New and improved KTM690 WUNDERFEST

[bobzilla]

Originally Posted by al m

As usual you guys have come up with some top quality info, thanks heaps! I'll be doing 6 weeks around the US with my old man who is an upholsterer and he's already in my ear about choice of bike.. I am mainly concerned with the seat and ergos of this bike for long distance.

I'll be then riding down to Peru on this orange beast...Do you think the bike can do it? I plan to dress her in adventure clothing i.e. proper seat, screen/fairings, perhaps a larger tank and appropriate luggage system. I seem to encounter two schools of thought regarding the 690 as a long-distance adventurer, one is that its an amazing bike the other is that is a glorified dirt squirter!

I will be hitting up as much off road as possible, but I need to be realistic and consider the long, consecutive days of tarmac I'll be facing. Do you think I should just be looking at a Tiger800 as one poster suggested?

I know these are some newbie questions but I really appreciate each individuals input!

I have found that it is much easier to ride a dirt bike down the hiway than it is to ride a street bike down a sandwash or up stair steps
it there is dirt involved I choose the dirt bike every time and l have let sit or sold my BMW's and Cagiva

[garrett]

Originally Posted by Gros Buck

Look at pictures here: http://advrider.com/forums/showpost....7&postcount=10

It gives an idea of damges due do stappling. Imagine re-stappling. Better glue the Seat Concept instead.

Paul Jr

Paul

I was wondering about the seat pan myself as I thought it was rather flimsy. I'm going to inspect mine. Please keep us informed regarding your upgraded pan.

Garrett

[Gros Buck]

Originally Posted by al m

Do you think I should just be looking at a Tiger800 as one poster suggested?

Do not get close to a Tiger 800 even with a 20 foot stick. If you think the 690 has problems, you aint seen nothing yet with the Tiger ... Can of worms.

You are better off with the GS800. (If you carry rear wheel bearings that is). More dealers as well.

Paul Jr 8

[B2]

Originally Posted by Gros Buck

Do not get close to a Tiger 800 even with a 20 foot stick. If you think the 690 has problems, you aint seen nothing yet with the Tiger ... Can of worms.

You are better off with the GS800. (If you carry rear wheel bearings that is). More dealers as well.

Paul Jr 8

I agree the 800xc is a piece of shite i was joking when i stated buy one I sold my 4month old one { lost a fortune } to buy the 690 -so glad i did

[masterreset]

Originally Posted by Biped

My TPS gremlins continue....
Not sure if anyone else has had this issue or could point me in a direction for further diagnostics.
Issue: While riding, any gear, any speed, or bike stationary at idle, I randomly get an FI solid on light and the engine tone changes. Going to Neutral provides a 9 x long flash indicating a TPS issue.
Well, I first check all TPS related voltages via TuneECU and all were within spec. I checked all wiring for chaffing, short to frame etc and nothing. I then replaced the TPS with a new one and reset the voltages. Unfortunately same error/issue persists.
I decided to check the TPS voltages directly to see if I could find an abnormality. I used pins to back probe the TPS connector to a logging DVM. What I found was interesting. The working voltage was a steady 4.98V which is great. The sense line voltage was at 0.58V while idling normally, which is what should be expected. When the FI issue occurs the sense voltage jumps to 0.71V and stays there. The working voltage does not change. If I cycle the key or kill switch all goes back to normal.
From what I can gather is that somehow the stepper motor must be getting a signal to move the butterfly a set amount, independant of throttle position, at random times which seems the only way the sense voltage on the TPS would change a set amount and stay static.(some randon butterfly to throttle position offset) The wiring diagram does not have any info on the 8 position stepper plug pin-out for me to analyze. Are there any sensors that control this stepper (left side throttle body) or is it driven through the ECU only. I would prefer not to buy a new throttle body to see if the issue goes away or not.

Any thoughts....this just started happening about 250 miles ago. Have not done any mods/mapping for about 8k miles. Running a version of the Beaney map FWIW.

How did you measure the TPS voltage with the DVM? Sense line against chassis or sense line against bottom pin of the TPS? Because a bad grounding of the TPS may also cause a voltage jump as you observed. The 690 suffers sometimes from poor ground contacts.

[Bruno T .]

Originally Posted by al m

I'll be then riding down to Peru on this orange beast...Do you think the bike can do it?

It wouldn't be my first choice. I'd be on a 950/990 adv/SE, or an 800 GS.

If you're riding that far, you'll inevitably be eating up lots of pavement and the 690 isn't the tool for that, imo.

[RoninMoto]

Originally Posted by Bruno T .

It wouldn't be my first choice. I'd be on a 950/990 adv/SE, or an 800 GS.

If you're riding that far, you'll inevitably be eating up lots of pavement and the 690 isn't the tool for that, imo.

This spring I went from San Diego to Prudhoe Bay to Minnesota. Lots of pavement and some gravel. Probably 80/20? There is no bike I would rather have been on. But that was only 15k miles. So I might need more time to figure out that the 690 isn't a good traveling bike.

[Biped]

Originally Posted by masterreset

How did you measure the TPS voltage with the DVM? Sense line against chassis or sense line against bottom pin of the TPS? Because a bad grounding of the TPS may also cause a voltage jump as you observed. The 690 suffers sometimes from poor ground contacts.

I measured both ways. First between the connector sense pin and frame ground and then between the connector sense pin and connector ground pin. The voltage jump was the same. I did see with a poor frame ground the voltage would drop on the DVM and not rise.

Here is a trace of the voltage jump.. 0.58V to 0.73V.


I will look tonight and check/adjust the right hand side THAD (emergency running position) and APAD (throttle grip sensor) voltages to see if I get an improvement.

[Sutherngintelmen]

Originally Posted by al m

I'll be then riding down to Peru on this orange beast...Do you think the bike can do it? I plan to dress her in adventure clothing i.e. proper seat, screen/fairings, perhaps a larger tank and appropriate luggage system.

IMHO

If/when/as, I 'm looking to SA and beyond expect both my 690 and f8gs will stay in the barn. Of course it's been done by some and maybe many with success.

A recent add, R80gspd seems like the right bike for that trip to me. A lot of reasons, this thread and it's daddy for two. Pay to play for a bunch more and then there's field fixes.

Twin smoothness, good low end, out paces on slab when need be. Not so many doo-dads. Lacking suspension. Less (ok, much less!) right hand jam. As always, depends on what you want from the ride.

Warning - this may be young love with talented cougar.

[Bruno T .]

Originally Posted by RoninMoto

This spring I went from San Diego to Prudhoe Bay to Minnesota. Lots of pavement and some gravel. Probably 80/20? There is no bike I would rather have been on. But that was only 15k miles. So I might need more time to figure out that the 690 isn't a good traveling bike.

15K mile 80% pavement and 20% gravel ride, and you wouldn't have preferred a 990/950 adv or SE ? Seriously ?

[crankshaft]

Originally Posted by Bruno T .

15K mile 80% pavement and 20% gravel ride, and you wouldn't have preferred a 990/950 adv or SE ? Seriously ?

No offense Noah..... He's probably not tall enough for an SE. I'm 6-3 and I tippy toe the damn thing, how would that work? Just because you wouldn't tour with it doesn't mean he or anyone else wouldn't. I rode my 640 ADV all over Alaska and the 690 would have been a lot more fun, trust me.

[Bruno T .]

Originally Posted by crankshaft

Just because you wouldn't tour with it doesn't mean he or anyone else wouldn't.

Absolutely. Ride whatever does it for you.

It surprises me that anyone would choose a 690 over a 950/990 adv or SE for a 15K mile 80% pavement 20% gravel ride, but there may be circumstances i'm not aware of. I hear you on the fact that the SE is tall and that would dissuade some.

[Night Falcon]

Originally Posted by al m

I will be hitting up as much off road as possible, but I need to be realistic and consider the long, consecutive days of tarmac I'll be facing. Do you think I should just be looking at a Tiger800 as one poster suggested?

I know these are some newbie questions but I really appreciate each individuals input!

I have done some long days in the saddle on the 690 and it has been fine on the road and superb on the off road. As you know the 690 is sold as an enduro so needs some mods to become a decent adventurer...which it can become!!. I would rate the 690 as the best bike I've owned for shorter excursions 1-2 weeks but for longer durations I'd be going for a 950/90 BUT I can't afford 2 bikes so would happily stick with the 690.

[Biped]

Originally Posted by Biped

I measured both ways. First between the connector sense pin and frame ground and then between the connector sense pin and connector ground pin. The voltage jump was the same. I did see with a poor frame ground the voltage would drop on the DVM and not rise.

Here is a trace of the voltage jump.. 0.58V to 0.73V.


I will look tonight and check/adjust the right hand side THAD (emergency running position) and APAD (throttle grip sensor) voltages to see if I get an improvement.

So all three voltages checked out in spec. What I did notice is that the ignition timing also jumps when this error occurs. Normal idle timing is at 7.0 degrees BTDC and this changes to -10.0 degrees BTDC when the error occurs. Normal throttle movement increases the degrees BTDC and not sure what can cause it to move in a negative direction. Here is a screen shot from TuneECU before and after fault.


Next move is to check the signal from the Crank Position Sensor and assocoated wiring.
Any further thoughts...

[bobzilla]

Originally Posted by crankshaft

No offense Noah..... He's probably not tall enough for an SE. I'm 6-3 and I tippy toe the damn thing, how would that work? Just because you wouldn't tour with it doesn't mean he or anyone else wouldn't. I rode my 640 ADV all over Alaska and the 690 would have been a lot more fun, trust me.

if i was doing that trip it would be the 690 or a home built XR650/600 frankinbike

As much trouble as i have had in my 12k i still think this is one of the best bikes i have had and i have had more than a few