regulator question

[Uller]

My other ride is a 690 and I just went through the issue of a faulty regulator/rectifier. I was directed toward the Mosfet Style of R/R instead of the Sunt style as a possible upgrade/solution.

I initally purchased the "Kit" from this guy: http://roadstercycle.com/Shindengen%...rade%20kit.htm

but didn't like the breaker (vs. fuse) in his wiring for the wet pacific NW so I ended up getting some electrical components from this guy: http://www.easternbeaver.com/Main/El...onnectors.html

and would just get the entire thing from him in the future if I did it again. (very prompt service for a large order of many small pieces)

gefr - you get rid of that crappy connector all together and make solder connections to the wires to the stator. In its place you have a much better sealed unit and you can locate it anywhere on your bike you want. I plan on converting my 950 as soon as funds allow and think that I'll end up moving at least the starter relay, and maybe the R/R too, to a much more dry environment.

I can tell you that the hole spacings in the Mosfet unit are the same as the stock unit so, it will bolt right up however, you have additional space requirements due to the connectors. I'm not sure if they would conflict with the skid plate/gas tank or not.

[gefr]

I know from the mechanics they avoid soldering connections cause they tend to create stiff parts on the wires. That makes the ending of the soldering prone to cut, due to vibrations.
Humidity doesn't seem to be a problem, since the OEM R/R get submerged often. Heat is their major problem as they produce their share as well, but better placement is a good idea.
Cheers.

[Uller]

Originally Posted by gefr

I know from the mechanics they avoid soldering connections cause they tend to create stiff parts on the wires. That makes the ending of the soldering prone to cut, due to vibrations.
Humidity doesn't seem to be a problem, since the OEM R/R get submarined often. Heat is their major problem as they produce their share as well, but better placement is a good idea.
Cheers.

I do believe that no solder is SOP for airline electrical systems. I use waterproof heat shrink on each connection and then again on the outer cover. That stuff is rigid and would probably be enough to hold the wires together by itself. I have absolutely no worries about my soldered connection.

In regards to the humidity, I was mainly referring to; a. that stock electrical connector going to the stator. It isn't a sealed unit and every one I have looked in was full of crap and had the wires starting to corrode. and b. The starter relay has been the culprit for many on here with running issues. It seems there is a thin piece of wire which corrodes. I've seen it in a few threads and in the HOW.

When I was researching the R/R units I found a vat of info on Triumph forums. They were using the same (or very similar) shunt style R/R. So many of them were failing that Triumph warrantied them. Anyhow, in laymens terms, what I got was that the shunt style do not work very efficiently. The higher the rpm of the motor the more voltage is put out by the stator. The shunt style will have to work harder due to the increased load and will actually allow less voltage to the battery than at idle. Basically their technology is crap and they fail due to internal heat and poor components not really external heat from the motor and being in an enclosed environment (sure this doesn't help though). Plus, when they fail it is very irregular and in spikes that ruin other components and the battery. It certainly isn't good for the 990 folks with all the sensors. It can lead to running issues IMO.

[Colorado Uli]

Originally Posted by K2m

Nice one Ken

This is nothing like the Chinese rubbish that I tried

The KTM ones do not last long enough. This looks to be a good solution to an on going problem.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/YAMAHA-SH...item588d8645ad

Or maybe the kit

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI...DER:SIMPLEITEM

Might just grab one

Outstanding! I've also replaced my RR twice already and (obviously) have some trust issues with the current one. Everytime one goes out I get straded somewhere and am out a battery, RR, hotel costs, transportation, etc.
I'm in on this one!

Thanks!

[Pax]

If you install will you do a write-up?

I'm thinking this needs to be on the winter work checklist before adding a new Shorai battery.

-pax

[Colorado Uli]

Originally Posted by Pax

If you install will you do a write-up?

I'm thinking this needs to be on the winter work checklist before adding a new Shorai battery.

-pax

You bet.

[gefr]

My 2 months old no name Chinese battery couldn't start my engine in the morning after being ridden the previous midday. The temperature was at 4C. After installing a Shindengen rectifier, the battery works at 0,5C after resting for the same half day. I wonder if it can perform if left for 2 days.
Cheers.

[GZERO]

Whatever happend to the people that tried the MOSFET RR??
i'm really interested!

[Colorado Uli]

Haven't gotten around to it yet.
Thanks for the reminder though.

[Shov3BR]

Our booth was next to Rick's Motorsports Electrics at the Powersports Dealer Expo last weekend. That gave us 4 days to pick his brain about how to improve the charging system on our KTM 990. It actually took 5 seconds for Rick to respond, "put a MOSFET VRR on it."
When we got home I sent him pics of the existing regulator and the relevant part of the KTM wiring diagram.
Rick supplies a VRR that has the wires potted directly into the VRR like the OEM unit. This eliminates one connection. This is especially important as the VRR is located low on the frame where it gets submerged in mud and water. He also recommends connecting directly to the battery with a fused connection. After reviewing the KTM wiring diagram it appeared that the existing 30A fuse was downstream of the high power connection point so he eliminated the fuse holder and terminated the output wire with a 6mm ring terminal.
It turns out that the KTM wiring diagram doesn't accurately reflect the 2011 990 wiring and the fuse was not located where it provided the proper protection so we added one ourselves.

One minor screw up on our part: Rick installs cable jacket on all wires but I forgot to replace it after adding the fuse holder. No biggie; I just put some split loom on the wire during installation. Here is the VRR Rick built up for us (left) along side the OEM part (right). Again note that when we installed the fuse holder we inadvertently left off the cable jacket that Rick had provided:



The installation was a snap as the VRR bolts up directly to the KTM bracket. Some quick cable routing and some cable ties and it was done. Note the corrugated split loom that we had to install to replace the cable jacket that we forgot to install when we added the fuse holder.



We put the fuse near the end of the output wire so it wound up near the original 30A fuse (the green just above the fuse holder). We filled the OEM output connector with E6000 (GOOP) to keep out moisture and crud and strapped it to its original clip with a cable tie (just to the right of the green 30A fuse). .



The bike is all in pieces getting it ready for a big ride but we don't expect any surprises when we fire it up.

You can find Rick's Motorsports Electrics here.
http://www.ricksmotorsportelectrics.com/

Rick just reported back that he will have units in stock by the first week of March. These VRRs will have the fuse holder and fuse installed. Part number is 10-13H and retail pricing is $150.

Note: Neither I nor 3BR Powersports have any connection to Rick's Motorsports Electrics. They are just good folks who we met for the first time at the Powersports Dealer Expo and have provided some cool parts for our KTM.

-Shov (3BR Powersports, LLC)

[Colorado Uli]

Very cool indeed.
I just emailed Rick to ask if he'd consider making ones for the 950 SE. I'm guessing that the only difference is in the wire length - so I'm getting ready to take my OEM unit out and taking some pictures and measurements for him.

[It'sNotTheBike]

Maybe some of you who seem to believe the voltage regulator from
Rick's is a good part just don't know any better.

Well, I DO know better.

I bought a regulator from Rick's and I can say with authority that it is cheaply made
substandard crap, and almost certainly it was sourced in China, though conveniently
enough there is no label or imprint which would indicate the country in which
the regulator was manufactured ( perhaps they know they have something to be ashamed
of, like selling drywall made from industrial waste or selling pet food with enough melamine
in it to cause kidney failure of pets people loved dearly. China is a good example of
what happens when morals and ethics take a back seat to the desire to make money. Sadly,
there are some Americans who are only too happy to help the Chinese play this shabby little
game ).


Here is a dose of reality about the voltage regulator from Rick's Motorsport Electrics :

1) the wiring in the regulator is aluminum, not copper. The wiring is also undersized
compared to the OEM wiring, and when the wiring is aluminum that is much worse
than if it was made of copper.

2) the ring terminals which are meant to attach to the battery terminals are undersized
and are made of thin metal which is plated but which is not copper. It's cheesy
stuff, like you'd expect on a toy, but not on a motorcycle you spent a lot
of money to buy and want to maintain properly.

3) best ( worst ) of all, the regulator was defective out of the box. Wow, who doesn't want
to waste time on parts that don't work, that's much better than being able to ride, right ?


If you want to believe the voltage regulator sold by Rick's is as good as an OEM
Japanese Shindingen, you are free to do so, but it is FAR from the equivalent quality. The
internet has given rise to companies which will sell cheap crap to make a buck, but we who
participate on these forums can help each other by making such things known.

I'd be ashamed to sell crap like the regulator I received from Rick's. I have no hidden
agenda, nor do I have any affiliation with any company which makes or sells motorcycle
parts. I just detest cheap crap which a seller claims to be good equipment, and I detest
such sellers too.

You are all free to spend your money as you see fit. I will never do business
with Rick's again, because I see them for what they are, which is a reseller of poor
quality parts for which they charge premium prices.

I hope this post can save someone else from the hassle and wasted time I
have experienced.



.

[Vicks]

Originally Posted by Pax

If you install will you do a write-up?

I'm thinking this needs to be on the winter work checklist before adding a new Shorai battery.

-pax

Here is an excellent writeup by AdvGa on how to install an Original SHINDENGEN RR (used on several YAMAHA road bikes including FJR, R1 etc - RR model no. FH020).

DIY baby !!!

[LukasM]

Originally Posted by It'sNotTheBike

Maybe some of you who seem to believe the voltage regulator from
Rick's is a good part just don't know any better.

Well, I DO know better.

I bought a regulator from Rick's and I can say with authority that it is cheaply made
substandard crap, and almost certainly it was sourced in China, though conveniently
enough there is no label or imprint which would indicate the country in which
the regulator was manufactured ( perhaps they know they have something to be ashamed
of, like selling drywall made from industrial waste or selling pet food with enough melamine
in it to cause kidney failure of pets people loved dearly. China is a good example of
what happens when morals and ethics take a back seat to the desire to make money. Sadly,
there are some Americans who are only too happy to help the Chinese play this shabby little
game ).


Here is a dose of reality about the voltage regulator from Rick's Motorsport Electrics :

1) the wiring in the regulator is aluminum, not copper. The wiring is also undersized
compared to the OEM wiring, and when the wiring is aluminum that is much worse
than if it was made of copper.

2) the ring terminals which are meant to attach to the battery terminals are undersized
and are made of thin metal which is plated but which is not copper. It's cheesy
stuff, like you'd expect on a toy, but not on a motorcycle you spent a lot
of money to buy and want to maintain properly.

3) best ( worst ) of all, the regulator was defective out of the box. Wow, who doesn't want
to waste time on parts that don't work, that's much better than being able to ride, right ?


If you want to believe the voltage regulator sold by Rick's is as good as an OEM
Japanese Shindingen, you are free to do so, but it is FAR from the equivalent quality. The
internet has given rise to companies which will sell cheap crap to make a buck, but we who
participate on these forums can help each other by making such things known.

I'd be ashamed to sell crap like the regulator I received from Rick's. I have no hidden
agenda, nor do I have any affiliation with any company which makes or sells motorcycle
parts. I just detest cheap crap which a seller claims to be good equipment, and I detest
such sellers too.

You are all free to spend your money as you see fit. I will never do business
with Rick's again, because I see them for what they are, which is a reseller of poor
quality parts for which they charge premium prices.

I hope this post can save someone else from the hassle and wasted time I
have experienced.



.

Can't say I am very surprised. I have been recommending the Shindengen MOSFETs for a while now as they have a spotless track record. Yet people are buying from Rick's at a more expensive price, with a worse connector on it for one, and apparently other trade-offs as you now mention. Let's see if there will be more failures of them showing up.

[ebrabaek]

I do not have the orange bike, But I would like to offer some assistance. It seems like both of us have issues with the oem R/R, and as they both come with shunt type, they are not mosfet from the factory. About 6 months ago I jumped, I believe the first beta tester on the mosfet on the F8GS side, and have since read this post. It seems like our bikes share a common undervolting story, and the mosfet fixed it for me, as would in on your bike as well. After reading this, I believe that the hookup are the same, which means the install and testing I wrote up would work on your bikes as well, so I thought I'd share.....

http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=781564