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Old 12-17-2011, 07:34 AM   #61
dc1450
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Actually it won't be that big, or that cool. What Harley needs is an entry level motorcycle to replace the Blast. They need it for their Rider's Edge course. Harley can't very well offer a premium motorcycle riding course on another manufacturer's motorcycle. Therefore, it HAS to be under 500ccs per MSF regs. Hopefully it will be more marketable than the Blast. That is to say, better looking. The Blast as a basic motorcycle is a great bike. It's bulletproof, durable, doesn't scratch and replacement parts are cheap. But lets face it, it's beyond homely.
The Sprint that this thread started with is probably the closest guess so far.

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Old 12-17-2011, 07:54 AM   #62
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what does hd (or it's customers) have against p-twins ? seems like they could get a ninja-sized p-twin and still retain some of the big-tank looks, along with enticing some younger guys. (if younger guys have the credit)

i wonder if the price-point would be the downfall, in comparing with the jap bikes ?

i dunno, it's just cold outside and i can't ride till later today... so i'm killing an hour or three.
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Old 12-17-2011, 08:37 AM   #63
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Originally Posted by skierd View Post
Thats kinda what I was recommending way back on pg1. I keep looking at the sportster and can't help but wonder where the extra 50-100 pounds are hiding. I loved the test ride of a nightster I took, once I fixed it ergonomically for me it would be a great bike, but mentally I don't want a bike that heavy.

The weight difference between solid mounted and the new rubber mounted frames is not that great. For instance the wet weight of the older (pre rubber mount) is 518lbs while the new Superlow 883 is 563. It would not be hard for HD to build a lighter weight Sportster. Considering the fact that many owners are able to significantly drop the weight of these bikes, doing so at the factory level shouldn't take much work.



On a side note, a lightweight series of standards and dual sports based on the Blast engine would be interesting.
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Old 12-17-2011, 09:00 AM   #64
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Originally Posted by Ginger Beard View Post
So you also dislike the Bonneville, Royal Enfield , Suzuki TU250 , Ural, or any bike that has a classic design ? That makes me sad..
You mis-read: I love the Sportster. What's sad for me is that HD didn't and so I believe, it as a contender for "something different" is unlikely.
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Old 12-17-2011, 11:06 AM   #65
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Originally Posted by dc1450 View Post
...Harley can't very well offer a premium motorcycle riding course on another manufacturer's motorcycle. Therefore, it HAS to be under 500ccs per MSF regs.
You'd think HD could drop a cylinder on a Sporty easy enough and make it a 441.5cc.
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Old 12-17-2011, 12:43 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by ChainSaw View Post
You'd think HD could drop a cylinder on a Sporty easy enough and make it a 441.5cc.
They already have (had?) the tooling to mfg a single.



These folks are taking credit for the design:
http://www.design-concepts.com/portf...n-blast-engine

Maybe Erik Buell owns the rights to the motor and won't let H-D use it? That would be rather ironic.

cheers,
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Old 12-17-2011, 01:47 PM   #67
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I haven't read every post in this thread, so someone may have already suggested it, but I think HD should buy Moto Guzzi. Think about it. It's a brand with heritage and style that the HD crowd could probably learn to love, the bikes have character, and it gives MG an instant dealer presence in the US.
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Old 12-17-2011, 01:58 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by PassTheGravy View Post
I haven't read every post in this thread, so someone may have already suggested it, but I think HD should buy Moto Guzzi. Think about it. It's a brand with heritage and style that the HD crowd could probably learn to love, the bikes have character, and it gives MG an instant dealer presence in the US.
That's actually a pretty interesting idea. I really like the Norge, but I wouldn't go near one given the sparse MG dealer presence. Then again, given the disservice the dealers did to Buell, I can't see MG fairing much better.
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Old 12-17-2011, 03:15 PM   #69
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HD buy Guzzi? Poor Moto Guzzi has enough problelms, If Harley would buy 'em they would do just like they did with MV, sit there staring at the model line trying to figure out how to put hi-way pegs and handle bar streamers on them and then sell the company off because it "doesn't fit with the lifestyle" or some bullshit while trying to figure out what the hell happened just now? I'm not knocking HD at all, I've had several over the years the last being an XLCR Cafe Racer (and still would have it if some POS did'nt steal it) and loved the hell out of them. Why don't they do something really novel, like look at what people are riding, not just Harley people, but all motorcyclists and start with a clean sheet of paper. I can't beleave there would be a shortage young gun designers/engineers who would'nt jump at the chance to come up with HDs version the next 350/450 Honda. I know they would probobly have to be made off shore to be affordable, Lord knows it's not easey, but does Harley really have to use somebody elses design when they have a perfectly good 500 single? Hell imagine the product line they could have, dual sport, cruiser, commuter, standard, cafe (GB 500 comes to mind), even a baby dresser. Anybody remember all the tarted up CB 350 Hondas running around back in the 70's?
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Old 12-17-2011, 05:06 PM   #70
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Buying another brand makes A LOT of sense to me. Much like they did with Buell. But, love them or hate them, Buells were a bit, well, weird. But Buell did have a pretty broad product line. I have actually never set foot in a Harley dealer. Not because I think they're bad bikes, but because I'm not interested in anything they sell. But if they had a totally distinct product line, I might go in to see those bikes. While I'm in there, the seeds may get planted for a HD down the line. Or maybe I would go there for clothing and accessories or service. Come to think of it, the closest dealer and biggest dealer to me is the HD dealer. But the thought of going there for accessories never enters my mind.

In addition, having a distinct product line keeps them from having to dilute the Harley image (which is their biggest asset).

Heck, Harley could have bought the Indian name and used that as their entry brand. They would still have an iconic American name. I don't think anybody would care if Indian now made crotch rockets, standards, and dual sports - particularly if they could claim some American parts or assembly.

If the HD dealers had an Indian badged standard or sport tourer - that would get me through their front doors.

Of course, buying a name doesn't get you a ready made production process. And as big as HD is, I don't know that they would want to start building plants and designing whole new bikes at this point.
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Old 12-17-2011, 08:09 PM   #71
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I seriously doubt anything lighter, cheaper or smaller is coming anytime soon from Harley.

I hope I'm wrong.

BUT!!!

Nobody is buying any of the available "starter standards" from any other manufacturer. Honda, Suzuki, Yamaha etc... can't give one away.

How many Bonnevilles vs. Thruxton has Triumph actually sold?

Harley has had several historical times of diversifying it's market. They have all failed financially when they do.

Everyone is constantly on the "Harley's are too heavy" bullshit argrument for so long, it's like listening to Washington's echos.

Harley's biggest seller is STILL the Sportster. They ain't changin shit about it. The offerings will trend as the market flows. They'll change the color, the shock heights, the nicknames, but it's still a Sportster.

We can't even stand the technical support call centers from India. What makes anyone think the market will accept an Indian built Harley?

They will be decent sellers in third world countries, prolly sell good in Asia, but don't expect to see them embraced here.

Huyosong can't give away a bike. There is no market for another cheap junk bike. NO ONE will think Indian quality is better than Korean.
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Old 12-17-2011, 08:38 PM   #72
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Looks like a mini V-Rod to me. Not that there's anything wrong with that...

That bike would sell if it weighs 400-450 lbs and has 60-75 bhp. If it's liquid-cooled, that shouldn't be a problem.
I'd definitely be interested, changed the seat and bars on my Monster to some similar to the picture and the power and weight specs are in that range and the bike now works great as a standard and sport tourer. It is good to see standards are making a comeback and I hope Harley builds one. REALLY wanted an XR1200 to work for me but the high weight and small tank are dealbreakers so I'm sticking with the Duc for now
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Old 12-18-2011, 06:55 AM   #73
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Originally Posted by Uglyprimate View Post

We can't even stand the technical support call centers from India. What makes anyone think the market will accept an Indian built Harley?

They will be decent sellers in third world countries, prolly sell good in Asia, but don't expect to see them embraced here.

Huyosong can't give away a bike. There is no market for another cheap junk bike. NO ONE will think Indian quality is better than Korean.
I'm not sure if that is in response to my post or just a statement. In my post, I stated HD should have bought the Indian brand - a historically American company - not bikes made in India. I was in no way suggesting they import 3rd world knockoffs and just rebadge them. Even as a separate brand, that would backfire on HD.

However, I think if they added a brand that brand would most certainly have imported components to some degree in order to succeed. But if they sold an Indian badged bike with a Rotax motor and some Japanese components and assembled in the US I think it would be a compelling idea.
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Old 12-18-2011, 08:01 AM   #74
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Originally Posted by rocker59 View Post
Many comments about Sportsters in this thread.

I was real disappointed when HD upped the Sporty's weight to 550-lbs + with the rubber mounted frame.

The direction I'd have preferred to see would've been to add counter-balancers to the Sportster's engine, and make the frame and other cycle parts as light as possible. A 450-lbs Sportser would rock...

I'll keep dreaming...
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Old 12-18-2011, 08:52 AM   #75
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Opening Pic

What size was the old Harley thumper in the first shot? My dad had a similar one years ago that I used to ride around on country roads in central Illinois. Fun bike but the shifter was also on the right and had a left side kick starter which kicked back sometimes! I think it was around 350cc or so.

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