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Old 11-20-2013, 06:24 AM   #106
Lotus54
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Originally Posted by motobene View Post
Sounds like they may have put a different and higher 5th and 6th in there, which would be wise. Tool around on the trail but not wring the motor's head off getting there.
It has the same gearbox as the trials bike. That's how those are also. High gears to get between sections.


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Old 11-20-2013, 11:44 AM   #107
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My 4RT has high 4th and 5th but 50 would have the motor spun out so high I would feel like the bike is going to explode...

It is only a little better on my wifes Gas Gas TXT Pro with the 2 stroke having higher RPM's but still would be spun out a lot at 45 to 50 MPH.

Maybe they have the final drive gears just one or two teeth more/less front rear and its just a bit taller to start with than most stock trials?
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Old 11-20-2013, 12:31 PM   #108
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It has the same front sprocket (11) but perhaps a smaller rear. I am not really sure.
I was told the trials bike will go quite fast also, so I'm inclined to thin I it is the same.
I'll try and check rpm and speed next ride.
But I know 50mph wasn't turning that high at all.

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Old 11-20-2013, 08:02 PM   #109
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I am interested to know what the difference between the Explorer and the Trials gearing is, if any.

Not that its a big deal but my 4RT's is stock front of (10) and (41) on the Rear and many people like to up the rear to between (43 - 44) or drop the front down to (9).

As it is I am still quite interested in changing out my big bike (650) to something like the OSSA Explorer, X-Ride, or like cycle. Though I am not sure when I could do it...
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Old 11-21-2013, 07:03 AM   #110
motobene
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Originally Posted by jonnyc21 View Post
I am interested to know what the difference between the Explorer and the Trials gearing is, if any.

Not that its a big deal but my 4RT's is stock front of (10) and (41) on the Rear and many people like to up the rear to between (43 - 44) or drop the front down to (9).

As it is I am still quite interested in changing out my big bike (650) to something like the OSSA Explorer, X-Ride, or like cycle. Though I am not sure when I could do it...
Gosh, a 650 like the explorer?

I've been in that conundrum and decided a 650 is not a good single track bike. That's why I have the KLX330S (with some trials mods like remove 2 clutch springs, add steering degrees, etc.) A 650 is just too big a pig for the more off road stuff. I know some do it. I just don't want to!

Here's my `03 KLR650, which is set up for transcontinental camp and ride. Has a 685 kit to reduce engine vibration and is pretty farkled out such as with a great seat for my scrawny ass. It's also geared W A Y up over stock with 17-tooth front and 40-tooth rear. Possibly the tallest geared KLR on the planet. Great for 70 to 90 mph all day. A stock-geared 650 is just too buzzy for at speed over a lot of hours.



Here's my much more agile KLX330S and me while riding the Moab area:



Don't let the stock mirrors and turn signals fool you. The bike is actually a serious off road tool under trials hands. In the following pic I'm slowing the forks (just changed to a lighter oil before the ride) after hard bottoming a scary surprise plunge 25 feet down a series of four steps. I followed David C (NM), who did not know it was such a mongo drop off. We survived. Dr. Joe (NM now MO) behind me crashed his brains out . Dale H (NM - taking the photo)... smartly avoided the drop off after seeing us drop into nothingness.


What's appealing about the Explorer-type models is more agility in the really nasty stuff. But, those types of bikes may not be the best compromise for rides with trials friends such as our Moab or Silverton stints where we reel in lots of terrain and about 150 miles a day. Now a group of all Explorer-type bikes could redefine what a ride is, staying closer to the unload point and exploring areas in much greater detail. Actually, I'd prefer that to reeling in 4 high passes in a day and being so focused on staying alive that it's tunnel vision time. Perhaps the only way to force this is to have only Explorer-type bikes, hoping the riding buddies buy into the same.

motobene screwed with this post 11-21-2013 at 07:21 AM
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Old 11-21-2013, 07:37 AM   #111
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Nice motobene... I am with you on the less "focused on staying alive that it's tunnel vision time" more into the "staying closer to the unload point and exploring areas in much greater detail"

I do love my 650 and it has some ups like much less lbs than a KLR but my G650X is 318lbs dry and that's still a lot of bike on a trail.

Here I am on a 4 day ADV ride with my daughter on the back. (was great fun!)


We have started making small changes to my wife's CRF230L to make it a little more trials like and its much better already so at 275lbs dry its better than my X but still needs suspension changes to really do well.

Wife on the same ADV ride on her bike. (she wants to do it again next summer)
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Old 11-21-2013, 10:23 AM   #112
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What I really like about the Explorer is the super light weight.
It is some 40 lbs lighter than the two stroke Freeride. 75 lbs lighter than my 300 XCW. That is a huge difference!
It doesn't carry a lot of fuel, but the 40 mile ride the other day was still fine. I have an acerbis handlebar fuel tank, but have not installed it (and may not) right now I just bring a bottle of fuel along, I'm going to bring along a bit of oil, so if a 4-stroker has lots of fuel I could steal some.

Rides at speed along the gravel roads were just fine, gearing is plenty tall on the top two gears.
Going up some fast hills I expected to be left behind, but was right there. It does an amazing amount if things.

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Old 11-21-2013, 11:50 AM   #113
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Sounds great, wish I had a comparison X-Ride report to see if its in the same class but with this info I am siding on an Explorer and am sure I wouldn't be disappointed if I do.

Still maybe 1 to 2 years out befor I could buy anyway so isn't critical but still great to know.
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Old 11-21-2013, 12:15 PM   #114
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There is a dealer in eastern Washington also
Stranger creek OSSA. strangercreekossa@hughes.net

Tell him I sent ya!

I really like my 300, but I'm having more fun with the OSSA. It certainly doesn't have the high end power of the 300 (not even close) but for riding in total control it is fantastic!
I haven't even started the 300 since I got the Explorer.

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Old 11-21-2013, 02:37 PM   #115
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Thanks for the info, will keep that handy for what I hope is the near future.
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Old 11-21-2013, 06:38 PM   #116
motobene
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Originally Posted by jonnyc21 View Post
Nice motobene... I am with you on the less "focused on staying alive that it's tunnel vision time" more into the "staying closer to the unload point and exploring areas in much greater detail"

I do love my 650 and it has some ups like much less lbs than a KLR but my G650X is 318lbs dry and that's still a lot of bike on a trail.
Hard to get dualsporters to slow down and take in the scenery. I'm as bad as any of them. Thing slow down when I explore on a trials bike. Maybe a solid group of Explorer types would see the whole group smell the roses. Maybe not... we'd be challenging each other with terrain gnarliness. More tunnel vision!

I have great admiration for the fuel injected Rotax 650 in the BMW, whether Austrian made or the later, black painted Kymco version. Very nice, smooth motor. My wife has long had the F series GS:



A little too complicated (somewhat a pain to maintain0, heavy, but really fuel efficient and torqy. Very low vibration, as in almost none. She really loves it. She can sit and be flat footed with modest lowering links. When we camp and ride, I embarrassed to say she carries 70% of the goods and still gets 20 mpg more than my KLR does.

I don't know the G series well. Sounds somewhat lighter than the old F model, but still a big bike.
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Old 11-21-2013, 08:16 PM   #117
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...Maybe a solid group of Explorer types would see the whole group smell the roses. Maybe not... we'd be challenging each other with terrain gnarliness. More tunnel vision!

I have great admiration for the fuel injected Rotax 650 in the BMW, whether Austrian made or the later, black painted Kymco version. Very nice, smooth motor. My wife has long had the F series GS: ...

...I don't know the G series well. Sounds somewhat lighter than the old F model, but still a big bike.

Just a different kind of tunnel vision might just be the case.

I also agree the Rotax is great all around and love the low vibration. My X Challenge has the Austrian version witch I like, but would have been happy with the other...

The G650X Challenge, was only in the US for 2007 (They had the X Country from 07 to 09).

As indicated above its 318lbs dry over the 386 of the F, 68lbs less is nice. It's extra tall however and even at 5' 10" with a 31" inseam and low seat its a stretch to the ground. (previous owner put a longer shock in the rear too.) ...worth while upgrade over stock but could live without the extra stretch... and I think the only other notable differences would be the smaller fuel tank at 2.4 (had to add the TT tank for 6.6 total now), fuel mapping and flywheel changes, and resulting power output of 280W over the F's 400W alternator.

Over all it was well worth it for me to get the bike and if I had more $ I would just add an OSSA or X-Ride to the stable...
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Old 11-22-2013, 08:21 AM   #118
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Originally Posted by jonnyc21 View Post
Just a different kind of tunnel vision might just be the case.

I also agree the Rotax is great all around and love the low vibration. My X Challenge has the Austrian version witch I like, but would have been happy with the other...

The G650X Challenge, was only in the US for 2007 (They had the X Country from 07 to 09).

As indicated above its 318lbs dry over the 386 of the F, 68lbs less is nice. It's extra tall however and even at 5' 10" with a 31" inseam and low seat its a stretch to the ground. (previous owner put a longer shock in the rear too.) ...worth while upgrade over stock but could live without the extra stretch... and I think the only other notable differences would be the smaller fuel tank at 2.4 (had to add the TT tank for 6.6 total now), fuel mapping and flywheel changes, and resulting power output of 280W over the F's 400W alternator.

Over all it was well worth it for me to get the bike and if I had more $ I would just add an OSSA or X-Ride to the stable...
Interesting. I thought the G series would not do well in the US, especially with a 2.5 gallon tank. Most Americans think the F model is a women's bike only. That's sad because it's one of the best and most practical BMWs ever, and plenty fast. The heftier F version is better for distance riding than the G models, however, and that's a bigger market for BMW. I'm glad you have a G. They are rare in this country.

I looked over photos of the Sherco X-Ride and the Ossa Explorer. In discussions these are characterized as the same type of motorycle, but they are not. The Exporer is a trials bike with the seat area enlarged. The X-Ride is a light dualsport with the Sherco trials engine fitted. The Sherco does not use the trials component set and perhaps they do change the gearbox? The X-Ride has its own forks, brakes, swing arm, etc.

The difference approach of these two is seen in the weight. The Explorer is 40 pounds lighter due to the more spindly trials components. The X-Ride being from a dualsport format will have peg position and overall ergonomics of a dualsport. The explorer would make a better super-gnarly single track bike, and the X-Ride might be better for doing less gnarly single track and sit down distance riding. You could ride in your Explorer in a trial, but the X-Ride won't be nearly as home there.

I looked also at the Ossa Enduro. That model jumps over the X-Ride and gets into Sherco 300i and the GasGas 300 territory. The X-Ride is the more unique bike in that it is the first small dualsport with a trials bike engine (unless I missed one). The Explorer is from a concept already established, that of a trials bike with a bigger seat.

I'd absolutely love to do a real reviews, but that is not done so much these days, unfortunately. Real reviews are rarely done with bikes in this very low market share category, and we are often left only with is spam from factories re printed, and guesses as to how they might fit our real desires and terrain.

motobene screwed with this post 11-22-2013 at 08:41 AM
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Old 11-22-2013, 10:49 AM   #119
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Dual sport with a trials engine... Gas Gas Pampara maybe?
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Old 11-23-2013, 09:15 AM   #120
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Dual sport with a trials engine... Gas Gas Pampara maybe?
Yup, sorry. I missed that one. Nothing new under the sun, as they say. But isn't the Pampera out of production? I don't see it offered.

The Pampera is a smaller dualsport with the older GasGas engine. Not a bad motor, but heavier and the clutch isn't the best. The specs from GasGas (some sites anyway) were conspicuously not listing the weight. I'd guess between 215 and 230 pounds.

So the Sherco remains unique in that it has a more updated 2 stroke trials-based engine.

The newer Beta Alp 200 (4 stroke) is another small dualsport with possible Chinese engine. It weighs 240 pounds.

The Beta Alp 4.0 is a 293 pound dualsport based on a Chinese knockoff of the Suzuki DR350 engine, or perhaps it is still made by Suzuki?

I see GasGas has a 300 and a 450 4 stroke Enduro bike for 2014. They don't highlight the engine in the brochure, so maybe they don't make it? Very nice looking bikes though.

The Explorer is more like the Scorpa Long Ride SY250, a trials bike with more substantial seating area.

motobene screwed with this post 11-24-2013 at 07:37 AM
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