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Old 09-22-2013, 08:19 PM   #3361
bwalsh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Center-stand View Post
You really should read the thread and understand that this was a rhetorical question based on comments by bwalsh, Gummee and others.

I can't believe that anyone would show so much stupidity to comment when they don't have a reference to the context of the question.

..

It wasn't a rhetorical question. You made it sound like the vehicle wasn't going to slow down no matter what...which is just ridiculous.

Quote:
"So he is close enough that you hear him. He's not slowing down. And then you move into the center of the lane.
"He will then slow down" should come after your last sentence.

If there is a deer in the road do you slow down, or not? If there is a person in the road do you slow down, or not? If there is a car stopped in the road do you slow down, or not?

Is this really this hard to comprehend?
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Old 09-22-2013, 08:31 PM   #3362
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Originally Posted by Dranrab Luap View Post
Have you not been paying attention? People who don't ride bicycles are telling you that you cannot hear vehicles coming up behind you.
If they can hear me why do they just sit there when I am right behind them until I blow the horn? I have sat behind for 30 seconds and more waiting when I haven't been in a hurry. Then they get pissed when I do that, which shows that I surprised them. What you are saying doesn't conform to reality.

I never got an answer to what I should do when I get one of these cyclists sitting in the middle of the lane. I can't beep them because they get pissed that I scared them, I cant overtake them because their lane positioning means that they might be turning. I can't undertake them because that is illegal. What do you want other road users to do?

Vertical C screwed with this post 09-22-2013 at 08:39 PM
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Old 09-22-2013, 08:42 PM   #3363
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..

Yes bwalsh. Haven't we been through this. You think pulling in front of a vehicle that you perceive as going too fast a smart move, and you think I have a comprehension problem??? Rhetorical, no need to answer. I'm not really sure how I can make it sound like a vehicle is not going to slow down. Most will slow down after striking a bike rider, but some don't. I'm just saying I wouldn't bet my life on a stranger in a fast moving vehicle.

And K7, I really don't mind the answer to the rhetorical question, you just need to know that it wasn't me who thought it was a good idea to slow speeding vehicles by moving to the center of the lane. Go back and read it then call someone else stupid. You may be correct that the scenario was dreamed up, but if so, it was dreamed up by Gummee, post #3234, not me.

..
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Old 09-22-2013, 09:05 PM   #3364
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Its also stupid when a motorcycle can easily get past a cycle in their lane, still leaving a metre without even crossing to the other side. Why is this "slowing down" and traffic management even necessary at all?
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Old 09-22-2013, 09:25 PM   #3365
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Originally Posted by Vertical C View Post
If they can hear me why do they just sit there when I am right behind them until I blow the horn? I have sat behind for 30 seconds and more waiting when I haven't been in a hurry. Then they get pissed when I do that, which shows that I surprised them. What you are saying doesn't conform to reality.

I never got an answer to what I should do when I get one of these cyclists sitting in the middle of the lane. I can't beep them because they get pissed that I scared them, I cant overtake them because their lane positioning means that they might be turning. I can't undertake them because that is illegal. What do you want other road users to do?
given there is nothing that would leave them no "out" and they could move over, I'd blow the horn until they moved, no doubt, that's an azzhole cyclist.
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Old 09-22-2013, 09:39 PM   #3366
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Originally Posted by fltplan View Post
given there is nothing that would leave them no "out" and they could move over, I'd blow the horn until they moved, no doubt, that's an azzhole cyclist.
That is what I have settled on, it just happens a lot on the scooter, that thing is quiet. It is annoying as it doesn't accelerate that fast so getting slowed down each time before I work out that they are using hearing sucks.

It is just frustrrating when some mirrors and courtesy could prevent it.
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Old 09-22-2013, 09:46 PM   #3367
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Originally Posted by Vertical C View Post
That is what I have settled on, it just happens a lot on the scooter, that thing is quiet. It is annoying as it doesn't accelerate that fast so getting slowed down each time before I work out that they are using hearing sucks.

It is just frustrrating when some mirrors and courtesy could prevent it.
yeah, the mirrors are a personal thing for cyclist. I can see where a scooter would have some issues on a daily basis. You need a some kind of unique sound that will let them know you are there. I don't think cyclists all getting mirrors is going to happen anytime soon.

when I started thinking about people reaching for their cell phones and then texting and narrow roads where I liked to ride, I threw in the towel.
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Old 09-22-2013, 10:15 PM   #3368
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Originally Posted by fltplan View Post

when I started thinking about people reaching for their cell phones and then texting and narrow roads where I liked to ride, I threw in the towel.
Have to agree that cycling on the roads seems very trusting of cars. As a motorcyclists/scooterist, I am scared of being hit from behind when stopped. I could never just ride along not knowing what was behind me. Too much trust in drivers who take no care.

There are plenty of other ways to get fit.
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Old 09-23-2013, 03:09 AM   #3369
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Even if you drive a large truck, you have no choice but depend on drivers behind you paying attention to one degree or another.

If nothing else, by being in the lane you are an obstacle that the driver must deal with. While not ideal, it's a better situation than having the driver go past as if you aren't there and leaving you 20 or 30 cm in the middle of a corner.

No one is saying you shouldn't have a "plan B" in mind and ready to execute, however. Mirrors help immensely for that, and I spend a lot of time scanning the road behind with mine when I hear a motorized vehicle approaching.

If the driver is not paying attention, then all bets are off anyway, and you aren't any better off on the side of the road than anywhere else.

For me, this got illustrated very indelibly Saturday, as I was on that now famous bridge about 5 minutes behind the texting driver that killed two people on the opposite side of the road. After taking out the bicyclists on the left, she plowed through several right hand shoulder markers and a large sign.

As for riders who are just sitting in the road, for no apparent reason, sure give them a honk, but step out of your own head just a little to try and figure out if there is some good reason they are there.
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Old 09-23-2013, 05:22 AM   #3370
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Originally Posted by Center-stand View Post
..

Yes bwalsh. Haven't we been through this. You think pulling in front of a vehicle that you perceive as going too fast a smart move, and you think I have a comprehension problem???

..
Yes I do. Your comprehension skills are seriously lacking...

You keep making it sound like we're darting out in front of a speeding vehicle. We're talking moving over into the lane WELL BEFORE the vehicle reaches you...when it still has plenty of time to SEE and REACT to the situation.
COMMON SENSE would dictate NOT to do this at the last minute...like you keep eluding to.
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Old 09-23-2013, 05:25 AM   #3371
bwalsh
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Originally Posted by Vertical C View Post
Why is this "slowing down" and traffic management even necessary at all?
Go back and read the 220+ previous pages. Its been explained in detail at least 205 times(literally).
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Old 09-23-2013, 05:56 AM   #3372
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bwalsh View Post
Go back and read the 220+ previous pages. Its been explained in detail at least 205 times(literally).
In a perfect world where there's no conflict, there wouldn't be a need to protect yourself from others.

Sadly, that's not the world we inhabit.

I keep repeating that I'm not doing anything on a bicycle that any smart person would do on a moto: I'm trying to be conspicuous, safe, and get down the road with minimal fuss. ...I just don't have a throttle to get out of trouble with, so I'm stuck being passed over, and over, and...

For the most part, people are pretty good about passing where its safe, even on the little 2-lane roads I ride. There's that last X% that just haven't thought that 30sec ahead tho. You know... the whole 'what if there's something coming around that corner?' or 'what if there's something coming over the crest of the hill?'

I can't help it if someone else makes a bad decision. I can only help them make better decisions by lane positioning and hand/arm signals. I've only had it happen a few times when there WAS something coming when someone decided to pass me well onto the other side of the road, so obviously lane positioning and arm/hand signals only go so far.

AFA bicycles 'in the way' you need to remember that according to ALL the state laws I've read (and I've read a few) state that when its unsafe, the bicycle gets the whole lane. Unsafe = when a car and a bicycle aren't able to share the lane due to debris, bad roads, or other conditions such as oncoming traffic, etc.

From VA's laws
Quote:
Where to Ride
  • Bicyclists must ride with the flow of traffic on the right side of the highway.
  • Bicyclists operating a bicycle on a roadway at less than the normal speed of traffic at the time and place under conditions then existing shall ride as close as safely practicable to the right curb or edge of roadway. Exceptions to this are when bicyclists are overtaking and passing another vehicle proceeding in the same direction, preparing for a left turn, avoiding unsafe conditions, avoiding riding in a lane that turns or diverges to the right, riding on a one way street where bicyclists may ride as near the left-hand curb or edge of roadway, or when the lane width is too narrow to share with a motor vehicle. Additionally, bicycles are not excluded from riding on the highway shoulder.
Something to keep that in mind next time you're passing a bicycle: if the lane's too narrow to share, THEY have the right to the whole lane. Most times, they'll make it easy to get around, but they don't *have* to. Its the passing drivers' responsibility to get around safely.



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Old 09-23-2013, 06:40 AM   #3373
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Originally Posted by bwalsh View Post
Go back and read the 220+ previous pages. Its been explained in detail at least 205 times(literally).
I mean for motorcyclists/scooters. We can fit past you without going on the other side but still leave room for safety, so why be a douchebag to us?

This is a motorcycle forum so if you want to instruct cagers you would be better off on a cager forum.
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Old 09-23-2013, 06:53 AM   #3374
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Originally Posted by Vertical C View Post
I mean for motorcyclists/scooters. We can fit past you without going on the other side but still leave room for safety, so why be a douchebag to us?
That's your interpretation. There's typically no 'being' involved. Its just just people riding along and your interpretations of their actions may or may not be accurate. In fact, I would posit (based on your posts) that you're the one being a douchebag to the cyclists.

Think about your actions and words and examine what you've done. Would you do those same actions if it was YOUR wife/daughter/son/etc?

Would you say the same things if it was YOUR family member riding a bicycle down the road in a similar fashion?

Somehow I doubt it. So why is it OK to do it to someone else's family member?

I don't want to hear any of that 'MY family member wouldn't...' crap. Everyone riding a bicycle is going to do stuff that 'you' don't approve of. EVEN your precious snowflake.

Quote:
This is a motorcycle forum so if you want to instruct cagers you would be better off on a cager forum.
...or... since we all ride motos here and *most* of us also drive, let's keep discussing it here.

Notice I said 'discuss.' I didn't say 'insult.' I didn't say 'troll.' I said discuss: as in 'hey, I came across some cyclists in the road today, why are they riding like that?' If you read the answers with an open mind, you may just find out that things aren't so much different on a pushie bike than on a moto. The same stuff drivers pull (yes, you too!) to pushies, they do to motos too. Just go read 'face plant' if you doubt me.

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Old 09-23-2013, 07:08 AM   #3375
bwalsh
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Originally Posted by Vertical C View Post
I mean for motorcyclists/scooters. We can fit past you without going on the other side but still leave room for safety, so why be a douchebag to us?

This is a motorcycle forum so if you want to instruct cagers you would be better off on a cager forum.
Somewhere back in this thread we started talking about Cages...the number one vehicle that might pose a serious problem. I mean really, are you implying we are talking about taking the lane in front of two wheeled vehicles?
I don't believe anyone else here has been using motorcycles or scooters as an example as they pose little threat because of their width. Besides if you can't zip by a bicycle or two on a motorcycle, in a safe place, you shouldn't be on the road.
Just because its a motorcycle forum doesn't mean we eat breath and excrete motorcycles. Following your guidelines as for what can and can't be posted on a "motorcycle" forum, the theads would be cut by 50%.
Is that the reason for all your angst? A bicycle thread in a motorcycle forum? Kinda like a scooter thread in a "motorcycle" forum, eh?
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