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Old 04-01-2012, 09:00 AM   #121
Wasp
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Will the ABS/TCS work with 21" front and standard 17" rear.

A number of people have asked if the ABS/TCS will still work with 21" front wheel.

Iv'e gone down the path of full Woody's Wheel Works 21" wheel and hub replacement that has no provision for the ABS/TCS ring and sensor, but for my own peace of mind (and to provide valuable feedback to Woody) I sat tonight asking myself,,,,, "self - How can we check this out?"......... "How do I rig the sensor ring and pick up onto the rim?"......... "What would MacGyver do?".........



Short on paper clips, loosely assembled bullets, and a magnifying glass, I measured the hub to disc clearance and devised the next best plan of attack using some 5.4mm plywood.

You may recall from one of the previous pics, the discs on the wheel (Woody's 21"er, not the OEM 19") are spaced off the hub by these beautiful little gold anodized billet components:


It happens that the gap between the inner face of the disc carrier and the outer edge of the hub is 5.4mm.
All I needed to do then was cut a flange with 6 holes at the same PCD as the disc mounts and sandwich it between the disc and hub.

In true MacGyver fashion I chewed the piece of ply to shape (it looks like it at least) and screwed the sensor ring on central.


I left the screw points sticking through the back face of the ply... Because MacGyver would:


Mounting disc completed, it was time to whip the wheel of and try my new MacGyverABSsensorholderthingy on for fit:


Fits first go with no hole filing. Damn Mac's good.


Back on with the wheel and I will fab a little bracket to hold the proximity type doohicky off the two bolts for the caliper.
That's a job for tomorrow now so I will post up some more pics once thats completed:


All in all, an interesting project and it will be interesting to see if the system has enough smarts to compensate for such dramatically different (from design intent) wheel sizes.

Later.

Greg.
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The original WaspWorks S10 detail & evolution thread:
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=595933
The NEW "Long Term" WaspWorks S10 detail & evolution thread:
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=778809
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Old 04-01-2012, 11:31 AM   #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wasp View Post
A number of people have asked if the ABS/TCS will still work with 21" front wheel.

Iv'e gone down the path of full Woody's Wheel Works 21" wheel and hub replacement that has no provision for the ABS/TCS ring and sensor, but for my own peace of mind (and to provide valuable feedback to Woody) I sat tonight asking myself,,,,, "self - How can we check this out?"......... "How do I rig the sensor ring and pick up onto the rim?"......... "What would MacGyver do?".........

All in all, an interesting project and it will be interesting to see if the system has enough smarts to compensate for such dramatically different (from design intent) wheel sizes.

Later.

Greg.
More... more!!!!
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Old 04-01-2012, 11:41 AM   #123
woody's wheel works OP
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keep it coming Wasp-man,,just had an epiphany of ,,,,,

the outside possibility that the oem sensor holder may just fit in the Superlite hub,,,
then,,,
what if i make an integrated disc spacer and sensor ring holder....we'd have the oem sensor holder provide protection to sensor ring and perform it's sensor holding /spacing job

hmmm

first things first,,somehow figuring out if the AS/TCS works with different diameter wheel

this is where it sucks that i don't have a donor bike for measurements

HELP!!!
Need donor bike for a few days


woody
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Old 04-01-2012, 02:14 PM   #124
Thagua
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Use my wheels

Quote:
Originally Posted by woody's wheel works View Post
the outside possibility that the oem sensor holder may just fit in the Superlite hub,,,
then,,,
what if i make an integrated disc spacer and sensor ring holder....we'd have the oem sensor holder provide protection to sensor ring and perform it's sensor holding /spacing job

hmmm

first things first,,somehow figuring out if the AS/TCS works with different diameter wheel

this is where it sucks that i don't have a donor bike for measurements

HELP!!!
Need donor bike for a few days


woody
Hi Woody ... not selfish ... use my wheels to measure and do whatever test you feel necessary ... not asking for a discount for used wheels ... lol
Cheers,
Thagua
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Old 04-01-2012, 02:52 PM   #125
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Originally Posted by Thagua View Post
Hi Woody ... not selfish ... use my wheels to measure and do whatever test you feel necessary ... not asking for a discount for used wheels ... lol
Cheers,
Thagua
roberto,, it's this self-less sharing that gives me goose-bumps,,,all of us working for the greatest good of the greatest number so to speak,,,it would certainly solve the problem weeks sooner,,
'
Salud,y posedas,y amor,y tiempo para gozar amigo de mi corazon

my casa es su casa,,
any day kindred spirit!!!

senor woody
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Old 04-01-2012, 08:47 PM   #126
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woody needs donor bike in denver for a few days

HELP!!!
Need donor bike for a few days

trying to get measurements for abs/tcs as well as test drive 21/18 conversion to see if abs/tcs is affected,,be part of history

woody
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Old 04-02-2012, 12:51 AM   #127
Wasp
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Well dip me in chocolate and throw me to the lesbians - IT WORKS!!!


BUGGER ME !!!


This must be one smart ABS/TCS system to be able to account for a 21" front wheel when it was designed to operate on 19"er.

I was up early this morning, eager as a school kid with his dads Playboy collection.
I set to work finishing off my MacGyver'ized mounting of the encoder ring and pick up sensor for the front ABS/TCS onto my newly acquired Woody's Wheel Works 21" front wheel.

The only thing to do after last nights sensor ring mount to the hub was to bend up a flatbar mount to secure the proximity type read thingamejig behind the fork leg.

A quick measure of the OEM hub and the readers location and I was into the cutting, drilling, and bending.
It aint pretty but it certainly does the job.









All the way through this mock up project, I was actually quite confident that the system would still work fine.
And work fine it does.
Remember, this is 21" front and standard 17" rear...
Within 30 meters of rolling down the driveway the ABS/TCS light was OFF (it was ON at start up because I had ridden the bike previously without the system connected), and the fault light on the dash had gone out, (the dash will show engine fault when no ABS is detected).

I headed off down my long gravel driveway and tried the ABS... Perfect - It did exactly what it was supposed to do.
I rounded my bottom corner and headed up the road. Up to about 50mph and no sign of an idiot light on the dash.
I rode around 2kms up and down my street, on and of the gas and managed to arc the rear up with the tell tale flashing from the dash.. All's good, so I turn into my driveway again and did a loop of the 1.5km gravel/rock firebreak.
I changed between TC1 and TC2 and the system seems to function EXACTLY as is always has = not cutting in any sooner or later that I could perceive.

The feel of the 21" wheel in the gravel/dirt/road is another story and I will make an entry in this thread when I have done more riding to evaluate. I will say right now though - Hang on to your britch's and keep an eye out for this next ride report. The 21" front wheel has absolutely transformed the feel of the bike in the loose stuff.
Too early to write a comprehensive and convincing review so that will have to wait for a while.

All's good on this side of the world.

Greg.
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The original WaspWorks S10 detail & evolution thread:
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=595933
The NEW "Long Term" WaspWorks S10 detail & evolution thread:
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=778809
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Old 04-02-2012, 04:43 AM   #128
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SUPER JOB WASP!

I just knew the ABS/TC would work (unlike some other adaptations) on the big Yamaha due to math used in the system. Great mock up to test!!
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Old 04-02-2012, 06:27 AM   #129
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team-work,,,i LOVE it!!!

that's pretty fuggin great!!!!
awesome,,,my gut said it would work,,can't recall one that didn't,,

what does get screwed up is the odometer.speedometer reading,,,some machines like ktm 's have a recalibrating circuit for different size wheels


others routinely claim that now their gps speed and the actual indicated MPH are almost spot on..ie the speedo readings from the historical perspective are 'optimistic'',,,, reading more than you are actually going,,creating the illusion of going faster...hence the slower rpm of the 21'er corrects some of that


well it's good to know the ABS works,,,i'm positive the TCS is rear wheel dependent,,,with the larger diameter 18 tires it too will correlate the existing rpm with any sudden acceleration kinda like ABS in reverse...


the best part of all this is the synchronicity an synergy evidenced when all of us work together

gung ho

w

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..For more info check our website...
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....Wanna e-mail us... woodyswheelworks@gmail.com
......Wanna talk,,,call us
toll free... 1-866-936-0232
........If you're lost???... GPS = 39*40'33.86N x 104*59'54.69W
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Old 04-03-2012, 10:08 AM   #130
Thagua
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Fender and brake line for your 21"

Hi Greg ... how did you managed to use the OEM fender and brake line with your 21" front wheel and did it had a safe clearance to the SW Motech bash plate front? ... couldn`t see them in your photos.
Excellent work.
Thagua ... the other 'guinea pig'
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Old 04-03-2012, 02:32 PM   #131
jaumev
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thagua View Post
Hi Greg ... how did you managed to use the OEM fender and brake line with your 21" front wheel and did it had a safe clearance to the SW Motech bash plate front? ... couldn`t see them in your photos.
Excellent work.
Thagua ... the other 'guinea pig'
Hi "guinea pigs", excellent work. We all hope you succeeded in this project.
I’m waiting for a new longer rear shock to lift the bike avoiding the links (dog bones) and then start with the 21” front wheel.
I support you from distance!!

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Old 04-04-2012, 10:04 AM   #132
Wasp
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More PORN from the Wizzards at Woody's Wheel Work's

I cant say enough about these guys, and Woody himself in particular.

During one of my Skype sessions with Woody a couple of weeks ago, I mentioned that I would probably end up running just one single disc on the front after I trial the 21" double disc wheel.

As you have seen, I received the double disc wheel about 10 days ago and installed it with a view to just removing one disc and playing with the master cylinder sizing at a later date.

Obviously not good enough in Woody's opinion.
I got a phone call from my postmaster (small community) yesterday to say there was a new parcel waiting for collection from "Woody's Wheel Work's".
I am expecting a new 18" wheel down the track, when I can afford it, so I assumed that he may have jumped the gun and sent one out by mistake.

Bugger me if I open the package and find a new Superlite Single disc 21" EXCEL A60 rim (toughest rim in the solar system), Monster laced in all it's glory.

Love the silver stripe and logo detail on this:




I should have probably cleaned the dust off it first


Another Skype call to Woody reveals that he has struck a deal whereby I send the first wheel (double disc one) on to Steve "Wolfeman" Smith at www.adventuremoto.com.au when I have finished doing my test's and trials....
At least i think that's what he said - All I remember was "bla-bla-bla + when you feel like it"

Actually, I am assisting Woody with some dimensions and design to install the ABS sensor ring in the Superlite hub, so i'll do the right thing and send it over to Steve when that is finished. Maybe!!!
And after I have belted the shit out of it in the bush...

I'll keep you all posted once I get a chance to do a decent ride and make a report.

Greg.
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The original WaspWorks S10 detail & evolution thread:
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=595933
The NEW "Long Term" WaspWorks S10 detail & evolution thread:
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=778809
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Old 04-04-2012, 01:59 PM   #133
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Wasp, you are a spoiled boy!!
(but Woody knows you deserved as the better guinea pig)
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Old 04-05-2012, 03:32 AM   #134
obe01
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Nice work Wasp...

Nice one Greg...

Doing some great work there matey...
I am trying to work out which way to proceed. With Superlite hubs or OEM jobies...Woody has given us too many choices...Bugger..

Hey Woody,

Is the single disc front end a reality with OEM hubs matey???

Sorry for the procrastination mate. Just wanna make sure I get the right gear for the big girl. Thanks heaps to you and your off sider Zach, for all the work he has done for me matey...

Top job guys.

Oh yeah.............. HAPPY EASTER

Johnnie
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Old 04-05-2012, 09:42 AM   #135
Wasp
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Woody Wheel Works 21" Super Tenere ride report.

I had to run a few errands down it the city today so I thought it the ideal opportunity to put the new 21" wheel to a couple hundred kilometer test.

I was on a bit of a schedule today so the only dirt road testing was the journey out and return leg down and up my 200meter (washed out/shitty condition - at the moment) driveway.

I think I mentioned earlier that I have been around my firebreak a couple of times and it is really exiting to feel the incredible difference (ADVANTAGE) that the bigger diameter + narrower tire offers. The bike now goes where it is pointed and is not front washed, or steered by deep gravel or sand to anywhere near the extent of the OEM balloon tires that were on the bike.
I havent had enough dirt time to do a off-road report justice but early days it feels amaizing.
I will report when I have had a full day out in the forrest.

On the road.
To be honest, I was expecting the larger wheel to feel like shit on the road... But it doesn't... Sure the steering rake angle has decreased and the trail has increase, both making for slower steering, but it seems slower by the smallest measure in reality.

It requires more input (no, not input - body english) to both turn in and steer out of a corner, but at the same time it feel more "stable".. Obvious I guess given the change of geometry, but the changes seem more natural for this style of bike and the way I ride.. Gone are the days of me thrashing around on the road. I save that for the forrest trails nowadays. Too easy to rack up demerit points and find your self without a license.

Having always seemed to be a very easy bike to ride slowly splitting traffic, it just seems easier now. the bike is so much easier to balance while riding slow that im sure you could get off and jog along beside it sometimes.

I dont know if it's the norm, but the big wheels seem a lot more stable in longitudinal grooves and tarmac joints in the road. it just doesn't seem to get as easily upset.
I think a lot of the advantageous changes that can be felt with this mod can actually be put down to the weight loss from the front (maybe it is a gyroscopic thing?). There is a lot less input required to do a job, and the feedback from the front wheel seems to tax/impact on the stability less.

All in all, it feels great, and I am loving it.
Look forward to rack up some more kms tomorrow and try and think more about what the bike is doing... I was just out enjoying myself today rather than taking in too many analytical details.

Greg.
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The original WaspWorks S10 detail & evolution thread:
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=595933
The NEW "Long Term" WaspWorks S10 detail & evolution thread:
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=778809
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