaced. My wish list is to install a Echo SL 108 FFW, Hope rear hub, Tryall TryHole front rim and a Hope Mono Trials front brake. Maybe replace the stem for a Trailtech forged.

Sorry for the long winded Saturday morning post, just thought it is interesting information.
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Old 06-11-2011, 12:58 PM   #299
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Very informative. Have to see this bike build up you have, you should post a pic or two.

I reached out to Meta but they are sold out for the 2011 year. They told me only 100 trial frames this year. I'm a cycling industry insider so I'm fishing for a pro deal with them. They told me that they maybe able to help me with getting something from Asia.

I recognize quite a few of the Chinese brands you mentioned, Echo/Zoo, ZHI, Onza, Neon. Seems that many folks ride these very bikes.

Thanks for the info.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AteamNM View Post
Not really, Meta produces a bike out of Toronto but me thinks the frame is made in China, but not sure. Monty, Koxx (France), Inspired (UK) and Rockman are independent manufactures and also maybe Bionic - I think. The rest of the frames are made by Deng in Hong Kong. This includes off the top of my head - Echo/Zoo, ZHI, Adamant, Onza, GU, Neon, Yabba, Born and likely a few others.

There are 2 very well known frame builders in the USA - Frank The Welder = WTF frames and RCP Fabrications. RCP is making a serious run at the trials market by building custom frames based on your specifications. There is also Marino that are made in Peru. Out of business now is Simtra that were actually fabricated in Canada and Planet X which was Australia.

As for the top world cup, the main brands seems to be Koxx and Monty. Ryan Young is selling Monty mods at @ $2300 however the rumors about Monty is they are not designing anything new and many say their components are sheeeet. Monty makes everything from bars to cranks, I think this is a mistake. Koxx frames are way out there in costs as well. Rockman is also very expensive and they have struggled with some frame cracking issues in the past due to very little research & testing. Plus the China frames generally are made out of American beer cans, very thin and light.

As for components - there are many brands now to choose from, no longer are trials riders using heavy duty down hill components. Echo of course makes many components, Trialtech is awesome and Tryall. Gavin Hertritch has red Bionic cranks on his Echo mod and they look so bling and there are many other sub components; Tensile, Hope, Magura (brakes), Chris King (hubs and headsets) and a huge selection of tires but are now very trials specific and also specific to urban or natural (natty) riding.

My bike is a Meta, I have a Meta stem with Trialtech high riser bars & Echo pressed headset. Magura Hs33 rear hydraulic brake with TNN aluminum backings and LGM pads, Echo half brake booster. Front brake is a Magura BB7 mechanical disc brake, with an Avid G2 Clean Sweep rotor, Jaguar cable housing and Shimano XTR cables and a Shimano XTR lever. Cranks are Trialtech with Premium magnesium platform pedals, Trialtech bottom bracket (BB) with a White Industries front free wheel (FFW). Tensile chain tensioner due to vertical drop outs with a KMC Kool chain. Wheels, Trialtech rims with Echo hubs and DT Swiss spokes, red anodized nipples, running Maxxis Minion on the back and a DT Maxxis Larson on the front. Tryall lock on grips and Echo brake mounts on the rear with miscellaneous anodized and Ti bolts. The point is the only thing that remains stock on my bike is the frame and the stem, everything else has been slowly replaced. My wish list is to install a Echo SL 108 FFW, Hope rear hub, Tryall TryHole front rim and a Hope Mono Trials front brake. Maybe replace the stem for a Trailtech forged.

Sorry for the long winded Saturday morning post, just thought it is interesting information.
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Old 06-11-2011, 03:37 PM   #300
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Well, the day has FINALLY come. The bike was delievered by UPS yesterday...seconds before Aidan came home. His birthday was today. so...it couldn't have come at a better time. Aidan will always remember that he got his first trials bicycle on his seventh birthday.

I've always had a plan for my 1st born son...call it payback from my childhood (cheapshit bikes and few of them, and NO motorcycles allowed). Things were going to be different for our son (the wife rides too).

Well, they have been completely different that my childhood. Off training wheels at three, BMX racing at four, CRF 50 at the sametime...TY 80 still waiting in the wings...and NOW the Trials Bicycle...

The plan is working VERY nicely...

And NOW the much awaited film clips from his birthday party today (please excuse the lack of gear...this is the first time I have ever let him ride like this).

ALL these film clips were taken within the first 30 minutes of receiving the bike.









And this one, sums up the hole day...




What a day ...

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