ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Bikes > Orange Crush
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 08-20-2013, 07:42 AM   #4051
Katoom72
Studly Adventurer
 
Katoom72's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2012
Location: Belgium
Oddometer: 830
Quote:
Originally Posted by XsilverGS View Post
I thought that at one time France had a horse power limit, 100 bhp rings a bell, do they still?
Yes they have. It's actually a EU regulation. Our bikes are 100HP limited aswell but we can buy 'fullpowerbikes' and ride them legally.
But we just buy them @limited power so we don't have to pay full taxes on when we register them the first time. Papers of my superduke said 74kw instead off the full 98kw.

78kw is 123euro to register it. 98kw is 495euro.

Some brands cost money to get it fullpower tho. Like Honda CBR's need a 500euro CDI switch. But if you look at the price for first registration, 2478euro, then 500euro seems like a bargain.
__________________
Now:
'03 KTM 250sx -- '05 KTM Adventure 950
Before:
'00 KTM 250sx -- '03 KTM 450sx -- '03 Yamaha R6 -- '08 KTM SuperDuke R --- '13 KTM 690 enduro R

Katoom72 screwed with this post 08-20-2013 at 07:50 AM
Katoom72 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-20-2013, 08:21 AM   #4052
bigboyxl
Gnarly Adventurer
 
bigboyxl's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2011
Location: Czech republic - Ukraine
Oddometer: 316
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katoom72 View Post
Yes they have. It's actually a EU regulation. Our bikes are 100HP limited aswell but we can buy 'fullpowerbikes' and ride them legally.
But we just buy them @limited power so we don't have to pay full taxes on when we register them the first time. Papers of my superduke said 74kw instead off the full 98kw.

78kw is 123euro to register it. 98kw is 495euro.

Some brands cost money to get it fullpower tho. Like Honda CBR's need a 500euro CDI switch. But if you look at the price for first registration, 2478euro, then 500euro seems like a bargain.
wow
__________________
KTM LC4 640 Adventure 2006 KTM 530 EXC 2011
KTM LC8 1190 Adventure
www.alburmoto.com
Nomada panniers, Holan crashbars, Remus silencers etc. Worldwide shipping. Better deals for ADVriders
bigboyxl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-20-2013, 10:37 AM   #4053
barbadv
Adventurer
 
Joined: Aug 2013
Location: South France
Oddometer: 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katoom72 View Post
Yes they have. It's actually a EU regulation. Our bikes are 100HP limited aswell but we can buy 'fullpowerbikes' and ride them legally.
But we just buy them @limited power so we don't have to pay full taxes on when we register them the first time. Papers of my superduke said 74kw instead off the full 98kw.

78kw is 123euro to register it. 98kw is 495euro.

Some brands cost money to get it fullpower tho. Like Honda CBR's need a 500euro CDI switch. But if you look at the price for first registration, 2478euro, then 500euro seems like a bargain.

Not in France, unfortunatly it's more complicated for us
To ride legally, we must stay in 100HP !
I don't, my dealer gave to my 1190 full map...but if i've an accident, a big one with police investigation, i will be very very very fucked by my insurance which will tell me "not legally riding, no insurance, good luck !".
I think we are the only country on the world with this stupid 100HP law
barbadv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-20-2013, 11:22 AM   #4054
wpbarlow
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Jun 2003
Location: Central NJ
Oddometer: 10,300
So the best thing to do would be to put the fact that you're doing this on a public forum?
wpbarlow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-20-2013, 11:22 AM   #4055
Katoom72
Studly Adventurer
 
Katoom72's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2012
Location: Belgium
Oddometer: 830
Quote:
Originally Posted by barbadv View Post
Not in France, unfortunatly it's more complicated for us
To ride legally, we must stay in 100HP !
I don't, my dealer gave to my 1190 full map...but if i've an accident, a big one with police investigation, i will be very very very fucked by my insurance which will tell me "not legally riding, no insurance, good luck !".
I think we are the only country on the world with this stupid 100HP law
Same for us. It's basically the same as people that remap their car for more HP.

We breach a few laws when riding with more power then there is on paper:
-We basically ride with no insurance
-We are evading taxes
-The bike is not regulated to be on the road, since the papers are not conform with the vehicle

Now the chance a big investigation will go that far to determine the vehicle had more HP then it should is non-existant.
Because to investigate that, they had to have the suspicion that the accident was caused by the tuneup. AND they would have to have the ECU in good condition.


Quote:
Originally Posted by wpbarlow View Post
So the best thing to do would be to put the fact that you're doing this on a public forum?
A public forum still has the benefit of being annonymous
__________________
Now:
'03 KTM 250sx -- '05 KTM Adventure 950
Before:
'00 KTM 250sx -- '03 KTM 450sx -- '03 Yamaha R6 -- '08 KTM SuperDuke R --- '13 KTM 690 enduro R
Katoom72 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-20-2013, 11:23 AM   #4056
WildAnCrazymtl
Political Prisonor
 
WildAnCrazymtl's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2009
Location: Peoples Republik of Kanada, Québec province!
Oddometer: 6,252
Quote:
Originally Posted by barbadv View Post
Not in France, unfortunatly it's more complicated for us
To ride legally, we must stay in 100HP !
I don't, my dealer gave to my 1190 full map...but if i've an accident, a big one with police investigation, i will be very very very fucked by my insurance which will tell me "not legally riding, no insurance, good luck !".
I think we are the only country on the world with this stupid 100HP law
Cound you register the bike in another country, at a friend or relatives house...
__________________
"Work negatively inpacts my free time !" Me.
"Ride it like you stole it, then do the same to me ! " Her.
"A good thing in a bad place, is still a good thing ! " Us.

____________
R1200GS 09
DRZ400 03
WildAnCrazymtl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-21-2013, 05:18 AM   #4057
barbadv
Adventurer
 
Joined: Aug 2013
Location: South France
Oddometer: 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by wpbarlow View Post
So the best thing to do would be to put the fact that you're doing this on a public forum?

Barbadv, not a real identity, isn't it ?
And i'm not afraid, french policemen don't speak english at all...they must speak a veritable good french before, and for it they have already lot of work
barbadv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-21-2013, 05:23 AM   #4058
barbadv
Adventurer
 
Joined: Aug 2013
Location: South France
Oddometer: 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by WildAnCrazymtl View Post
Cound you register the bike in another country, at a friend or relatives house...

I think it's in theory possible with Europe, but i don't have any friend or family who live in an other country ;)
barbadv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-21-2013, 05:40 AM   #4059
barbadv
Adventurer
 
Joined: Aug 2013
Location: South France
Oddometer: 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katoom72 View Post
Same for us. It's basically the same as people that remap their car for more HP.

We breach a few laws when riding with more power then there is on paper:
-We basically ride with no insurance
-We are evading taxes
-The bike is not regulated to be on the road, since the papers are not conform with the vehicle

wow, i didn't know it !
I rode a few year ago with belgium guys but they didn't talk about this.
They have full 1200GS and i supposed that it's "normal" in their country.
Maybe they payed the taxe ?


Quote:
Now the chance a big investigation will go that far to determine the vehicle had more HP then it should is non-existant.
My dealer explained to me that investigation for looking about the ECU is only possible, in our country, after magistrate requisition if someone fill a claim against the driver after an accident.
Very unusual but possible...

That is why today, lot of dealer don't want to upgrate the ECU of the 1190 because that "writing" in the ECU the dealer "professionnal number", the day and the hour.
In case of problem i talked about, dealer may be worried.
barbadv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-21-2013, 06:03 AM   #4060
Katoom72
Studly Adventurer
 
Katoom72's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2012
Location: Belgium
Oddometer: 830
Quote:
Originally Posted by barbadv View Post
wow, i didn't know it !
I rode a few year ago with belgium guys but they didn't talk about this.
They have full 1200GS and i supposed that it's "normal" in their country.
Maybe they payed the taxe ?
I doubt it they did. I mean, why would you? The subject is kept in silence or is even unknown to allot of people. Same deal with re-mapping cars basically. People buy a lower specced car and add a re-map to it.
That way they can avoid a part of the registration taxes that would come with the higher specced cars. Our taxes are based on the power and the CC's. Lower one of those and you're taxes become cheaper.

If you look at that from a standpoint about laws, it means you're evading tax laws.
At the same time your vehicle does not meet the EU regulations anymore, because the vehicle is alterated and does not meet de homologated specs that are in your papers.
You car is insured on ground of those papers, the insurance price is based on it. you're basically riding another car. Everything is the same...accept for the power of the car. So your car is uninsured.

But in the end, who knows about it? like you said, magistrats could command a read-out of the ECU after an accident. But even then, it has to be proven the accident is caused by the extra power to lose the insurance coverage.
An insurance can end the contract if they know you're 'cheating'. But when are they gonna know? Wel the only chance is after an accident, IF the ECU is investigated. They can drop the insurance then but still have to cover the damage if they can't prove it's cause by the re-map.

So the only risk really is the tax evading. That means the tradeoff is to big compared to the risk.


For re-mapping @ the dealer, just make up a clause that you're using it on the track only. Both parties sign it and he's out of the picture. It's not his fault you're using the bike for the road aswell.
__________________
Now:
'03 KTM 250sx -- '05 KTM Adventure 950
Before:
'00 KTM 250sx -- '03 KTM 450sx -- '03 Yamaha R6 -- '08 KTM SuperDuke R --- '13 KTM 690 enduro R
Katoom72 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-21-2013, 10:10 AM   #4061
barbadv
Adventurer
 
Joined: Aug 2013
Location: South France
Oddometer: 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katoom72 View Post
An insurance can end the contract if they know you're 'cheating'. But when are they gonna know? Wel the only chance is after an accident, IF the ECU is investigated. They can drop the insurance then but still have to cover the damage if they can't prove it's cause by the re-map.
Not for us ;)
Law is very clear : "insurance automatically voided if vehicle doesn't respect conformity" and here, conformity is 100 HP.
However, i never hear about this situation for someone at the moment.


Quote:
For re-mapping @ the dealer, just make up a clause that you're using it on the track only. Both parties sign it and he's out of the picture. It's not his fault you're using the bike for the road aswell.
Yes...and no
My dealer explained to me that he will not make up this type of clause in the futur because his lawyer said him it's not a good idea.
I don't understood exactly why...


So, i choose my way, the "full power" one and i'll see...but i always cross my fingers
barbadv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-21-2013, 11:29 AM   #4062
Bonsai Elephant
Banned
 
Bonsai Elephant's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2007
Location: The Hills
Oddometer: 18,756
Quote:
Originally Posted by barbadv View Post
Not in France, unfortunatly it's more complicated for us
To ride legally, we must stay in 100HP !
I don't, my dealer gave to my 1190 full map...but if i've an accident, a big one with police investigation, i will be very very very fucked by my insurance which will tell me "not legally riding, no insurance, good luck !".
I think we are the only country on the world with this stupid 100HP law
A friend of mine had to pull a GSXR1100 engine out of his frame and replace it with a 750 before the tow truck arrived because of that!



Let's just hope you never have to deal with that issue.

Ride safe!

Bonsai Elephant is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-21-2013, 01:47 PM   #4063
barbadv
Adventurer
 
Joined: Aug 2013
Location: South France
Oddometer: 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonsai Elephant View Post
A friend of mine had to pull a GSXR1100 engine out of his frame and replace it with a 750 before the tow truck arrived because of that!



Let's just hope you never have to deal with that issue.

Ride safe!



I hope too !
But for me (and if i can walk) it will be more easy, no motor to change, i'll just have to remove ECU from the bike.
If insurance guys looking for it, i'll tell them "The what ? E.C.U ? What is this fucking thing you talking about ?"
barbadv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-21-2013, 01:57 PM   #4064
Katoom72
Studly Adventurer
 
Katoom72's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2012
Location: Belgium
Oddometer: 830
Quote:
Originally Posted by barbadv View Post
I hope too !
But for me (and if i can walk) it will be more easy, no motor to change, i'll just have to remove ECU from the bike.
If insurance guys looking for it, i'll tell them "The what ? E.C.U ? What is this fucking thing you talking about ?"
"It's broken, look:" *shows a ECU that just met a BFH*
__________________
Now:
'03 KTM 250sx -- '05 KTM Adventure 950
Before:
'00 KTM 250sx -- '03 KTM 450sx -- '03 Yamaha R6 -- '08 KTM SuperDuke R --- '13 KTM 690 enduro R
Katoom72 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-21-2013, 08:38 PM   #4065
speed_racer
Studly Adventurer
 
speed_racer's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2011
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Oddometer: 705
lol simple.. if you have a accident, put it in rain mode, therefore you are at 100hp and conform ;)
speed_racer is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 10:31 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014