ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Bikes > Battle scooters
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 09-02-2012, 02:16 AM   #91
Cortez
BAZINGA!
 
Cortez's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2006
Location: Croatia
Oddometer: 6,780
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaseyJones View Post
Yup.

Aside from the troll's static...what puts me off on them is WHY BMW went and got into the scooter market. What are they bringing to the fore that no one else offers?

For example...I can see how Suzuki got there. It's a logical progression to their providing easy-use two-wheeled transportation to a wide variety of customers.

BMW...has been a builder of superb road motorcycles and more recently, dual-sport and motocross machines. Why, except for the profit, should they be tapping the scooter market? A scooter is by definition a compromise. All but the Burgman 650 have a swing-axle-mounted motor. All have high seating. Most have tires smaller than touring bikes.

I had the same reaction years ago when Mercedes-Benz entered the station-wagon, and later SUV, markets. WHY, except to rake off easy sales?

I'm not opposed to BMWs. I had an R1200GS...couldn't afford it, but loved it. Covered my losses in the sale. But part of their brilliance, in the past, has been FOCUS.

Not unlike Harley-Davidson. I'd never buy one; but I admire them for knowing their market, focusing on it, and crafting for it and cultivating it.
No one is doing it to provide "easy-use two-wheeled transportation",
they do it for the money. It can't be any simpler.
__________________
'08 Yamaha FZ6n S2 ABS

SOLD: '03 Peugeot Speedfight2, '07 Kawasaki ER6F ABS, '06 Kymco Agility 125, '12 Kymco Downtown 300i ABS
My Flickr gallery --- My 500px gallery
Cortez is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2012, 06:07 AM   #92
CaseyJones
Ridin' that train
 
Joined: Aug 2010
Location: Northern Wisconsin
Oddometer: 753
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cortez View Post
No one is doing it to provide "easy-use two-wheeled transportation",
they do it for the money. It can't be any simpler.
It's simple...to see who's doing it just to make a buck; and who's doing something because they believe in the product they're making.

Profit is always at the root of any business. But a desire ONLY to make money, is at the base of consumer ripoffs and outrages.

Is there a difference between what's sold by Toyota and what was sold by Yugo America? A difference between Suzuki's offerings and Tank Sports' products?
__________________
2007 Burgman 650 Executive...my last hurrah
2011 Xingyue XY300t-4 - Rust in pieces, all over my garage floor. Make me an offer!
2005 Honda BigRuckus...The Last Word; the Armageddon AdventureRide.
CaseyJones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2012, 06:42 AM   #93
klaviator
Beastly Adventurer
 
klaviator's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2008
Location: Huntsville, AL
Oddometer: 5,631
BMW's strategy is to offer premium products at a premium price. They have worked hard to offer innovation and superior technology. Whether or not their products are worth the price is open to debate but enough people have thought so to keep them in business and making a profit. I see nothing wrong with BMW making a scooter. The idea that they shouldn't because a scooter is a compromise just doesn't make sense. ALL motorcycles are also a compromise. As long as the new scooter meets the expectations of what people want from a premium priced BMW, it will sell. Although I have no interest in getting a scooter this large and heavy, it's always good to see another offering in the market. Perhaps BMW will get more respect for scooters in general.

If Ducati can sell a premium priced cruiser, BMW should be able to sell a scooter.

Hmmmm, maybe we'll see a V twin powered Ducati scooter in the future??
__________________
I ride, Therefore I Am.



klaviator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2012, 07:26 AM   #94
InlineSkate
Adventurer
 
Joined: Jul 2012
Location: Bay City, MI
Oddometer: 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by klaviator View Post
BMW's strategy is to offer premium products at a premium price. They have worked hard to offer innovation and superior technology. Whether or not their products are worth the price is open to debate but enough people have thought so to keep them in business and making a profit. I see nothing wrong with BMW making a scooter. The idea that they shouldn't because a scooter is a compromise just doesn't make sense. ALL motorcycles are also a compromise. As long as the new scooter meets the expectations of what people want from a premium priced BMW, it will sell. Although I have no interest in getting a scooter this large and heavy, it's always good to see another offering in the market. Perhaps BMW will get more respect for scooters in general.

If Ducati can sell a premium priced cruiser, BMW should be able to sell a scooter.

Hmmmm, maybe we'll see a V twin powered Ducati scooter in the future??
I never understood why people call scooters compromises of motorcycles. They both have their advantages and disadvantages over one another.

A motorcycle in many cases will be quicker, but a scooter will be easier to ride and be more practical for around town.
InlineSkate is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2012, 08:11 AM   #95
CaseyJones
Ridin' that train
 
Joined: Aug 2010
Location: Northern Wisconsin
Oddometer: 753
Quote:
Originally Posted by klaviator View Post
BMW's strategy is to offer premium products at a premium price. They have worked hard to offer innovation and superior technology.
That's true. But they have their level of expertise, and it cannot cover everything.

"Know your business." Harley-Davidson is very good at what they do - the knockoffs prove that; they're literally cheap imitations. BMW, likewise. For BMW to imitate the UJB with an integral gearcase, wet clutch and chain, would be like Yamaha imitating a BMW boxer.

You wouldn't buy the Yamaha boxer, at least not until it had been proven. And had the design problems worked out.

Likewise, you wouldn't buy the BMW UJB imitation - why bother?

So...why would I buy the BMW scooter? There ARE going to be problems with it; it's so alien to what BMW knows how to do.
__________________
2007 Burgman 650 Executive...my last hurrah
2011 Xingyue XY300t-4 - Rust in pieces, all over my garage floor. Make me an offer!
2005 Honda BigRuckus...The Last Word; the Armageddon AdventureRide.
CaseyJones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2012, 09:02 AM   #96
klaviator
Beastly Adventurer
 
klaviator's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2008
Location: Huntsville, AL
Oddometer: 5,631
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaseyJones View Post
That's true. But they have their level of expertise, and it cannot cover everything.

"Know your business." Harley-Davidson is very good at what they do - the knockoffs prove that; they're literally cheap imitations. BMW, likewise. For BMW to imitate the UJB with an integral gearcase, wet clutch and chain, would be like Yamaha imitating a BMW boxer.

You wouldn't buy the Yamaha boxer, at least not until it had been proven. And had the design problems worked out.

Likewise, you wouldn't buy the BMW UJB imitation - why bother?

So...why would I buy the BMW scooter? There ARE going to be problems with it; it's so alien to what BMW knows how to do.
I have to disagree with much of what you have posted here. First, off, If I was interested in a cruiser, (I'm not), I would probably buy one of those "cheap imitations" which offer a lot more bike for the money...IMO. I'm not bashing those who buy Harley's, but that's my what I would do.

BMW's original expertise was air cooled boxer twin street motorcycles. They have stepped out of their original area many times.

BMW recently went head to head with the Japanese by building the S1000R sport bike. You could say that they copied the Japanese by making an inline four cylinder sport bike but it seems to have worked out very well for BMW and the bike has been a huge success.

How is a scooter so alien to what BMW knows how to do? Kymco makes the engine and transmission, it's not new to them. The rest of the scooter isn't that different from a motorcycle. Two wheels, similar tires, front and rear suspension, brakes. Only the frame is really different.

The only area where you may have a point is that this is a new model for BMW. I'd be concerned about buying a new model even if it was a motorcycle. BMW does have a history of reliability issues.
__________________
I ride, Therefore I Am.



klaviator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-06-2012, 02:32 PM   #97
hexnut
just cruising
 
hexnut's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2011
Location: middle Tennessee
Oddometer: 1,370
This was posted over on MV..

"Real" MSRP
We just got some new information on the Scooter pricing:

C600 Sport
Base Price: $9590
Highline package: $605 (Heated seats, heated grips, TPM)
We are assuming Dest charge will be the typical $495 (that seems to be the only variable here)
$10,690

C650 GT
Base: $9990
Highline package $605 (same options as above)
Again, assuming $495 Dest
$11,090

The only variable now is the Destination charge, which BMW puts into the MSRP. It has been $495, and I haven't seen anything showing it's been changed...
The nice thing about that is that the dealers shouldn't be adding any "set up", "handling", "freight", etc.... just your State fees (Tax, License) and a doc fee.

Wow! I think they did a great job keeping the price incredibly competitive- especially considering you get a 3 year/ 36,000 mile warranty and ABSwith that!
I'll take two!
~RobynS
__________________
2014 Harley Sportster 883 Superlow

hexnuts...a curse put on your balls by a mean gypsy
3/5 Cav, C Troop, BlackKnights, Vietnam 1969
hexnut is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-06-2012, 02:39 PM   #98
ScootTour
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Jul 2012
Oddometer: 1,491
There was a time when all cars were manuals. Then someone came up with this idea of an automatic transmission and people bought up cars like crazy...

extrapolate.

p.s. I had a mini cooper in the years that BMW makes everything for it, the service is outstanding and the price is actually fair when you inspect EXACTLY what you are getting.
ScootTour is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2012, 01:19 PM   #99
Dead Elvis
Adventurer
 
Joined: Aug 2012
Location: rhinebeck ny
Oddometer: 12
Just received pricing.
C600 base $9590 Premium $10195 heat seats, grips, and tire pressure monitor
C650GT base $9990 Premium $10595 heat seats, grips, and tire pressure monitor

I am leaning toward a red GT Premium, but it is a difficult choice....
Dead Elvis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2012, 01:45 PM   #100
elamofo OP
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: May 2011
Location: Outside of Boston, MA
Oddometer: 163
I wonder if the 530 TMAX will suddenly become available in the US now.
elamofo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2012, 06:58 PM   #101
acejones
Beastly Adventurer
 
acejones's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2005
Location: MS. Gulf Coast
Oddometer: 4,867
BMW's strategy is to offer premium image at a premium price.

I've had five of them. They are good products, in most instances. But when they break, and they will, you better be willing, and able, to dig deep.

You might ask if I feel this way, why have I had five. I am a slow learner.
__________________
I got tired of being here, so now I'm there
acejones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-07-2012, 10:37 PM   #102
Hardguy
Adventurer
 
Joined: Oct 2011
Oddometer: 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by elamofo View Post
I wonder if the 530 TMAX will suddenly become available in the US now.
I hope so, fingers and toes crossed for that...
Hardguy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-08-2012, 01:02 AM   #103
Cortez
BAZINGA!
 
Cortez's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2006
Location: Croatia
Oddometer: 6,780
Quote:
Originally Posted by acejones View Post
BMW's strategy is to offer premium image at a premium price.

I've had five of them. They are good products, in most instances. But when they break, and they will, you better be willing, and able, to dig deep.

You might ask if I feel this way, why have I had five. I am a slow learner.
__________________
'08 Yamaha FZ6n S2 ABS

SOLD: '03 Peugeot Speedfight2, '07 Kawasaki ER6F ABS, '06 Kymco Agility 125, '12 Kymco Downtown 300i ABS
My Flickr gallery --- My 500px gallery
Cortez is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-08-2012, 01:14 AM   #104
ohgood
Beastly Adventurer
 
ohgood's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2010
Location: alabama
Oddometer: 2,312
Quote:
Originally Posted by acejones View Post
BMW's strategy is to offer premium image at a premium price.

I've had five of them. They are good products, in most instances. But when they break, and they will, you better be willing, and able, to dig deep.

You might ask if I feel this way, why have I had five. I am a slow learner.
its not digging deep, its digging


PREMIUM
__________________
Donkeys are flying
ohgood is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-08-2012, 01:19 AM   #105
ohgood
Beastly Adventurer
 
ohgood's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2010
Location: alabama
Oddometer: 2,312
I looked around a little, and wondered where the premium is for BMW scooters. handling? nah, its a scooter, they ALL HANDLE and are fun. its by design more FUN than motorcycles and cars.

twist, zoom, grinnnnnn

is it better quality materials? hmm, I can change my grips anytime to DS 714s and feel even better. no biggie.

drive train? nope, that's kymco, and kymco has a handle on scooters.

tires? I can swap those

where's this premium? someone please tell me (since I haven't ridden one) where the premium is on the beemer vs the others.
__________________
Donkeys are flying
ohgood is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 03:46 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014