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Old 02-16-2005, 04:26 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by configurationspace
Definately there's a lot of talent going into the NHL. That talent does not reach its potential. Look at the lineup in the '83 Edmonton Oilers. The power play line was: Gretzky, Messier, Anderson, Kurri, Coffey. Gretzky had raw talent, that is undeniable but the rest: Messier for example, he came into the NHL with no history of being a goal scorer or anything near an outstanding player in any league. He was a complete risk. Messier became an amazing player on the Oilers because he had the opportunity -- he had the people to learn from and a proper environment to do it in. Mistakes were tolerated, a wide-open barnstorming game was what Edmontonians paid to see. Messier became one of the best players in hockey because he was given the chance and the right people to play with in Edmonton. Messier probably never would have made the cut in today's NHL because he would have been forced to play a boring defensive game where his talents would never be exposed. Imagine a power-play line where 4 of the 5 players are 50+ goal scorers in today's NHL. No defenseman has got anywhere near Coffey's point totals since his day.

Excellent points, all.
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Old 02-16-2005, 04:27 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Marc
Sorry Linz, gotta disagree with you here. All professional sports suck. Everyone from the greedy, sleazeball owners to the juiced, overpaid, prima donna players that charge kids for signatures, to the fucking rip-off city contracts (overpriced parking, expensive and shitty food) to the tv networks... all of em can suck a fucking cock.

Bastards. All of 'em. Hope they all go out of business.


AAAAAaaaaaAAAAAaaaarrrrrrrGGGGGGHHHHHhhhhhh!
Don't hold back, tell us how you really feel.

I loved hockey as a kid growing up. The Bruins were a great team and hockey wasn't such a commercial monster. I stopped watching every single game when they put all of the home games on a premium cable channel. That sucked.

These guys are all crazy - Taking a sport that doesn't have a huge fan base to begin with and then just killing an entire season just doesn't seem to be a smart move for either side.
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Old 02-16-2005, 04:33 PM   #18
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I don't miss it....always considered it along the lines of the CFL as a professional sport. I do feel for some of the northern US/Candadian fans though.
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Old 02-16-2005, 04:35 PM   #19
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I don't miss it....always considered it along the lines of the CFL as a professional sport. I do feel for some of the northern US/Candadian fans though.
I miss it. A lot. There's virtually nothing else going on in the winter.
I hate basketball. No motorsports. No nothin'.
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Old 02-16-2005, 06:11 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by ADVWannaB
[url] Maybe now we can reign in what was once the great Canadian past-time!
Yes, but it also means al least a whole year of not having sex "Canadian Style"
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Old 02-16-2005, 06:39 PM   #21
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One reason I won't miss it, is because it was not televised anyway. I have heard of the NHL but have only seen Olympic Hockey. West coast is apparently a hockey free zone.
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Old 02-16-2005, 08:44 PM   #22
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Was listening to one of the Radio sports talk shows today as I did a few errands. They had on one of the Greats (Howe???) was talking about starting a new 6 team league. Planning a showcase event later this year with real play to begin next winter. Wants to fix all that is wrong with the NHL. Anyone know anything about this?

Jurgen
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Jurgen screwed with this post 02-16-2005 at 08:58 PM
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Old 02-16-2005, 09:22 PM   #23
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The stangest thing happened today. I was picking up some tubing today and the guys at the counter were talking hockey. I ask the guy if he was a fan and he said "no, but i guess i should be since it's played by white guys." I left wondering why people feel the need to share...
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Old 02-16-2005, 09:50 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by configurationspace
The Ithaca NY highschool team plays harder than most NHL teams on the average night. There's a skill level difference, sure. Ithaca high would lose to any NHL team on any night, no doubt. But in terms of effort most NHL teams just don't compare.

Remember the '76 Super Series? The Soviet team schooled the NHL teams. In the '83 Super Series the only teams the USSR lost to were Edmonton and Calgary -- the two NHL teams that played a hockey with a heavy Soviet influence at the time.

The quality of hockey in the NHL is highly variable because it is a political thing. The Soviets showed us how good hockey could be -- Edmonton, Calgary and to a lesser extent, Pittsburg realized that potential then the 2nd wave of expansion came and hockey became a game of trapping and big stupid oafs, hooking, holding -- turning the game into something like football instead of true hockey. The ref's let the holding stay in the game because it allowed shitty teams to compete, which is good for revenues. Talk to an ex-NHL official -- they are frequently briefed by their higher-ups as to what to call and with what frequency. Some of them are happy to let people know how it works. One of my neighbours was an NHL linesman -- Swede Knox. I went to school with his kid.

Currently NHL-style hockey is a timid, boring, defensive game. The heart has been taken out of it. A good hockey game has FLOW. 3 on 2's, long offensive rushes, multiple completed passes between traffic. There are no more players like Orr, Coffey, Messier, Gretzky and Lemieux. When Messier was in his prime at least once a game he'd take the puck end-to-end, plow through a defenseman (while in possession of the puck), crash the net and frequently score. The last NHL player who had that raw talent may have been Valeri Kaminsky. Part of the problem is that players with the capacity to be a Mark Messier never develop in those directions anymore -- now when they come up the ice they've got a stick under their armpit or someone is holding onto their jersey or stick, so they have to do something else because that kind of play is allowed in today's NHL.
Hey! My brother in law was a big oaf. Played for the Canadians thourgh the 70's, starting goon er ah - I mean enforcer. Five Stanley Cup rings.

Anyway, he thinks there are just too many teams today.
At 6'4" 250lbs playing weight, he is impressed that so most of todays players are as big and fast he is (was).
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Old 02-16-2005, 09:52 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by configurationspace
The Ithaca NY highschool team plays harder than most NHL teams on the average night. There's a skill level difference, sure. Ithaca high would lose to any NHL team on any night, no doubt. But in terms of effort most NHL teams just don't compare.

Remember the '76 Super Series? The Soviet team schooled the NHL teams. In the '83 Super Series the only teams the USSR lost to were Edmonton and Calgary -- the two NHL teams that played a hockey with a heavy Soviet influence at the time.

The quality of hockey in the NHL is highly variable because it is a political thing. The Soviets showed us how good hockey could be -- Edmonton, Calgary and to a lesser extent, Pittsburg realized that potential then the 2nd wave of expansion came and hockey became a game of trapping and big stupid oafs, hooking, holding -- turning the game into something like football instead of true hockey. The ref's let the holding stay in the game because it allowed shitty teams to compete, which is good for revenues. Talk to an ex-NHL official -- they are frequently briefed by their higher-ups as to what to call and with what frequency. Some of them are happy to let people know how it works. One of my neighbours was an NHL linesman -- Swede Knox. I went to school with his kid.

Currently NHL-style hockey is a timid, boring, defensive game. The heart has been taken out of it. A good hockey game has FLOW. 3 on 2's, long offensive rushes, multiple completed passes between traffic. There are no more players like Orr, Coffey, Messier, Gretzky and Lemieux. When Messier was in his prime at least once a game he'd take the puck end-to-end, plow through a defenseman (while in possession of the puck), crash the net and frequently score. The last NHL player who had that raw talent may have been Valeri Kaminsky. Part of the problem is that players with the capacity to be a Mark Messier never develop in those directions anymore -- now when they come up the ice they've got a stick under their armpit or someone is holding onto their jersey or stick, so they have to do something else because that kind of play is allowed in today's NHL.
Hey! My brother in law was a big oaf. Played for the Canadians thourgh the 70's, starting goon er ah - I mean enforcer. Five Stanley Cup rings.

Anyway, he thinks there are just too many teams today. dilutes the talent pool and fan base.
At 6'4" 250lbs playing weight, he is impressed that so most of todays players are as big and fast he is (was).
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Old 02-16-2005, 10:02 PM   #26
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Have only lived in minor league hockey towns so what I know of NHL is the extremely minimal amount that I watch on TV. Why is it that I enjoy Olympic Hockey so much more than NHL? What is different?

To me, more & better skating and less thugery but I'm barely a fan.

Jurgen
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Old 02-16-2005, 10:07 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurgen
Have only lived in minor league hockey towns so what I know of NHL is the extremely minimal amount that I watch on TV. Why is it that I enjoy Olympic Hockey so much more than NHL? What is different?

To me, more & better skating and less thugery but I'm barely a fan.

Jurgen
The flow is better. Don't have some some guy who's job it is to "distract and discourage" the other team's best player by starting a fight and stopping play.
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Old 02-16-2005, 10:08 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by configurationspace
Pierre Bouchard is your brother in law? I can't think of anyone else on the Canadiens that were anywhere near that profile.
Rick Chartraw
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Old 02-16-2005, 10:09 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Gorilla King
The flow is better. Don't have some some guy who's job it is to "distract and discourage" the other team's best player by starting a fight and stopping play.

I love hockey. only sport I will watch. But the game becomes less interesting when the whole shindig goes from being a roughly played game and becomes an excuse for boxing on skates. I do hope they never eliminate the rough play aspect of the game tho.
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Old 02-16-2005, 10:14 PM   #30
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Lived in SLC, back when they had the Golden Eagles-went to a lot of games and saw some good, but also a lot of the thug game. Friend (a former college player) explained that is how they got the attention of the boys from the big league.

Here in NM, the Scorpions (AA equivilent?) played against a B or C league Russian Team for a demo game. The Russians were so much better that the Scorps players became visibly frustrated and began just to start fights to slow the game.

What kinna game would I see if I went to a College game-say D.U. up in Denver?

Jurgen
I could become a huge fan if it was played more the international way. Right now from what I've seen I think it is better than pro B-Ball but still doesn't hold interest for me.

edit--just read Chops post, not against in anyway good physical hard hitting hockey but don't like WWF
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