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Old 03-12-2012, 06:48 PM   #1
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Honda TLR200 Reflex carb carburetor fix jetting thread.

I recently purchased a Honda TLR200 Reflex. In stock condition the bike is jetted pitifully lean, is hard starting and has poor throttle response, runs hot and will not idle well.

The TLR is not blessed with a common carburetor that takes common jets. So, fixing the carb is a problem and most people resort to putting a CRF or XR100 carb. There are problems with this. For one the air box boot needs to be stretched over the larger intake of the xr/crf carb. It will get around it but you're stretching 24 year old rubber. Damaging it is a concern and your talking about replacing parts on a bike with many obsolete parts. You'll also need a new throttle cable, and there are conflicting reports if a standard xr or crf cable will work. A good used carb will cost you around $70 on eBay (be sure you get the right one!) and the cable will be about $25 before you get jets.

The good news is you can make the stock carb work very well!

Your going to want to get Honda parts:

99124-076-0400 #40 slow jet. This is the most important and hard to find part. It's some odd Keihin slow jet that isn't commonly stocked. Since it's a very important jet at small throttle openings it's very important for a trials bike. I think this part is actually for a CB400F but it works in the strange PO Keihin carb that comes stock on the TLR. I am not arguing.

99101-GHB-1000 #100 Main Jet. I know that most posts list the 105 main jet, but I used a 100 and like it. Also, the main really only comes into full play with the throttle wide open. So, for this bike it doesn't matter too much and it works great in my application.

16012-KJ2-305 which may have been replaced by 16012-KJ2-672 mine came from my local dealer who ordered it as part 16012-KJ2-305 and that what it says on the package but I couldn't find a reference for it on the web. The kit contains a new needle jet and air screw and also a cap for the air screw that will let you manipulate it even though it's behind a frame tube. It was issued by Honda when it became apparent that the stock carb was hopelessly lean.

If you dissemble and clean your carb this will take care of the lean condition and allow you to retain the stock carb. All up parts should cost around $40.



Don't worry too much about the main jet, you really want the #40 slow jet and the needle. That's going to make everything good up to well past 3/4 throttle. With my air screw 1 1/2 turns out the bike starts on one kick from cold with the choke full on and will run almost instantly with the choke closed. It's very responsive and has much better power than I would have thought it could have.

I am new to trials this year and the TLR will serve me as a novice. It's steet legal so I don't need to load it into a truck to take it out of my urban home to practice and I am sure the problems will come from my lack of skill rather than the bikes short comings.

It's already been geared down and I have a set of the B&J "down and wide" footpegs en route. Real trials tires go on next week. I am booked at a one day skills camp.

You may also want a new air cleaner 17211-KJ2-002and carb rebuild kit 16010-107-305. The air filter and gasket kit will set you back a further $18.


Even though I have posted internet links for all the parts, this was for reference. I recommend buying these parts from a local dealer. In my case the shipping made the parts more expensive than the dealer, and I believe in supporting local businesses. After all when I need something quick I want them to be there. Being known at the parts counter is worth something too. Most dealers will give AMA or other club members a 10% discount.

Happy Jetting.

taxonomy screwed with this post 03-14-2012 at 10:07 AM
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Old 03-12-2012, 07:50 PM   #2
neilking
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Thanks man! I'll give that a try.
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Old 03-12-2012, 09:46 PM   #3
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Please post back here when done I'd love to see your result!

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Old 03-13-2012, 02:17 AM   #4
Twin-shocker
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If your TLR has done very low hours from new, and the carb body, slide, needle, needle jet, are not noticeably worn, and you are happy to retain the very restrictive stock air cleaner set up, then changing the jetting will certainly greatly improve TLR's which have been jetted very lean to comply with US emissions rules.

However its worth bearing in mind that a Mikuni pit bike carb from Ebay (about 20 in Uk), and modification of the stock air cleaner set up, will mean increased performance as well as far better running at all engine speeds.
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Old 03-13-2012, 10:08 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Twin-shocker View Post
If your TLR has done very low hours from new, and the carb body, slide, needle, needle jet, are not noticeably worn,
My impression is there are no high mile TLR200s. 3000 would seem a lot for a bike that has an too low seat and really isn't geared for anything over 30 miles. Most seem to be forgotten relics that never really fit in anyplace.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Twin-shocker View Post
and you are happy to retain the very restrictive stock air cleaner set up, then changing the jetting will certainly greatly improve TLR's which have been jetted very lean to comply with US emissions rules.
If I wanted a much more powerful bike I would buy one. For me, the much improved throttle response is fine, but the TLR will never be a fire breather. I just want it to work right.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Twin-shocker View Post
However its worth bearing in mind that a Mikuni pit bike carb from Ebay (about 20 in Uk), and modification of the stock air cleaner set up, will mean increased performance as well as far better running at all engine speeds.
I don't really know, mine is certainly has "increased performance as well as far better running at all engine speeds". The oft recommended replacement is still a 22mm carb, it's just easier to get jets for and a more common and better understood unit. The change in performance was dramatic when I got it set up properly. FWIW it's useing more or less the same jets as I have seen recommended for the Mikuni and or CR/CRF carbs.
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Old 03-13-2012, 12:40 PM   #6
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If your carb is not badly worn and doesnt have a porous float, then changing the jetting will make running much better.
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Old 03-30-2012, 04:42 PM   #7
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Thanks for posting this info! Very helpful rejetting now... And as expected my local shops couldn't get the parts I needed.
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Old 04-19-2012, 09:03 PM   #8
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Well got my pilot and needle (finally) but no time to test it yet. The main I ordered is on back order, and my forks are in a million little pieces all over the workbench waiting (impatiently) for oil/dust seals to arrive from another vendor. Will post up with results as soon as I get the thing all back in one piece.
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Old 04-20-2012, 11:07 AM   #9
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Well crap... My petcock is leaking pretty bad. I ground the rivets out and pulled the rubber out and it is pretty fooked. Tried rebuilding it but its trashed. Anyone know a direct bolt on petcock replacement from another model machine? Gonna head down to the motorcycle salvage place in town to see what they got in stock.
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Old 04-21-2012, 07:19 AM   #10
dean-o
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pilot from 70's cb400f ss

like it in mine & shimmed the needle up about .025"
simple, fun ride...
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Old 05-25-2012, 08:13 PM   #11
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Pilot seemed just right running really good. Found a petcock that bolted right up.

Seems a little flat with the supplied needle, but I didn't shim it - next time I have the carb out I will shim it and see.
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Old 05-26-2012, 08:51 AM   #12
hoffa509
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I did the same mods to mine with great results. I did tear the eningine down to make sure everything was spec. You can see my low budget build in my signature.
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Old 08-29-2012, 10:56 PM   #13
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I realize its been 5 months since this thread was posted on but what the heck.

Just wanted to add that when I bought my Reflex new in 86 it would die when I quickly gave it the gas. It also seemed to run a little cold.
This resulted in it constantly embarrasing me because I would be on a log or rock, give it some gas, the bike would die throwing me forward so my knee would hit the horn button.
It was sort of like anouncing "BEEP---Look at me Im going to crash".
After bugging the Honda dealer they finally found out that there was a technical bullentin out on it along with a recommended repair kit. They got the kit and installed it. I believe it had a jet and a screw in it but cant remember.
Anyway, it fixed the problem. Supposedly one of the few changes they made to the 87 model was to fix the problem at the factory.

The other thing is that for me, a few thousand miles is not high mileage on these bikes. Mine only has 7k miles on it (some of it pretty rough) and still runs very strong. The only engine work has been frequent oil changes (been using synth since 87) and valve adjustment.
In Quartzite Arizona I ran into a guy with an 87 who had 24k miles on his. He did not do any serious off roading (he had it licensed) but did some desert riding along with puttering around towns (he traveled with it on his RV).

Anyway, just wanted to say that I think they are the greatest "puttering" bikes made and I hope to get another 26 years out of mine.

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