ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Bikes > Hacks
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 07-12-2012, 09:33 AM   #1216
MotoJ
Mobtown Hacker
 
MotoJ's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2011
Location: Baltimore
Oddometer: 1,065
Quote:
Originally Posted by windmill View Post
Bokad,

Forget about what some people are saying about you, stop recounting the event, and figure out what happened!

Yes, your brake failed.
Giving you the benefit of doubt that it wasn't operator error. then it had to be contaminated fluid, corrosion on the caliper, debris, or a bent brake mount. It didn't just happen without some cause at 9000km, it had nothing to do with Ural OC , improper dealer setup, it's not a "bad batch" issue.
It has to be either lack of maintenance, or it was physically damaged, which is it?

You really need to figure it out, your lives depend on it.


Please try to remember, the opinions of a few abrasive Ural enthusiasts do not represent all Ural owners, saying the "Ural crowd" and other broad brush statements are not justified.

As you like to point out, there have been many threads on many forums about problems with Urals, and they have not become epic pissing matches like this one. Whats the common denominator? Have you ever considered that it could be your peripheral statements, and not your mechanical issues that have been the real issue with many?
Present company excepted, of course, but I've never seen such heinous personal attacks as in this thread, from some Ural owners against Bokad. Whatever his retorts he hasn't stooped to the level some here have. His criticisms have been about the bike. In return he's been called a pussy, an idiot, stupid, etc., and he's now held by one member in "contempt and disgust". I think anyone reading this thread impartially will see the imbalance. It's a poor showing by some Uralistas IMHO.
__________________
The ladies used to check me out...now they just keep an eye on me.
MotoJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2012, 09:38 AM   #1217
Mr. Cob
Howling "Mad", Adventurer
 
Mr. Cob's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2001
Location: Granite Falls, Washington State, USA
Oddometer: 9,162
Quote:
Originally Posted by gspell68 View Post
I think Ural did have a recall on some of the rear hydralic brakes and sidecar brakes for about 3-4 consecutive years. Maybe the front brakes are catching up on the failures?

I don't know how well the 750 OHV can engine brake, but a 750 SV in the mild foothills of Germany, from a 5mph rolling start in first gear, will eventually, under the power of gravity, exceed the RPM's and speed it's capable of under its own power. It's really scary having to rely on the motorcycle's (no sidecar brake) hard, nasty, oil-soaked, "lineoleum" brake shoes for the whole ride down the mountain.
Howdy gspell68,

Thank you for your post. I have been trying to explain to bokad that if you start at 20 mph in 1st gear whilst going down hill you have already exceeded most of the engine braking the low compression engine of the Ural is capable of providing. When descending steep grades especially with a low compression engine you have to do so SLOWLY if you want to maintain control.

bokad, in an honest effort to help you understand engine braking and how compression ratio factors into it please do a bit of goggling and read up on "Jake" brakes and "exhaust" brakes that are commonly used on trucks. I have thought about experimenting with building an "exhaust" brake on the Ural similar to the one that my diesel truck is equipped with.

Years ago a person could buy from speed shops what was commonly called and "exhaust cutout", this was a devise that allowed by use of a cable operated valve the ability to direct your exhaust to exit the tail pipe BEFORE it entered the muffler. This lessened back pressure and to an extent increased horse power. The "exhaust" brake on my Cummins diesel works the same way only in reverse, it has an air powered valve that when you let up on the throttle partially closes off the exhaust pipe which causes the exhaust to back up into the engine thereby increasing the resistance to the pistons as the crankshaft rotates.

Like I said I have thought about experimenting with this but as I have never really had any problem being able to control the speed of my Ural's when braking on hills it hasn't been worth the effort to pursue the project.
__________________
Dave, aka "Mr. Cob"

My photos, http://mr-cob.smugmug.com/ Help a CHEAP bastard keep his Smugmug, use this coupon ( geyYbNZwLLrl6 ) thank you.
Mr. Cob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2012, 09:43 AM   #1218
Mr. Cob
Howling "Mad", Adventurer
 
Mr. Cob's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2001
Location: Granite Falls, Washington State, USA
Oddometer: 9,162
Quote:
Originally Posted by MotoJ View Post
Present company excepted, of course, but I've never seen such heinous personal attacks as in this thread, from some Ural owners against Bokad. Whatever his retorts he hasn't stooped to the level some here have. His criticisms have been about the bike. In return he's been called a pussy, an idiot, stupid, etc., and he's now held by one member in "contempt and disgust". I think anyone reading this thread impartially will see the imbalance. It's a poor showing by some Uralistas IMHO.
I used the words "contempt and disgust" and meant them sincerely, I also used the words "in my opinion" and meant them as well. It would appear that you either misread or over looked bokads knocking of not only the machine but the country and the people who built it as well the other Ural owners. I think there is enough kool aid drinking from both sides to entertain a casual reader who stumbles across this thread, but then again its just my opinion.
__________________
Dave, aka "Mr. Cob"

My photos, http://mr-cob.smugmug.com/ Help a CHEAP bastard keep his Smugmug, use this coupon ( geyYbNZwLLrl6 ) thank you.
Mr. Cob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2012, 09:49 AM   #1219
Heyload
Remastered Classic
 
Heyload's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2009
Location: San Antonio
Oddometer: 7,222
Interesting thought.

Would a "Jake" work on a normal engine as opposed to a diesel? Hmmm...
__________________
"Would you care for some left-over bacon?"...said no man, ever.

When life gives you melons, you might be dyslexic.
Heyload is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2012, 10:05 AM   #1220
Mr. Cob
Howling "Mad", Adventurer
 
Mr. Cob's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2001
Location: Granite Falls, Washington State, USA
Oddometer: 9,162
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heyload View Post
Interesting thought.

Would a "Jake" work on a normal engine as opposed to a diesel? Hmmm...
Howdy Heyload,

A "Jake" brake uses a mechanical mechanism to actually hold an extra exhaust valves open, click here for a good explanation of how it works.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compres...e_engine_brake

Click here to read how an "exhaust" brake works.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exhaust_brake

How such a devise would work on a regular gasoline engine I don't know, I do know that on my old Bultaco TWO STROKE dirt bike that had a compression release on it, you could activate the compression release while engine was running and the bike was in motion and it acted exactly like how a Jake brake works, if this would work in a common four stroke engine I don't know.
__________________
Dave, aka "Mr. Cob"

My photos, http://mr-cob.smugmug.com/ Help a CHEAP bastard keep his Smugmug, use this coupon ( geyYbNZwLLrl6 ) thank you.
Mr. Cob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2012, 10:11 AM   #1221
bokad OP
Difficult Child
 
Joined: Nov 2011
Location: Wherever it is warm.
Oddometer: 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Cob View Post
At first when you started this thread I kinda felt sorry for your troubles, as it continues and it becomes more and more evident that you truly are not in possession of some basic skills and are in need of being an "Internet legend" I have come to view you and your whining with contempt and disgust. I rarely voice such opinion but some folks yourself included just bring out the "Cob" side of my personality.
It's just so convenient for you to blame everything on one person and completely ignore the fact that other people have identical problems. Very useful mental trick there! Divert conversation away from Ural quality or design problems, attack people who mention Ural problems, pretend it is only a single person problem. Blame the rider! Blame the rider!

I ask again:
Those other people that have identical problems to mine, those other swing arm, final drive, and failed brakes, is that their fault too?

bokad screwed with this post 07-12-2012 at 10:17 AM
bokad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2012, 10:11 AM   #1222
MotoJ
Mobtown Hacker
 
MotoJ's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2011
Location: Baltimore
Oddometer: 1,065
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Cob View Post
I used the words "contempt and disgust" and meant them sincerely, I also used the words "in my opinion" and meant them as well. It would appear that you either misread or over looked bokads knocking of not only the machine but the country and the people who built it as well the other Ural owners. I think there is enough kool aid drinking from both sides to entertain a casual reader who stumbles across this thread, but then again its just my opinion.
If you go through and read it all again, you'll see the level of vitriol from the Ural side far surpasses anything Bokad posted. Hell, scroll through just the last 3-4 pages.

And if you have sincere "contempt and disgust" for anyone just because they criticize your brand of bike you're taking this shit waaay too seriously.
__________________
The ladies used to check me out...now they just keep an eye on me.
MotoJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2012, 10:13 AM   #1223
Heyload
Remastered Classic
 
Heyload's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2009
Location: San Antonio
Oddometer: 7,222
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Cob View Post
Howdy Heyload,

A "Jake" brake uses a mechanical mechanism to actually hold an extra exhaust valves open, click here for a good explanation of how it works.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compres...e_engine_brake

Click here to read how an "exhaust" brake works.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exhaust_brake


How such a devise would work on a regular gasoline engine I don't know, I do know that on my old Bultaco TWO STROKE dirt bike that had a compression release on it, you could activate the compression release while engine was running and the bike was in motion and it acted exactly like how a Jake brake works, if this would work in a common four stroke engine I don't know.
I am familiar with "Jake" brakes and how they work. I was thinking a regular gasoline engine (four stroke) relies on the throttle to achieve engine-braking rather than the exhaust valve approach of a Jake in a diesel. I don't think there would be enough compression to release in a regular engine on the critical stroke to gain any advantage with a "Jake" styled mechanism, whereas diesels are all about compression.

Back pressure through an exhaust system set up, though...maybe. Diesels tend to turn at far fewer rpms, though. I can't help but think adding in additional back pressure would be a recipe for broken engine parts for an engine already pushing it's limits with regular compression back pressure. Then again, Urals don't rev particularly high, if I'm not mistaken?

Intriguing...
__________________
"Would you care for some left-over bacon?"...said no man, ever.

When life gives you melons, you might be dyslexic.
Heyload is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2012, 10:18 AM   #1224
Mr. Cob
Howling "Mad", Adventurer
 
Mr. Cob's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2001
Location: Granite Falls, Washington State, USA
Oddometer: 9,162
Quote:
Originally Posted by bokad View Post
It's just so convenient for you to blame everything on me and completely ignore the fact that other people have identical problems. Very useful mental trick there. Divert conversation away from Ural quality or design problems, attack people who mention Ural problems, pretend it is only a single person problem. Blame the rider! Blame the rider!
If the shoe fits, wear it.

Reading through this thread its plain to see that I am not the only one who feels most of your problems are self inflicted as are many of the other problems lamented about by others who ride Ural's. I dare say HALF the problems that are written up on the net concerning Ural's are because of inept owners, how they ride or maintain their machines.

Many of us do things with our Ural's that make your "stressed" ride pale in comparison but if it makes you feel better to discount the experience of MANY who have a heck of a lot more saddle time then you have on Ural's by all means do so it only proves my point.
__________________
Dave, aka "Mr. Cob"

My photos, http://mr-cob.smugmug.com/ Help a CHEAP bastard keep his Smugmug, use this coupon ( geyYbNZwLLrl6 ) thank you.
Mr. Cob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2012, 10:27 AM   #1225
Mr. Cob
Howling "Mad", Adventurer
 
Mr. Cob's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2001
Location: Granite Falls, Washington State, USA
Oddometer: 9,162
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heyload View Post
I am familiar with "Jake" brakes and how they work. I was thinking a regular gasoline engine (four stroke) relies on the throttle to achieve engine-braking rather than the exhaust valve approach of a Jake in a diesel. I don't think there would be enough compression to release in a regular engine on the critical stroke to gain any advantage with a "Jake" styled mechanism, whereas diesels are all about compression.

Back pressure through an exhaust system set up, though...maybe. Diesels tend to turn at far fewer rpms, though. I can't help but think adding in additional back pressure would be a recipe for broken engine parts for an engine already pushing it's limits with regular compression back pressure. Then again, Urals don't rev particularly high, if I'm not mistaken?

Intriguing...
Howdy Heyload,

And there you have hit upon the "probable" reason that gasoline engines DON'T use any type of exhaust brake, the engine itself is NOT designed or built to take the HIGH stresses induced by any form of exhaust or Jake brake. That is what has kept me from fiddling with this, I know what a pain in the ass it is to keep a head gasket in a high performance gasoline engine after having built and driven cars on the drag strip many years ago that ran within 2/10 of a second off the national record.

Adding to the compression ratio by using an exhaust brake would be inviting disaster in a high compression gasoline engine, but "IF" the head gaskets could take it and you didn't over stress the crank-rod bearings on a low compression engine such as the Ural, it just might be of "some" benefit. Then again the adding an exhaust brake to a Ural just might bokad the whole fucking thing and truly make it a bokaded RPOC.
__________________
Dave, aka "Mr. Cob"

My photos, http://mr-cob.smugmug.com/ Help a CHEAP bastard keep his Smugmug, use this coupon ( geyYbNZwLLrl6 ) thank you.
Mr. Cob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2012, 10:39 AM   #1226
Heyload
Remastered Classic
 
Heyload's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2009
Location: San Antonio
Oddometer: 7,222
I'm a big fan of the "KISS" principle, myself.

I honestly think, though, that adding any kind of additional braking force with such a system on this engine would gain you as much as say, dragging your feet Fred Flintstone-style.

Adding complexity with such a system..well..sort of defeats the point of having such a simple machine to begin with, said simplicity being a big part of it's appeal.

A Ural sort of reminds me of chess. Easy to figure out, complicated to master...but therein lies the challenge.
__________________
"Would you care for some left-over bacon?"...said no man, ever.

When life gives you melons, you might be dyslexic.

Heyload screwed with this post 07-12-2012 at 11:42 AM
Heyload is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2012, 10:43 AM   #1227
Schatzman
I Saved Latin
 
Schatzman's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2010
Location: Omnipresent
Oddometer: 3,661
Quote:
Originally Posted by MotoJ View Post
If you go through and read it all again, you'll see the level of vitriol from the Ural side far surpasses anything Bokad posted. Hell, scroll through just the last 3-4 pages.

And if you have sincere "contempt and disgust" for anyone just because they criticize your brand of bike you're taking this shit waaay too seriously.
People are pissed because this thread is completely fucking stupid at this point. If in fact the Brembo part failed, that is on Brembo. I don't care if people like Ural or not. What I care about is the misrepresentation going on about Ural and the people who run the company. IMWA has been beyond awesome to me and I won't stand by while someone makes false claims about their product.

Once again, if the bike is so faulty that all of these parts have broken because of quality control on IMWA's part, how would anyone in their right mind climb back on the saddle? If it were me, I would be doing several other things then posting on here about it. I would be parking the thing in a garage, I would be on the phone with IMWA-USA screaming at Jason, and be finding someway to get the issue(s) resolved. To have several major failures like this, and according to the OP being Ural's fault, should not leave him comfortable about the bike. He needs to shit or get off the pot. Don't waste people's time with this thread anymore. If the bike is a total unsafe POS, and I would say having the brakes "fail" would qualify as unsafe, then don't ride it anymore. One's life is more valuable then the Ural. Find a solution. That could be shipping the bike back home and renting something else or calling IMWA and seeing if they will give him another bike to ride in the mean time.
__________________
Quote:
In short, life is made into a nonstop, commercially prepackaged masturbational fantasy.
-Allan Bloom
Schatzman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2012, 10:48 AM   #1228
Mr. Cob
Howling "Mad", Adventurer
 
Mr. Cob's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2001
Location: Granite Falls, Washington State, USA
Oddometer: 9,162
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heyload View Post
I'm a big fan of the "KISS" principle, myself.

I honestly think, though, that adding any kind of additional braking force with such a system on this engine would gain you as much as say, dragging your feet Fred Flintstone-style.

Adding complexity with such a system..well..sort of defeats the point of having such a simple machine to begin with, said simplicity being a big part of it's appeal.

A Ural sort of remind me of chess. Easy to figure out, complicated to master...but therein lies the challenge.
Howdy Heyload,

AGAIN, what you have written is simply common sense and goes along way toward why even thou I have thought about it, I have not spent the time and money to pursue such a devise on the Ural. Like many of the so called fixes that have been offered to the Ural, it is a solution to a problem that if ridden or maintained properly never existed.
__________________
Dave, aka "Mr. Cob"

My photos, http://mr-cob.smugmug.com/ Help a CHEAP bastard keep his Smugmug, use this coupon ( geyYbNZwLLrl6 ) thank you.
Mr. Cob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2012, 10:53 AM   #1229
Heyload
Remastered Classic
 
Heyload's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2009
Location: San Antonio
Oddometer: 7,222
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Cob View Post
Howdy Heyload,

AGAIN, what you have written is simply common sense and goes along way toward why even thou I have thought about it, I have not spent the time and money to pursue such a devise on the Ural. Like many of the so called fixes that have been offered to the Ural, it is a solution to a problem that if ridden or maintained properly never existed.
Fair dinkum.
__________________
"Would you care for some left-over bacon?"...said no man, ever.

When life gives you melons, you might be dyslexic.
Heyload is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-2012, 11:11 AM   #1230
Mr. Cob
Howling "Mad", Adventurer
 
Mr. Cob's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2001
Location: Granite Falls, Washington State, USA
Oddometer: 9,162
Quote:
Originally Posted by MotoJ View Post
If you go through and read it all again, you'll see the level of vitriol from the Ural side far surpasses anything Bokad posted. Hell, scroll through just the last 3-4 pages.

And if you have sincere "contempt and disgust" for anyone just because they criticize your brand of bike you're taking this shit waaay too seriously.
Apparently you haven't taken the time to learn a bit about me and my "brand" of bike. I am currently DOWN to 8 bikes in my stable, all different brands built to different jobs, dirt bikes for playing on the skinny trails, a RCK for knocking down 1,000 plus mile days , and R1 for being truly nuts, etc.

For years I have put up with the same stupidity when it comes to assholes many of whom have never even sat on a Hog let alone ride one talk about what pieces of shit they are. The same type of person seems to gravitate toward Hogs as does Ural's they like the look of the machine but don't have a fucking clue about learning to ride or how to maintain the bike but will piss and moan at the first broken fingernail, dead battery from lack of use, drop of oil on the floor etc. Both brands would be better served if the damned rubs would just go buy a Honda, oh and I have owned and ridden a few Honda's in my time too.

What I take seriously is someone who is partaking in what most of us would agree is the trip of a life time yet wastes his time on the net spewing his opinions and passing them off as a universal condemnation of an entire brand of motorcycle based on HIS limited experience. I would feel the same way if some loon started a thread called, "Why you should NOT buy a Harley, Honda, BMW, Kawasaki, KTM, Ducati, Yamaha,..................motorcycle".

Like I said and not in any bullshitting about this, if I were on a trip like bokad is, if I had the trouble he has had with the machine that he has had be it from bad quality control the fault of Ural or self induced malfunctions, if the rig had nearly killed me and my passenger according to him twice, if I couldn't sell it I would have stripped it of any identification and left it burning in a fucking ditch bought another machine and continued my journey.
__________________
Dave, aka "Mr. Cob"

My photos, http://mr-cob.smugmug.com/ Help a CHEAP bastard keep his Smugmug, use this coupon ( geyYbNZwLLrl6 ) thank you.
Mr. Cob is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 05:20 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014