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Old 02-07-2012, 06:18 PM   #781
GrahamD
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Originally Posted by scorch View Post
Cant believe this thing will get 70 mpg. lets hope more makers will start bringing out larger bikes that are fuel efficient.

They do, it's just they are a lot bigger. GS and S10 fuel economy can be really good, The new Stroms are good and can very close. AS FAR AS WE KNOW.

The only things that changes that is that the motors CAN be revved harder and WILL start gulping fuel.

What the NC will do when riding with the other bikes at the same speed in the real world is yet to be seen. It may even be better than claimed.

It may be way better sometimes and not much different at others. time will tell.
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Old 02-08-2012, 06:12 AM   #782
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Dunno guys, is this thing a motorcycle or a scooter?


Apparently the engine is derived from the Honda Jazz automobile, and if you've ever driven one of those then you know what a boring engine they've plugged into this new moto-scooter.



50Hp, a redline at 6500 RPM and the most basic or suspensions... Wow, how exciting is that?

I could see this moto-scooter appealing to non-motorcyclists looking for a fuel efficient commuter vehicle. Other than that, I can't really imagine who would buy such a thing...

Honda's already got the VFR powered Crossrunner. Could this scooter dressed in mc clothes be the shemale equivalent in the motorcycle world? The Honda Crossdresser???
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Old 02-08-2012, 06:42 AM   #783
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Originally Posted by TonyBKK View Post

Could this scooter dressed in mc clothes be the shemale equivalent in the motorcycle world? The Honda Crossdresser???
Well, Suzuki's Glady's is very metro sexual and it's pretty much left the SV dead in the water.

So that doesn't seem to be an issue these days.

I also know many people that leave the Italian/German exotica at home (something to do with resale and lease terms) and ride the 250cc Kawasaki to work. So there is another market.

And what is the point of wearing out the Fun bike to ride in Boring traffic each day anyway?

Plenty of older people using scooters and liking it as well.

And as far as scooters and adventure riding goes, I think it's time to man up folks..

Real men aren't afraid of riding scooters.



I still think it has its place. Funny thing is the best selling brand in Oz is Honda. So They must be doing something right.

After all companies are there to make money.
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Old 02-08-2012, 08:05 AM   #784
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyBKK View Post

I could see this moto-scooter appealing to non-motorcyclists looking for a fuel efficient commuter vehicle. Other than that, I can't really imagine who would buy such a thing...
I'll tell you who might buy it, a guy like me whose 68 and has ridden over 50 years and has severe nerve damage in his clutch hand. I'm having more and more trouble with my fingers locking straight so I can't pull the clutch. I realize I'm an unusual candidate but I'm going to have a look at the dtc model.
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Old 02-08-2012, 08:37 AM   #785
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gkgeiger View Post
I'll tell you who might buy it, a guy like me whose 68 and has ridden over 50 years and has severe nerve damage in his clutch hand. I'm having more and more trouble with my fingers locking straight so I can't pull the clutch. I realize I'm an unusual candidate but I'm going to have a look at the dtc model.
Twist and go is just a lot of fun, and it rules in the city. There is nothing magical about holding in the clutch at lights, no matter how easy the pull. Take a 300 mile jaunt, and you will have a lot less fatigue at the end of the day, no matter where you go.

I like both, I like to wind it out and row the gears personally, but how many people have really tried the twist and go, who say it's no good for this MC? I have a Jazz, good car, the motor is the smoothest 4 I've had from Honda, especially at idle. I expect the DCT works great in the bike, always lots of pull and keeps the revs low. I would think the manual pretty forgiving as you can shift anytime because it doesn't do anything more to run it up to red line.
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Old 02-08-2012, 12:57 PM   #786
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mooter? neuter(neu-scooter)?

the traditional definition of a scooter is a step through design with auto tranny and sealed transmission (not for life, but you're not dealing w/ chain stretch/wear/lube). they keep getting bigger but the same fundamentals features are there. this has neither of these.

honda is blurring that line. i can see a certain percenatge of maxi-scooter owners like it, while a whole lot saying NFW to a chain. has honda ever said if they'll offer the 6sp in the integra scooter variation? that could be a light touring bike for some if they did, but might overlap w/ the NT700V. i'm thinking no as all the floor board stuff is where the shifter would be.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyBKK View Post
Dunno guys, is this thing a motorcycle or a scooter?


Apparently the engine is derived from the Honda Jazz automobile, and if you've ever driven one of those then you know what a boring engine they've plugged into this new moto-scooter.



50Hp, a redline at 6500 RPM and the most basic or suspensions... Wow, how exciting is that?

I could see this moto-scooter appealing to non-motorcyclists looking for a fuel efficient commuter vehicle. Other than that, I can't really imagine who would buy such a thing...

Honda's already got the VFR powered Crossrunner. Could this scooter dressed in mc clothes be the shemale equivalent in the motorcycle world? The Honda Crossdresser???
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eakins screwed with this post 02-08-2012 at 01:04 PM
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Old 02-08-2012, 01:08 PM   #787
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyBKK View Post
Apparently the engine is derived from the Honda Jazz automobile, and if you've ever driven one of those then you know what a boring engine they've plugged into this new moto-scooter.
I doubt the NC-Jazz engine connection is enough to even be note-worthy, but I will point out that the Jazz (Fit in the US) consistently tops all comparison tests with comparable sub-compacts and is widely thought to be the most sporty of the group with the best engine.

- Mark
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Old 02-08-2012, 01:09 PM   #788
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gkgeiger View Post
I'll tell you who might buy it, a guy like me whose 68 and has ridden over 50 years and has severe nerve damage in his clutch hand. I'm having more and more trouble with my fingers locking straight so I can't pull the clutch. I realize I'm an unusual candidate but I'm going to have a look at the dtc model.
i can see the dct going to more people with issues like yours plus the added abs is key when you're not as good with modulation. still wish honda added that 3rd model or 6sp and abs or just everyone has abs like what bmw does.
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Old 02-08-2012, 01:11 PM   #789
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Originally Posted by markjenn View Post
I doubt the NC-Jazz engine connection is enough to even be note-worthy, but I will point out that the Jazz (Fit in the US) consistently tops all comparison tests with comparable sub-compacts and is widely thought to be the most sporty of the group with the best engine.

- Mark
i've driven a manual fit and you can spin that motor and it keeps pulling.
not sure where the crossover is with this motor as it sounds like it just falls flat at the top and signs off earlier than you'd expect/want.
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Old 02-09-2012, 02:24 AM   #790
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We've got the power?

Can't figure out what is wrong with 'only' 50Php.

My first Transalp had 55, my 2nd Transalp 48, and the last Transalp 600 (which I bought new in 1997) 48 Bhp. I really had lots of fun with that bike. That much, that I bought back a Transalp 600 again, 10 years after I left that bike.

Torque it the thing which is important. The Transalp 52 degrees Vtwin had lots of it (comparing it with other 600 cc bikes). Battling on steap, tight, twisty mountainroads, even 100Bhp+ supersport bikes could not keep up.
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Old 02-09-2012, 02:45 AM   #791
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[QUOTE=Two Plugs;17945182]Can't figure out what is wrong with 'only' 50Php.
Torque it the thing which is important. The Transalp 52 degrees Vtwin had lots of it (comparing it with other 600 cc bikes).

Yes, I agree tourque is the thing; this bike needs to be Adventureised thats all.


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Old 02-09-2012, 03:20 AM   #792
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Wait, I am confused...since when torque, bhp and rpms became independent measures?

I can't agree that Transalp have lots of torque low down. Worked on them (one in pieces in garage now), rode them, repaired them - never remember any impressive torque from those. Smooth - yes. And it is not simple 52 degree twin, please take a look at full picture - Transalp have different arrangements of crank pins than "classic" Vtwin.
Torque - that's what we can look at in Varadero. 90 degrees common pin twin is well balanced towards producing flat/progressive torque curve and gradual bhp curve.
I believe full picture of engine characteristics is important, not "torque" or "bhp" alone. I think best is to wait until someone puts NC on dyno bench to see how they tricked that motor. Because it does not have any impressive torque, it is WHERE this torque is that matters.

I mean - nothing wrong with Transalp except it is 23 years old motor and usually industry supposed to move forward
And contemporary requirements to motor, suspension and brakes are much higher simply because of situation on roads.
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Old 02-09-2012, 03:25 AM   #793
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Oops. There is dyno. To be honest after reviews I expected more on torque moving low down.
Here it is - vs. Strom 650



For reference

Roughly, formula

T = 5252 x HP
rpm
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Old 02-09-2012, 03:59 AM   #794
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They only way of motorcycles to start being considered real transportation alternatives to cars is if we start to see full size bikes with good fuel consumption and maintenance costs. These days any big cc bike is looked at more like a big boy's toys than anything else.

My only vehicle is a XT1200Z. I ride 80km with it everyday, with any weather. The thing can do 100km/h in 4s or less, and reach 220km/h in no time with no side cases or wind. With some care I get a little under 5l/100km on my commute. It carries two people and a couple of bags of stuff.

I have a friend that has a Seat Leon 1.6TDI. The car has almost the same power as my bike, does 0-100Km/h in 11,5s, can reach 190km/h and is currently using 3,9l/100km of cheap diesel. It carries 5 people and their stuff. Plus, one can make all kinds of fun stuff on the back seat.

This is why the general public can't look at bikes with a true sense of utility. They simply make no sense for someone who's not a two wheels passionate.And what do we get with motorcycles being considered toys? More expensive insurance, less rights on the road, more expensive equipment, more taxes and manufacturers that in a few years will be making 2000cc 180hp "dual sports".

If we had more low consumption big bikes we would have more common people looking at them as alternatives and embracing them. More bikes on the road and the banalizing their usage would be better for all of us.
And all the good things of riding can be present in a moderate power, low consumption bike
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Old 02-09-2012, 05:15 AM   #795
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Originally Posted by Ze_zaskar View Post
They only way of motorcycles to start being considered real transportation alternatives to cars is if we start to see full size bikes with good fuel consumption and maintenance costs. These days any big cc bike is looked at more like a big boy's toys than anything else.

My only vehicle is a XT1200Z. I ride 80km with it everyday, with any weather. The thing can do 100km/h in 4s or less, and reach 220km/h in no time with no side cases or wind. With some care I get a little under 5l/100km on my commute. It carries two people and a couple of bags of stuff.

I have a friend that has a Seat Leon 1.6TDI. The car has almost the same power as my bike, does 0-100Km/h in 11,5s, can reach 190km/h and is currently using 3,9l/100km of cheap diesel. It carries 5 people and their stuff. Plus, one can make all kinds of fun stuff on the back seat.

This is why the general public can't look at bikes with a true sense of utility. They simply make no sense for someone who's not a two wheels passionate.And what do we get with motorcycles being considered toys? More expensive insurance, less rights on the road, more expensive equipment, more taxes and manufacturers that in a few years will be making 2000cc 180hp "dual sports".

If we had more low consumption big bikes we would have more common people looking at them as alternatives and embracing them. More bikes on the road and the banalizing their usage would be better for all of us.
And all the good things of riding can be present in a moderate power, low consumption bike
+1 Well said.

People can still go and buy their 2020 model 300HP 22,000RPM titanium Alloy Supersports if they like, but I agree, we need some more everyday practical stuff out there.

I wouldn't mind seeing some serious thought put into safety / wet weather gear that is easier to take on and off either.

I know some countries require nothing, but the other side of the non acceptance problem is the death and injury problem and the inconvenience of some of the gear to get into and out of.
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