NHSTA Opens Investigation into BMW Final Drive Failures

[lemieuxmc]

Originally Posted by marty hill

Sorry, but thats just not correct!

Unfortunately, my ham fisted friend, it is.

There is a distinction between breaking and wearing out, when your Snap- On fine tooth ratchet gives up, it's usually because it's worn out.

If you break a HF socket wrench, there is a good chance that it wasn't just you.

As to MrT10x making a comment about his mechanics in the military busting Snap-On tools, it's possible to break ANYTHING!

I was a high school shop teacher and started buying HF tools for the students to use instead of the good stuff. I decided it was much more cost effective and a learning experience to find out who were the ham fisted folks who might be better off in another field.

It's a poor craftsman who blames his tools. The recent controversy about BMW final drives failing is such a hot button issue precisely because of BMW's long history (and subsequent promotion) as the best motorcycle that you could get, regardless of price.

Guzzisti are without doubt among the most passionate of motorcycle owners and you don't see them attacking anyone who points out the rare, but not unknown case of a FD disintegrating. In almost all Guzzi FD failures, it is the result of an inferior assembly or set up process at the factory and is explained by a shrug of the shoulders and an exclamation of "Well... it was built in Italy after all!".

The typically obsessive and anal retentive BMW crowd have a real problem with facing the reality that they have purchased an ordinary motorcycle (at a premium price), from someone who may have a lot more knowledge of salesmanship than motorcycles, put together with a mix of globally sourced (Chinese?) parts, by Turkish immigrants in a German factory, who may or may not be really concerned with maintaining the long history of BMW excellence.

[icebox]

Originally Posted by Anorak

If you agree with the people who say it is a shimming issue from new, then it is a quality control issue in some cases.

No real way of knowing, it may be shims, either to tight or to loose, could be the large bearing is just to close to it's design limits, that coupled with the almost to touchy shim limits. Bearing might be better off as a higher class/quality. I have rebuilt a ton of planetary finals, units that weigh hundreds of pounds, and even these have wear limits. Pisten Bully, use google, had a under designed final in the early 200/Edge series that ate bearings when pushed. To little oil, to high a RPM and to small a bearing. Which one of those three was the real culprit. Folks pointing fingers haven't fixed to much stuff. Doubt there is a single item to point to in BMW finals either. Oh yeah, it is a single sided drive, that must be the problem.
For me it is a fairly small wart on a pretty nice bike, the lack of dealers is a bigger PIA.

[Anorak]

Originally Posted by icebox

No real way of knowing, it may be shims, either to tight or to loose, could be the large bearing is just to close to it's design limits, that coupled with the almost to touchy shim limits. Bearing might be better off as a higher class/quality. I have rebuilt a ton of planetary finals, units that weigh hundreds of pounds, and even these have wear limits. Pisten Bully, use google, had a under designed final in the early 200/Edge series that ate bearings when pushed. To little oil, to high a RPM and to small a bearing. Which one of those three was the real culprit. Folks pointing fingers haven't fixed to much stuff. Doubt there is a single item to point to in BMW finals either. Oh yeah, it is a single sided drive, that must be the problem.
For me it is a fairly small wart on a pretty nice bike, the lack of dealers is a bigger PIA.

The same big bearing is used in all the bikes starting with the R80 G/S including the K series. Those are all paralever. I don't recall real issues until the 1150.

[svennoly]

Originally Posted by lemieuxmc

by Turkish immigrants in a German factory,

I knew it was the Turks fault

[icebox]

They are called "guest workers"

Originally Posted by svennoly

I knew it was the Turks fault

[GrahamD]

Originally Posted by svennoly

I knew it was the Turks fault.

Finally !!
After 264 posts a definitive answer!!

[Benzinkanister]

Originally Posted by icebox

They are called "guest workers"

Not anymore. Now that expression is Nazi.

[ghostrider1964]

Originally Posted by Benzinkanister

Not anymore. Now that expression is Nazi.

The horror of it all!!!! I really cannot believe this thread is still going...Its going to rank up there with oil and tire threads I am not sure we reflect anything intelligent out of all this ball bashing

[Benzinkanister]

Originally Posted by ghostrider1964

The horror of it all!!!! I really cannot believe this thread is still going...Its going to rank up there with oil and tire threads I am not sure we reflect anything intelligent out of all this ball bashing

I guess, there are a lot of balls around, which of course have to be bashed. That's what they are made for. Whether it's going to happen in this thread or in another doesn't really matter.

[JimVonBaden]

Just in case people think I am a "defender" because I never had a FD failure, or am burying my head in the sand, I had a 99 R1100GS with a failed FD 500 miles from home. Turns out it had failed before I got it, failed when I had it, and failed again after I got rid of it.

Just saying.

Jim

[Snowbound]

My 1150 GS is still doing OK at 175,000 miles .

[Chumley]

Hmmm...

I was asking a representative of one of the extended warranty companies questions about their policies a couple of months back. It was for the wife's F650GS about to go out of warranty. I told him it would be for a BMW. When I told him it was for a F650 he said "oh good, we have been paying out a lot for final drives on the big bikes". I didn't go into it since I now have a 2010 bike and am not reall worried.

Just sayin'...

[billdonna]

Originally Posted by tagesk

It even has a name: Godwin's law.
We're not there yet, but we're approaching.

[TaSK]

Yup, see post #267.

[BMW Kurt]

Originally Posted by lemieuxmc

by Turkish immigrants in a German factory

Not a Turk in sight! (I lived in Germany for 9 years and the Turkish guest workers that I knew were hard working people. Fine craftsmen too! I would be proud to have a bike made by them!)

[TuefelHunden]

Looks like BMW is getting hammered by NHSTA
http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2012/Feb/120213i1.htm

When on the COG site many moons ago, they talked about "holes" in cam lobes, and IIRC spline issues on the final drive. When I had my two 955 Sprints they had brake issues of all kinds and fuel disconnects that leaked like sieves. On my FJR there was always talk of drive shaft splines wearing away. All bikes have issues.

The BMW makes the best made bikes in the world thing was probably true back when its competition were the likes of Matchless, BSA, HD, Triumph, Ducati, Norton, Royal Enfield, HD and the other bikes of the 60's. The Jap bikes came and a lot of inferior bikes went away. It isn't that BMW got worse with time, they got more complex and the competition of today just makes good bikes. It is IMO a pretty level playing field. If a group wants to think they have the best bikes, so fricken what? Just sayin'