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Old 04-27-2012, 08:15 AM   #31
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I drive one of the quickest small production cars made in the year 2000. Yesterday, following a Prius merging on the freeway, I had to really push it to keep up. They are not slow. I personally wouldn't own one, but they are mainstream now. Get over it.




Exactly what kind of grade are you talking about. And how 'fast' can it be if it is as steep as you say?
Not sure but this is in the middle of nowhere so the average car is taking these turns double the speed limit (and there are huge drop offs with just a little guard rail sometimes...).
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Old 04-27-2012, 08:31 AM   #32
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A Prius will do just fine, but I don't think it's the best vehicle for the terrain. I drive a friends pretty regularly since my current vehicle has decided to be a piece of shit lately. I've taken it up a lot of long steep grades with zero issue.

The issue in hilly places is the mileage goes down a fair bit below what you're hoping for with the car. You are on the gas, and well out of "eco" mode getting up the hills. Yes, you do recover some power going down the hills, but only to the extent that the batteries will hold. Since you're on gas going up, the batteries aren't really being drained, and you're really just topping them off a little going back down. You will NOT see 40mpg highway in a steep mountain area in my experience.

Because of this, I really would skip the whole hybrid range, and just go for a high mileage gasser. It's neat tech in certain situations, but I really think you need to analyze driving habits to make the best use of them. Around town, a Prius rocks.

Oh yeah, one other point. Usually when I think mountain areas, I think cold, or at least cool a lot of the time. Keep in mind that in colder weather, the batteries in a hybrid are not working very well, and your mileage will go down even further. I watched this happen all this past winter.
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Old 04-27-2012, 08:33 AM   #33
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Not sure but this is in the middle of nowhere so the average car is taking these turns double the speed limit (and there are huge drop offs with just a little guard rail sometimes...).
Then the Prius will do just fine power wise with 178 combined hp. And the 98hp of the gas engine will do fine, you act like it doesn't have low gears. Sort of... Suspension might be more of an issue, but they are releasing a Sport model.
The plugin with a 0-60 of 11.3 is not quite the dog you say. Quicker than a lot of older Toyotas. http://www.zeroto60times.com/Toyota-0-60-mph-Times.html There is getting be less and less reason to hate.

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You will NOT see 40mpg highway in a steep mountain area in my experience.
.
WTF does a hybrid have to do with that? Every car requires more energy to go up hill.
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Old 04-27-2012, 08:41 AM   #34
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WTF does a hybrid have to do with that? Every car requires more energy to go up hill.
The reasons a Prius will get ~50mpg in the city is that it does things like recovering energy braking and coasting, shutting off at traffic lights, etc. If you're buying a Prius because it's a high mpg car, but driving it around on the gas all the time, you aren't getting nearly the mpg you would hoping for.

If you aren't getting high mpg, I can't really find a lot of reasons to buy a Prius. It's not exactly a blast to drive.
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Old 04-27-2012, 08:51 AM   #35
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The reasons a Prius will get ~50mpg in the city is that it does things like recovering energy braking and coasting, shutting off at traffic lights, etc. If you're buying a Prius because it's a high mpg car, but driving it around on the gas all the time, you aren't getting nearly the mpg you would hoping for.

If you aren't getting high mpg, I can't really find a lot of reasons to buy a Prius. It's not exactly a blast to drive.
48 mpg highway. How do you explain that 'inefficiency'?
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Old 04-27-2012, 09:14 AM   #36
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I know my opinion won't change your Dad's mind but here is my opinion of my GF's Prius. What an amazingly craptastic car. She bought it without really thinking about it...just heard all the hype about it getting good gas mileage.

She then proceeded to drive it like a normal car and got 32 mpg. Ya what an amazing bit of technology there. Only after retraining herself was she able to get into the 40's. And yes that is doing the 10mph under the speed limit, creeping up hills (which it will not do on ev power alone) and generally being a pain in traffic.
I call bullshit. Unless 'driving it like it's a normal car' entails flooring it from every stop, and jamming on the brakes coming to every stop, it's damned tough to get mileage that bad.

Has she checked the tire pressure lately? They seem to be really sensitive to that.

I drive mine like a normal car, too. A couple of weeks, Mrs. Dave and I went from our place in northern DE to her folks place in upstate NY. Even over the mountains in PA, with the cruise on 70, 2 people, 2 dogs, and a car load of stuff, we got 51 mpg, round trip. Even around town, it's in the high 40s.

I will admit, in the dead of summer, or winter, when the heat or A/C is going just about all the time, mileage will dip into the low 40s.
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Old 04-27-2012, 09:18 AM   #37
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Oh and it's getting 45mpg
Up to, average, sometimes, minimum, under all conditions, on the race track, in the far right lane 15mph under the speed limit, just going downhill, rush-hour traffic, up in the mountains, in my dreams or just once on the way home from the dealer?
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Old 04-27-2012, 09:27 AM   #38
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As long as we keep buying 19th century technology, the auto mfgs will keep making the damn things with shitty mileage and such.

We scream how we want new technology, yet so many are unwilling to invest until it's "perfect" - how long would it have taken for the car to be perfected under those conditions? Early adopters were comparing 'em to horses and horses were considered better for many years eh?

FWIW, I'm on a second hand Lexus 400h, and we like it a lot - it's way faster than we need, and turns an average in our use of 26 mpg, a mix of country roads and freeway, very little stop and go driving. That's damn good for a 5,000 lb bus. And better than my Toyota Pickup and about the same on average as my Subi 2.5L/4

All you notice when the battery gets low is that you will be working the motor harder and when they get home, the battery may be 'low' but that does not hurt anything and the way down in the AM will top off the battery.
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Old 04-27-2012, 09:33 AM   #39
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Baaaaaah hog wash
The inlaws have had every version of the Prius the live in the Santa Cruz man out side of Los gators ca.
Steep winding man roads with fast traffic. None of their priuses have given them any trouble on any hills including the Rockies.

We have a first gen civic hybrid. It will pull 80mph over 4,000feet passes.
An old neighbor of mine has a first gen that he uses for a 2,800 ft descent/climb every day. There are literally hundreds of Prii crawling around those mountains without complaint.
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Old 04-27-2012, 10:02 AM   #40
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I live in Colorado and drive the interstate a bit where the speed limit is 75. I normally cruise at 75-80. I get passed a lot between Colorado Springs and Denver by Priuses. I've rented one before and think they move just fine and we got around 45 MG average. No idea about regularly driving up steep hills but as an everyday car I'd have no problem with it. I'd like to get one down the road myself for our "around town" car.

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Old 04-27-2012, 10:04 AM   #41
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I've driven mine (an '08) over mountain passes many times. The battery does drain going uphill for a sustained period but once it gets down to a certain point the car's computer prevents it from discharging further and you simply run on the gas/internal-combustion engine. I don't know what percentage of grade your dad is looking at, but I have found that I can cruise along at 65-70 without difficulty on just about any typical uphill gradient.
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Old 04-27-2012, 10:06 AM   #42
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Up to, average, sometimes, minimum, under all conditions, on the race track, in the far right lane 15mph under the speed limit, just going downhill, rush-hour traffic, up in the mountains, in my dreams or just once on the way home from the dealer?
Mine averages 42mpg in the winter and 50-51mpg in the summer. Average. Over thousands of miles of varied driving.
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Old 04-27-2012, 10:09 AM   #43
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I call bullshit. Unless 'driving it like it's a normal car' entails flooring it from every stop, and jamming on the brakes coming to every stop, it's damned tough to get mileage that bad.

Has she checked the tire pressure lately? They seem to be really sensitive to that.

I drive mine like a normal car, too. A couple of weeks, Mrs. Dave and I went from our place in northern DE to her folks place in upstate NY. Even over the mountains in PA, with the cruise on 70, 2 people, 2 dogs, and a car load of stuff, we got 51 mpg, round trip. Even around town, it's in the high 40s.

I will admit, in the dead of summer, or winter, when the heat or A/C is going just about all the time, mileage will dip into the low 40s.
+1. In order to get 32mpg out of a Prius you'd have to work at it. Lower the pressure in the tires to about 20psi, put a rack on top, fill the back with bricks, and drive like a total asshat, and you'd maybe get there.
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Old 04-27-2012, 10:37 AM   #44
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Call BS all ya want...just sharing my/our miserable experience with the car. Yes you can put it into power mode and it has more than enough go to do just about anything.

Driving my Miata, normally, not sporty I get 30 mpg

Driving the Prius on that commute 32 mpg.

Yes you can hypermile/drive like a grandma and get some incredible mileage out of the thing. But said driving style takes me down to 17mph on one of the hills if I try to keep the display out of the pwr area on the right. (not my pic, found on the net to illustrate what I am talking about)



And yes the tires are the stock low rolling resistance tires and they are properly inflated. Toyota certified mechanic checked it over as well and there is nothing wrong with the car that they could find. They said our mileage figures fall within the normal operating range.

You like your Prii.....great! I'm happy for you, I really am. But my girlfriends.....Well I just don't see the point of it. If driven in the same hypermiling way, I bet the new Fiesta would be able to post some damn high numbers as well. (Just did a little research and there is a 50mpg club on one of the Fiesta forums)

Jimmy the Heater screwed with this post 04-27-2012 at 10:43 AM
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Old 04-27-2012, 10:45 AM   #45
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I drive one of the quickest small production cars made in the year 2000. Yesterday, following a Prius merging on the freeway, I had to really push it to keep up. They are not slow. I personally wouldn't own one, but they are mainstream now. Get over it.
2000 was a long time ago in terms of performance, particularly for small cars. a VW GTI in 2000 had 150HP, now they have 200. On your second point, I've never said the car's aren't capable, it's the sanctimonious idiots that drive them that are the problem. I drove one as a rental for a while, they are appliances, designed for people that don't enjoy driving, nothing more.
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