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Old 04-26-2012, 06:41 PM   #16
kailuasurfer
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ATGATT for me except for riding twisties - I wear jeans for better shifting and sliding my arse on turns. Motorcycle pants/suits are designed to "stick" to seats.
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Old 04-27-2012, 02:12 PM   #17
camaroz1985
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I had been thinking of this recently. I'm new to hacks, but I still feel like wearing ATGATT is a good idea. There are sometimes when I think it would be easier to not put on riding pants, and just wear jeans, but in the chance something happened, wouldn't you feel foolish knowing that something that could have made the incident less painful was just sitting on the shelf at home?

I'll stick to ATGATT, maybe the occasional trip to the store or around the block with jeans instead of riding pants.
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Old 04-27-2012, 03:36 PM   #18
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I have been an ATTGAT rider all my riding life on 2 wheels. On 3 wheels I have slacked off a lot except for the helmet.

This is a personal judgment call taking into consideration where I live and what I think may or may not happen and what risk I am willing to take.

I do always wear a helmet, sometimes half helmet mostly modular.

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Old 04-27-2012, 04:07 PM   #19
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RidingDonkeys to the white courtesy phone...

Every time I think of dressing down for a ride I think of this thread.
I do admit to wearing jeans for some local errands, but always helmet, jacket, gloves and boots.
Your choice, make it an educated one.......
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Old 04-27-2012, 04:35 PM   #20
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So...what EXACTLY is ATGATT?

I know what the abbreviation stands for, but what is all the gear? Is it leather jeans? Full face or open face helmets? Knee protectors? Spine protector, maybe?

Some have said they compromise on jeans, others on type of helmet, but what is 'all' the gear?
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Old 04-28-2012, 05:32 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by That Reverend Again View Post
So...what EXACTLY is ATGATT?

I know what the abbreviation stands for, but what is all the gear? Is it leather jeans? Full face or open face helmets? Knee protectors? Spine protector, maybe?

Some have said they compromise on jeans, others on type of helmet, but what is 'all' the gear?
In my case, full face helmet, jacket with shoulder, elbow and back pads, Cordura pants with knee pads, gloves and boots. My only serious accident occurred when a bike from the oncoming lane was hit and dropped into my lane, right in front of me. My bike launched over the front of the dropped bike at 45mph, landed and high-sided me off. I landed right on top of my head, ground a flat spot on the top of the helmet and I slid about 50 yards down the road. Hairline fracture of one neck vertebrae, lots of bruises and stiffness, a quarter sized rug through the butt of the Darien pants with a resulting strawberry on my cheek (I know TMI).
I thought the sidecar would be a bit less prone to this, but after reading RidingDonkeys report I feel the need for the gear.
YMMV
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Old 04-29-2012, 10:33 AM   #22
windmill
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Quote:
Originally Posted by That Reverend Again View Post
So...what EXACTLY is ATGATT?

I know what the abbreviation stands for, but what is all the gear? Is it leather jeans? Full face or open face helmets? Knee protectors? Spine protector, maybe?

Some have said they compromise on jeans, others on type of helmet, but what is 'all' the gear?
That is a very subjective question.

I wear a modular helmet, Barbour International jacket, work, riding, or ski gloves depending on weather, steel toe work boots, and jeans, I only wear overpants for cold or rain.

Some would consider that all the gear,

Some would point out that I wear no armor, or abrasion protective gear, boots with laces are inadequate. a modular helmet isn't as protective as a FF,

I think it is reasonable to say the more gear and the better it is, the better your odds are of reducing or possibly avoiding injury, but it's no guarantee that you will not be injured or killed in an accident.

IMO it id foolish to not wear at least the minimal gear as required for MSF classes, but in reality, luck has as much effect as gear, so probably the best level of protection is what you are most comfortable wearing.
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Old 04-29-2012, 11:40 AM   #23
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Funny how this question keeps popping up, and it has worked it's way from motorcycles, to scooters, and now here it is in Hacks.

The question is always the same: Do I really need it?

The answer is very simple. No. You don't need it.....UNTIL you need it.

Whether you ride a motorcycle, hack, or scooter, when you hit the ground and your uprotected skin faces off against the asphalt, the coefficient of friction between unprotected skin and asphalt remains the same.

The asphalt wins. Everytime.

I respect that it is a personal decision for each rider. I get that, really. Nobody likes to be told what to do or how to do it. For alot of folks, this discussion really raised the old hackles and the debate begins. Alot of emotional responses follow.

But in the end, it comes down to choices. Ride your own ride, make your own choices.

But, each rider should also be prepared to accept responsibility for their own actions, and face the consequences of those decisions.

For me, it sort of comes down to the old "For want of a nail..." scenario. Better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it.

A big part of my world in aviation is risk management. We know and accept there are inherent risks in what we do. We take the proper steps to reduce and hopefully eliminate those risks. I approach riding the same way.

But we know the risk is always there. The most effective tool we have is situational awareness, and not becoming complacent.

Complacency kills more effectively than even the most clueless, texting idiot in a car.

We also make sure we have the proper gear, because that gear might help give us the edge we need to survive if and when things go all pear-shaped.

In the end, we make our choices and take our chances.

Whatever I ride or may ride, I choose to do what I can to lessen the risks. Others choose differently.

Hopefully, we all make the right choice for ourselves and arrive in one piece.
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Old 04-29-2012, 06:17 PM   #24
rathackman
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Thanks Heyload....excellent post!

Brian
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Old 04-29-2012, 07:45 PM   #25
newenglandjim
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I know too well how vulnerable we really are on the road, I lost my left leg above the knee when an uninsured driver crossed the centerline and hit me head on. I had a helmet and gloves on but just jeans no riding pants but the doc said at that impact it wouldn't have made a difference what kind of pants i had on. I ride a hack because I can't ride a two wheeler anymore but I still know there is always the chance of something going really wrong so I always wear at least a helmet and gloves. Guys get killed on hacks from time to time. I knew the editer of a motorcycle riding magazine who got killed on a ural while entering a interstate, things happen so we may as well and try to be prepared.
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Old 04-30-2012, 07:58 AM   #26
mystery jig
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ATGATT is a good idea no matter what you ride. I think sidecar rigs are harder to master than two wheels. So, it's even more important, especially when starting out. Right hand turns are different from lefties and there's no graceful carving of turns with a hack. It's like a loving wrestling match nobody ever wins.

By far, the vast majority of head-strikes when crashing on two, or three, wheels are in the front. A half or three-quarter helmet won't help you there. You may ride slower on a hack, but the jerk who hits you will be going the same speed.
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Old 04-30-2012, 03:07 PM   #27
That Reverend Again
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heyload View Post
Funny how this question keeps popping up, and it has worked it's way from motorcycles, to scooters, and now here it is in Hacks.

The question is always the same: Do I really need it?

The answer is very simple. No. You don't need it.....UNTIL you need it.

Whether you ride a motorcycle, hack, or scooter, when you hit the ground and your uprotected skin faces off against the asphalt, the coefficient of friction between unprotected skin and asphalt remains the same.

The asphalt wins. Everytime.

I respect that it is a personal decision for each rider. I get that, really. Nobody likes to be told what to do or how to do it. For alot of folks, this discussion really raised the old hackles and the debate begins. Alot of emotional responses follow.

But in the end, it comes down to choices. Ride your own ride, make your own choices.

But, each rider should also be prepared to accept responsibility for their own actions, and face the consequences of those decisions.

For me, it sort of comes down to the old "For want of a nail..." scenario. Better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it.

A big part of my world in aviation is risk management. We know and accept there are inherent risks in what we do. We take the proper steps to reduce and hopefully eliminate those risks. I approach riding the same way.

But we know the risk is always there. The most effective tool we have is situational awareness, and not becoming complacent.

Complacency kills more effectively than even the most clueless, texting idiot in a car.

We also make sure we have the proper gear, because that gear might help give us the edge we need to survive if and when things go all pear-shaped.

In the end, we make our choices and take our chances.

Whatever I ride or may ride, I choose to do what I can to lessen the risks. Others choose differently.

Hopefully, we all make the right choice for ourselves and arrive in one piece.
That, my friend is a blinding explanation. Thank you. Thirty years in the UK Police with much of that in 'traffic', and plenty of crash investigation exams behind me, I agree wholeheartedly.
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Old 04-30-2012, 04:01 PM   #28
Marvin and towser
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I wouldn't worry about feeling indestructible. When I picked my combination up and tried to drive it home I spent the first 25 miles just hoping that the seemingly inevitable crash wouldn't hurt anyone else. The next 100 highish speed (60-70mph) miles wondering if my arms would always hurt so much and the last 25 pottering and starting to enjoy it. I don't feel any more indestructible on the combination than on my normal bike. My passengers also where helmets and gloves but the chair is roll caged up so legs don't matter as they are harnessed in.
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Old 04-30-2012, 04:25 PM   #29
Leaf
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I'll be the voice of insanity, since nobody else is. :P

Let me preface this with: I still don't have my hack mounted, but I'd wear the same gear that I wear on the 2-wheelers.

When I am in the pasture herding cattle, I wear no protective gear at all (except for the work boots I always wear, and a pair of leather work gloves if I happened to be wearing them before hopping on the bike). Incidentally, this is where I've had my worst accident to date, which involved getting the front wheel of a very elderly XR200 sideways in a ditch and flipping both me and the bike over a fence while trying to cut off a particularly bull-headed heifer. There was no injury other than bruises and soreness, and the bike only suffered triple-tree tweakage and a bent brake lever. That was a heck of a bike. And I expect I am less robust of body these days, so I don't chase them as aggressively. But I digress...

When I am tooling around the rural roads here, I always wear a helmet (though 3/4), always wear gloves unless I am just bopping down to the store down the road and back (bugs to the bare fingers at 60mph sucks), and always wear a leather or armored textile jacket unless it's really hot out. In the winter, I wear an insulated canvas coverall under everything, but I expect it has minimal protection value.

When I go into the "city" (pop. 30,000) wherein dwell those rabid 4-wheeled things that keep trying to kill me, or hooning about in the woods at high speed, I always wear everything, no matter how hot it is. I don't have armored pants, but use a 600 denier cordura coverall, under the jacket...
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Old 04-30-2012, 04:37 PM   #30
asrvivor OP
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Commonality

It seems the one common denominator here is the pants. I still have not had my Ural delivered. I am gathering though that the sliding around on the seat needs to be done in a slippery type fashion. It seems a lot of you wear jeans. So I ordered some of the slight pad type jeans Alpinestars Logic Kevlar Denim Pants. Has anyone had any experience with these being ok to do the arse slide on the seat. They seem to have minimal protection, but still add some road rash protection. I think this is the only change I will make to the gear line up. My Aerostitch riding pants are huge and I feel the may be too cumbersome on the seat and between the bike and car. The pads on my current pants are 8 in. wide.
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