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Old 02-09-2012, 10:11 AM   #91
Disco Stu
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Originally Posted by FlySniper View Post
Holy Hell. I was wondering why a thread on short shifting had already made it to two pages.

Now I see the idiocy fuelling this thread.

"If you do not have the revs high enough, the gears do not mesh completely causing premature wear."

Fuck me raw if that isn't one of the dumbest things I've read in regards to something mechanical. RPM has nothing to do with how well the tranny gears mesh. Yes, you need some rotation, but not a lot ... I think less than 1/16th of a turn or so will normally do it. And it can come from either the input or output side, so as long as the bike is rolling, you're golden. Engine RPM doesn't really matter.
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Old 02-09-2012, 03:18 PM   #92
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Burning witches and thinking the World is flat
I don't mind anyone burning witches, but finding out the world isn't flat has spoiled my day!


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Old 02-09-2012, 03:37 PM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlySniper View Post
Holy Hell. I was wondering why a thread on short shifting had already made it to two pages.

Now I see the idiocy fuelling this thread.

"If you do not have the revs high enough, the gears do not mesh completely causing premature wear."

Fuck me raw if that isn't one of the dumbest things I've read in regards to something mechanical. RPM has nothing to do with how well the tranny gears mesh. Yes, you need some rotation, but not a lot ... I think less than 1/16th of a turn or so will normally do it. And it can come from either the input or output side, so as long as the bike is rolling, you're golden. Engine RPM doesn't really matter.

This was just too funny!

When I saw that in a quote it made me HAVE to read this thread for entertainment value, having shortshifted my bikes as well as winding them out to red line, not to mention some clutchless shifting, without ever having to replace a clutch or any gear in any streetbike or off roader.
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Old 02-09-2012, 03:42 PM   #94
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Originally Posted by car94 View Post
Thanks for having my back, But I never said I was an expert, just repeating what my long time Mechanic told me after he had to replace a shift fork, 2nd gear driven and drive gear and a few other parts in a old Suzuki sport bike I had. But doG forgive me for passing on my my experiance and the fact that I have never had any trans problems since then on any of the 6 bikes I currently own and all the ones I have owned since the Suzuki. I should have known better than to try and share with the all knowing Gods of the key boards with 80 gazilion post's you must be an expert! It works for me and I don't redline the bikes, I shift a little above the recomended shift rpm's for the bike I am riding!

I hope you got a new mechanic, one that actually knows something about mechanisms, metalurgy, and stress.
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Old 02-09-2012, 03:50 PM   #95
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No, not everyone... you proved you weren't!
You better watch out before the very learned and all knowing Car94, starts calling you a "flat-earther", or states that you won't even have the brains to know what a scholarly chap such as himself is insinuating with such a statement. He admitted he was wrong, so that absolves him of all previous incorrect statements, and of calling everyone who called him out on them, idiots.
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Old 02-09-2012, 03:55 PM   #96
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Originally Posted by Pantah View Post
I always thought short shifting was a racing term. That is; going to a higher gear well before peak power. Racers do that for a lot of reasons but generally it has something to do with producing a better handling motorcycle/car under poor track conditions. I would guess short shifting is a common practice in off road racing, since the surfaces change constantly. In road racing, it probably has more to do with the track configuration or rain. A road racer might opt to short shift a section because his bike is geared to maximize another section. Rain? well you want a softer power hit everywhere.

I intentionally shift early under some street or trail conditions, but IMO that is short short shifting, since I rarely hit peak anything . On the other hand, like OCF, my KTM 950 hates short short shifting.

Heck no, it's the same in many situations. When you drive a stick shift vehicle in snow it isn't unusual to short shift to avoid spinning the tires too easily. In that case the short shift is actually to slightly lug down the engine at or near the lower part of the power range so as to NOT spin. I do it all the time in the winter. Start rolling and catch second quick. The car/truck will actually accelerate better, because if I was still in first the tires would start spinning.

Gads, now I'm actually in this mess!
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Old 02-09-2012, 03:59 PM   #97
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Originally Posted by MiteyF View Post
Speaking of threads turning into something they're not about, what does this have to do with anything?
Just a fun intermission... kind of a meanless interlude...
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Old 02-09-2012, 04:04 PM   #98
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For those who have trouble with words, here's a pic of a short short shifter:



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Old 02-09-2012, 04:04 PM   #99
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Originally Posted by NJ-Brett View Post
There is a theory that the 3rd gear blow ups in the dr650 are caused by lugging the motor (short shifting).
You get more stress on a few gear teeth for longer, along with the big thumper power pulses, instead of having the force on a rapidly spinning gear.

There is a dr650 3rd gear blow up thread...
Nah, that's caused by a poor quality gear. Too few teeth, too narrow, poor metalurgy, or the like. If it was all about lugging or short shifting it would happen in all bikes.
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Ever get lost? You know, that good kind of lost - come to a dirt road intersection and you have no idea where you are or which way to turn? I like when that happens!

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Old 02-09-2012, 04:06 PM   #100
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Originally Posted by O.C.F.RIDER View Post
You better watch out before the very learned and all knowing Car94, starts calling you a "flat-earther", or states that you won't even have the brains to know what a scholarly chap such as himself is insinuating with such a statement. He admitted he was wrong, so that absolves him of all previous incorrect statements, and of calling everyone who called him out on them, idiots.

I nuked it... I figured the poor guy had enough abuse heeped on himself.

Happy short shifting to ya!
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Ever get lost? You know, that good kind of lost - come to a dirt road intersection and you have no idea where you are or which way to turn? I like when that happens!

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95 KLX650C w/Vulcan piston bigbore, Now an 09 KLX250S, selling my 90 Zephyr 550
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Old 02-09-2012, 05:02 PM   #101
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Originally Posted by markk53 View Post
I nuked it... I figured the poor guy had enough abuse heaped on himself.

Happy short shifting to ya!
Happy short-shifting to you too!

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Old 02-10-2012, 06:16 AM   #102
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The manual trans in my rav 4 has an oil pump in it, circulates lube in the trans and to the radiator, and I suppose its possible that low rpm's causes low lube flow to the trans, some bikes have pressure feeds to the trans, so I suppose it could cause problems under some situations.

And, I think most if not all of the dr650 3rd gear blow ups happened at low rpm's, not under max load.

That does not stop me from using a trans however I want, lugging it, speed shifting, if it breaks, you fix it!

But if I was in the middle of Siberia solo on my dr650, I just might keep the rev's up...
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Old 02-10-2012, 10:09 AM   #103
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If short shifting is so damaging to the transmission engine braking (downshifting) must cause instant failure.

There must be only one proper rpm per gear to shift to the next gear.

Where are all the failed transmission threads?
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Old 02-10-2012, 10:15 AM   #104
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Right next to the right oil threads.
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Old 02-10-2012, 11:04 AM   #105
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Right next to the right oil threads.

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