New and improved KTM690 WUNDERFEST

[engineerjoe]

Originally Posted by Beemermcr

Hi - bought a 2008 690 E from an out of state dealer; during check ride/pickup bike stalled out after 2/3 blocks:

- starts normally
- revs normally
- stalls at 60-90 seconds; blipping throttle will not stop stalling once it starts
- turn off, back on and it starts fine, only to stall again after the 60-90 seconds

Bike has FMF installed, K&N air filter, handlebar mounted 3 position mapping switch, position 2

Dealer is working hard to get the bike fixed:
- checked tank integrity and fixed a small hole by integrated mounting nuts
- replaced fuel filter
- replaced battery
- cleaned dirty fuel injector

After these, bike ran well for 6 miles of a test ride then stalled and is repeating 60-90 second pattern

Ideas to be checked next:
- re-verify tank is venting properly
- verify all fuel hoses are EFI rated
- check EFI regulator
- EFI Reset procedure
- TPS Reset procedure
- check maps for EFI CPU and ept throttle body CPU
- check earth connection to frame
- check electrical connections around the throttle body and coil connections for dust fouling

Above are what I can find as causes for 690s running poorly or stalling; anything we have missed? Any ideas would be appreciated -

Thanks in advance!
Paul

I had this problem. Turned out to be the TPS voltages were out of spec.

How many times does the EFI light blink when it happens?

[bobzilla]

Originally Posted by rickypanecatyl

To have a bike like the 690 that was actually reliable and dependaple IN THE MIDDLE OF NOWHERE (ie in the middle of nowhere you can't just forgive a bike that wont start because it happened in the city, you towed it to a dealer and 2 weaks later the dealer and a $50K diagnostic machine realize it was an incredibly simple problem all along and even picked up the tab) would be awesome!
I'm convinced KTM could build it but they have to want to, and that comes from customers realizing how awesome a bike like that would be (and how far from that it is right now) and valuing reliability along with performance.

bingo
thats why I think Ill build a xr 600 with good legs. I typically ride where its a two day walk to the truck and you dont see too many other humans

[RoninMoto]

Quick question:

Are the FI blink codes for the '08 the same as '10? I want to make a print out of the codes to put under my seat but I cant find a PDF of a 2010 enduro R manual. I did find a manual for an '08 and i am curious if they were the same. I would love to look at my paper manual but it is somewhere in storage far far away. Thanks guys.

[Uller]

Originally Posted by rickypanecatyl

Actually I think you were far away the highest mileage "male" rider out there! Fishfund? Really?? Did you read his report - that wasn't the best PR for the 690!

Ricky,

While I most definitely am not discounting your troubles with the 690, there hasn't been anyone since you who has had issues like you had. At least they haven't come on here and told us about it......

Regarding Fishfunds bike. He ended up having a faulty Rectifier/Regulator. Those have been creating issues for almost each and every manufacturer of motorcycles out there. I don't see that as a fault of KTM anymore after discovering how far and wide ranging the issue has been. (Remember, my R/R failed too causing me to walk for a ways. )

[Uller]

Originally Posted by RoninMoto

Quick question:

Are the FI blink codes for the '08 the same as '10? I want to make a print out of the codes to put under my seat but I cant find a PDF of a 2010 enduro R manual. I did find a manual for an '08 and i am curious if they were the same. I would love to look at my paper manual but it is somewhere in storage far far away. Thanks guys.

Don't know the answer to your question however, I haven't read of the codes being different between the years.

With all the Rally Raid stuff you have, they didn't send you a laminated copy of the codes? A couple of years ago, when I got my risers from them they included a laminated code sheet. It is now glued to the underside of my seat.

[Maxacceleration]

Originally Posted by rickypanecatyl

To have a bike like the 690 that was actually reliable and dependaple IN THE MIDDLE OF NOWHERE (ie in the middle of nowhere you can't just forgive a bike that wont start because it happened in the city, you towed it to a dealer and 2 weaks later the dealer and a $50K diagnostic machine realize it was an incredibly simple problem all along and even picked up the tab) would be awesome!
I'm convinced KTM could build it but they have to want to, and that comes from customers realizing how awesome a bike like that would be (and how far from that it is right now) and valuing reliability along with performance.

Double bingo.
My bike is dead, RIGHT NOW.
In the city (ok the country). With a KTM dealer booked out over a week. With a ride planned tomorrow.
I have checked (pulled & re installed) all fuses, checked & charged battery, [looked] at my ground - looks and is tight/solid.
Turn my key and nothing.
I even checked to make sure my kill switch isn't on. Ya lol.

Good grief.

As bobzilla says a suspension tuned Honda or Suzuki may well be the way to go.

Did I mention the flame outs and falling over on technical single track?
After being mapped and 02 sniffed/tuned? Did I?

Jesus, its fuel fucking ignition for christs sakes - its not supposed to do that.

My 690 Enduro is the most undependable/glitchy bike I have ever owned from new in over 30 bikes owned.

Sorry I had to get that out.

[rickypanecatyl]

Originally Posted by Uller

Ricky,

Regarding Fishfunds bike. He ended up having a faulty Rectifier/Regulator. Those have been creating issues for almost each and every manufacturer of motorcycles out there. I don't see that as a fault of KTM anymore after discovering how far and wide ranging the issue has been. (Remember, my R/R failed too causing me to walk for a ways. )

That was exactly my point earlier Uller! This bike is fine for the guy whose never far from the grid, has got lots of bikes, does the occasional weekend ride or enters a race where they have KTM support vans just waiting.
What it seems you failed to catch from Fish's report was how many thousands of dollars his breakdowns cost; how often it left him stranded; how much worse it would have been with out the BMW to tow; how many hookups with friends they missed because of the 690.

He went to dealers and experts in multiple countries on 3 continents and NO ONE could figure it out.

Over 1/2 a million read his ride report, he appealed to the group for ideas and no one could figure it out. No breakthru answers from the wise here though of course all the head scratching does eventually pay off .

At the same time I was talking to KTM NA and KTM Austria about Luke's bike and they were scratching their heads. John at rally raid was amazingly helpful but no one could find the issue.

So in retrospect, all it was was the rectifier... Are you sure?? Every breakdown of mine if a dealer or KTM Austria "figured out the problem" what ever it was, that's all it was, all the time! They always now knew what the problem was. It's always so simple in retrospect. Rest assured that after its fixed and when it breaks again that when it gets fixed - sometimes 6 months later, whatever it was would have been simple and not KTM's fault.
FWIW's I realize BK's problem is not KTM's fault. I too had a bearing let go and grenade the engine and KTM assured me that they contract out for those bearings and so its not one of their parts that failed.
And every North Korean rocket that doesn't make it into outerspace ALSO has a perfectly good reason why it didn't make it... and in that instance most of us are glad for their level of commitment to excellence!

[nippybit]

bingo
thats why I think Ill build a xr 600 with good legs. I typically ride where its a two day walk to the truck and you dont see too many other humans[/QUOTE from Bobzilla]

Ricky, good points about the bike's problems. I am lucky so far as the bike has not left me 1,000 km's from Timbuktu. I did or had done every known fix up front so that I can hopefully have a dependable 690 but I do not ride outback and as hard as you, Bob, and others do. Albie would say my bike is lightly used. Probably right. Bob you are right about the known dependability of most Jap bikes. If Honda, Suzuki, or Kawasaki would make a thoroughly new and lightweight big bore-dual sport I would sell my 690 and maybe even buy the first year of their new model(s).

I have come to this conclusion after an overwhelming amount of evidence presented here on the 690's problems. I never said I was smart! It is now very hard for me to defend the bike's reliability even though mine is still running just fine. Somewhere Albie is screaming, "I told you so"!

Now drinking fruit punch koolaid (read Orange, mixed with Green, mixed with Red, mixed with Yellow).

[dunefreak]

I haven't had one single problem with mine yet, but I only about 2,000 miles on my 2012.

It would be interesting to hear from the high mileage 690 owners. I know we already have the "any major 2012 problems" thread (http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=790639) ,but I think if those with high mileage 690's posted how many miles they currently have and what major issues they have had, it might prove the 690 to not be any less reliable of a bike than some Jap bikes.

[RoninMoto]

I have 16k miles on my '10R so far. I plan on putting a lot more. No problems yet. I checked my valves yesterday and they have not changed since the first time I checked them (.08 .08 .08 and .09 mm)

I have a flight to Europe next week with the 690 to continue my RTW. I can't think of any other bike I would rather be on.

[ohauitirod]

I have 23000km on an 08 and no problems as yet , oil changed every 2.5-3000km

[Uller]

I'm at 9,000 mi. on an '08. Issues include: broken tank bolts, faulty ground, faulty Rectifier/Regulator.

Response in Red.

Originally Posted by rickypanecatyl

That was exactly my point earlier Uller! This bike is fine for the guy whose never far from the grid, has got lots of bikes, does the occasional weekend ride or enters a race where they have KTM support vans just waiting. Maybe, however, there are those who have gotten their 690 niggles sorted out (or never even had to) and do take it far from the grid. I just went on a group ride in the mountains of British Columbia. There were (4) 690s. Not a single issue with any of them for the (3) days riding.
What it seems you failed to catch from Fish's report was how many thousands of dollars his breakdowns cost; how often it left him stranded; how much worse it would have been with out the BMW to tow; how many hookups with friends they missed because of the 690. I will disagree here, I very closely followed his thread. He purchased a used bike. Very quickly installed his Rally Raid Fairing and Tanks and shipped the bike off. At the time, it was still a very new bike and some of it's quirks weren't even discovered yet. His first problem was a fuel pump, every manuf. is having issues with fuel pumps on FI bikes. Plus, he had gas sitting in his tank for the entire shipment and customs wait..... His second issue was due to wires rubbing behind the fairing. (He admitted that this was his fault due to hasty bike building). His third issue was the coil leads vibrating and breaking (again, lack of attention to bike building) His fourth was the Rectifier/Regulator. As I said before, these are affecting all manufacturers and newer, better designs have been or are being developed. Only after Luke got his GPS back with a voltage readout did they determine the Rectifier/Regulator was faulty. It was even tested by John at Rally Raid and it looked fine. It is an intermittent fault that is very hard to diagnose. At the last years Dakar, multiple Yamahas and Hondas' dropped out due to faulty electrical components in the first few days. IMO, it is the manufacturers of the components which all bike manufacturers use, that is causing the problems. And, if you remember, that BMW that towed him also had a major breakdown, wasn't it the solid drive axle which cost more than all of the 690's issues put together? No solution to that in the middle of Africa either.

He went to dealers and experts in multiple countries on 3 continents and NO ONE could figure it out. No offense intended to the techs at the dealers however, If there is one thing I learned from reading the threads is that the dealers tend to know less about the 690 and how to fix it than half of the people reading this thread do. I think you have even proved that the "Experts" from KTM aren't really.......... (I once had a little birdy inform me that a faulty engine was shipped all the way back to Austria for diagnosis for running issues and it turns out the problem was that the fuel mapping was set to "0" for bad fuel )

Over 1/2 a million read his ride report, he appealed to the group for ideas and no one could figure it out. No breakthru answers from the wise here though of course all the head scratching does eventually pay off .How would you expect to diagnose a faulty R/R over the computer I don't know.....

At the same time I was talking to KTM NA and KTM Austria about Luke's bike and they were scratching their heads. John at rally raid was amazingly helpful but no one could find the issue. Again, intermittent electrical faults are the hardest of any to find.

So in retrospect, all it was was the rectifier... Are you sure?? Yes. His bike ran fine after that. Every breakdown of mine if a dealer or KTM Austria "figured out the problem" what ever it was, that's all it was, all the time! They always now knew what the problem was. It's always so simple in retrospect. Rest assured that after its fixed and when it breaks again that when it gets fixed - sometimes 6 months later, whatever it was would have been simple and not KTM's fault. You broke a lot of stuff.
FWIW's I realize BK's problem is not KTM's fault. I too had a bearing let go and grenade the engine and KTM assured me that they contract out for those bearings and so its not one of their parts that failed.
And every North Korean rocket that doesn't make it into outerspace ALSO has a perfectly good reason why it didn't make it... and in that instance most of us are glad for their level of commitment to excellence! I won't attempt to discuss North Korean Nukes, Android Cell Phones, or your KLX...

[Velociraptor]

I have had two instances where my bike almost left me stranded. Both were probably due to coil connections but not 100% certain. Both times I was able to get the bike going and ride home. Since then I have replaced stock parts with more reliable replacements discussed in this forum. Thanks to all of you

Totally unknown is what % of 690 owners post here. I am guessing a low percent. Also unknown is the failure rate of the 690-how often a bike leaves a rider stranded. Maybe KTM has those numbers.

The week long Baja trip I did had 2 690s, 3 KTM 950s or 990s, 1 BMW GS800, and 2 BMW GS 1200s. All did fine with no real issues. The GS1200s had a lot of extra lights that got broken but nothing else.

Maybe we were just lucky or maybe that is the norm. I have no idea!

[SoilSampleDave]

It seems like KTM's best FI guys are over on the Husaberg side of the fence. Maybe they could borrow a few of those guys to sort out the 690

[Maxacceleration]

Originally Posted by Maxacceleration

My bike is dead, RIGHT NOW.

The 690 runs again.

My issue, today, was the key ignition plug came undone under the coolant reservoir. Hard to spot.
I looked the whole bike over but it was not discovered until at the dealer.

Thank you Wenatchee KTM for looking over my bike without an appt.

I'll work on getting back on a positive note!