Back wheel movement ???????

Moto Bikemad · 06-25-2012, 06:29 AM

Sorry if this question has been asked....(have looked but don't know what I am looking for)

I was in Dublin City Centre on Sat night, with a charity cycle run Belfast to Dublin and back. (210 miles each way)
Got a puncture, on my 2000 1150 GS and while I was repairing it I noticed a slight movement in my back wheel.

If you grip the tyre, there is a little movement right to left from the rear.

Was discussing this with some of my fellow bike marshall's and there was talk of some adjustment, and a video, something
to do with a long stick and a bag of sugar.

This could have been the beer talking.......

Any help would be great.....

tagesk · 06-25-2012, 06:36 AM

There should be no movement in the FD.
Not in 3-9 and not 12-6.
Zero.

Movement is the first and surest sign of a worn main bearing.
It will leave you stranded if you don't attend to it.

[TaSK]

ultane · 06-25-2012, 06:43 AM

What he ^^^^ said...

I might be wrong... Just ask my X...

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

MIXR · 06-25-2012, 03:18 PM

A bit of movement can also just be a sign that your paralever bearings are on their way out. Mine had movement for 50,000 kms before they were replaced. It drove my service guy nuts because I kept saying 'No' as they weren't bad enough by my reckoning. Really depends on whether it's 12/6 or 9/3 movement and whether you are sure it's the wheel or the whole paralever. Also check the wheel's rotation with a slow rotation. If the big bearing in the drive is going, you MAY feel it or hear it, but it's a test that may not show the problem. If you can, pull the rear wheel and look for any oil staining around the rear drive seal. That's also a sign that the bearing may be moving. And last (or first), drop the rear drive oil out and see what's on the magnetic plug. You may find nothing. You may find metal. A bit of sludge on the mag plug can be normal if you don't do the diff oil often. Bottom plug to drain, top plug to fill, and 250 ml of any good GL5 gear oil. Re-use the old crush washers. Look for a silver sheen to the oil that comes out. It may also be cloudy or dirty if it's been there a while. Start changing it every 10,000 kms with your engine oil.

JimVonBaden · 06-25-2012, 03:32 PM

Kind of as above.

First verify if it is your FD or your paralever bearings that are the issue.

Hold the brake pedal down and try again. If your movement persists, it is your paralever. If no movement it is your FD!

Jim

Moto Bikemad · 06-27-2012, 08:32 AM

Hi,

Just changed the drive oil, nothing out of the ordinary,
Looked at the hub no leaks.
Nothing on the magnet, just a little dust, in oil.

I do change the oil every 6000m with the other fluids.

The movement is 3/9, with a little noise, click.

No grinding or growling when wheel is spun.

Still there when back brake is pressed........

HighWay319 · 06-27-2012, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moto Bikemad

Still there when back brake is pressed........

That's good news. Sounds like its just the paralever, much cheaper part to fix.

JimVonBaden · 06-27-2012, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moto Bikemad

Hi,

Just changed the drive oil, nothing out of the ordinary,
Looked at the hub no leaks.
Nothing on the magnet, just a little dust, in oil.

I do change the oil every 6000m with the other fluids.

The movement is 3/9, with a little noise, click.

No grinding or growling when wheel is spun.

Still there when back brake is pressed........

No wories, pivot bearing wear. Simple fix.

Jim

Short-Johnson · 06-27-2012, 07:53 PM

could you guys explain the 12-6 movement a bit more as to how much should be allowed and what would be the cause of lets say 1 inch of free play 12 to 6 ?

solarinsocal · 06-27-2012, 08:18 PM

I think about 1" of free play will mean your wheel is about to fall off. I think you might be misunderstanding the play at 12 and 6.

Short-Johnson · 06-27-2012, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by solarinsocal

I think about 1" of free play will mean your wheel is about to fall off. I think you might be misunderstanding the play at 12 and 6.

very possible I am mis understanding, the 12 to 6 I thought would be as if the bike was rolling back and forth. I grab my wheel and roll it and it has an inch of play. but as i write this I'm thinking I understand the whole 3-9 12-6. Grab the wheel at 3-9 try to move it then at 12 top and 6 bottom and repeat ? sound right ?

SloDon · 06-27-2012, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kenpo

could you guys explain the 12-6 movement a bit more as to how much should be allowed and what would be the cause of lets say 1 inch of free play 12 to 6 ?

I am sure I will be corrected if I am wrong.....but they are NOT talking about driveline slack/lash while trying to rotate the wheel in gear. There will be some of this always....

I believe they are talking about grasping the wheel at the 3 and 9 o'clock or front and rear POSITIONS and trying to ROCK the wheel on its axle then again at 12 and 6 or top and bottom.

Seeing if there is any free play.

Short-Johnson · 06-27-2012, 08:36 PM

Thanks slowdon, took me a bit but I got it..... Nuttin gets by me !!!

Moto Bikemad · 06-28-2012, 01:46 AM

I was looking at the back wheel from the exhaust side.
Grabbing it at the top 12 and the bottom 6 and trying to move it.
Doing the same at 3 o'clock and 9

Just a big guess on my side

MIXR · 06-28-2012, 02:07 AM

You've got it now guys. No rotation of the wheel involved. Just a static check on the centrestand with the rear wheel off the ground. It can be deceptive, but testing it each service and jotting down what you find is a good thing to do. As I said earlier, worn paralever bearings can be lived with for a long time if you want. They tend to 'squeak' when they get too bad and too dry, and the movement can become excessive. There a question that this can exacerbate other loads on the drive bearings, but I'm not convinced of that having had a lot of play on one bike and no drive failure, and no play on another bike and a drive failure after relatively few miles.

06-25-2012, 06:29 AM	#1
Moto Bikemad ^OP Ride, see, fall off! Joined: Jul 2011 Location: Northern Ireland Oddometer: 63	Back wheel movement ??????? Sorry if this question has been asked....(have looked but don't know what I am looking for) I was in Dublin City Centre on Sat night, with a charity cycle run Belfast to Dublin and back. (210 miles each way) Got a puncture, on my 2000 1150 GS and while I was repairing it I noticed a slight movement in my back wheel. If you grip the tyre, there is a little movement right to left from the rear. Was discussing this with some of my fellow bike marshall's and there was talk of some adjustment, and a video, something to do with a long stick and a bag of sugar. This could have been the beer talking....... Any help would be great.....

06-25-2012, 06:36 AM	#2
tagesk Tuscan rider Joined: Jun 2007 Location: Tuscany, Italy Oddometer: 3,135	There should be no movement in the FD. Not in 3-9 and not 12-6. Zero. Movement is the first and surest sign of a worn main bearing. It will leave you stranded if you don't attend to it. [TaSK] __________________ '02 R1150GS - Adds life My Riding in Tuscany-thread is here. Renting out motorbikes in Toscana, Italy Proud contributor to Wisdom and GSpot FAQ and European Ride Report Index. IBA: 33616

06-25-2012, 06:43 AM	#3
ultane sqeezin the bag Joined: Feb 2008 Location: the dry side of the blood brain barrier in SW Id Oddometer: 858	What he ^^^^ said... I might be wrong... Just ask my X... Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk __________________ I might be wrong, just ask my X... If a man speaks, and there is no woman present to hear him,.. Is he still wrong?

06-25-2012, 03:18 PM	#4
MIXR Studly Adventurer Joined: Feb 2011 Location: Canberra, Australia, AKA 'Polly-World' Oddometer: 501	Before you panic A bit of movement can also just be a sign that your paralever bearings are on their way out. Mine had movement for 50,000 kms before they were replaced. It drove my service guy nuts because I kept saying 'No' as they weren't bad enough by my reckoning. Really depends on whether it's 12/6 or 9/3 movement and whether you are sure it's the wheel or the whole paralever. Also check the wheel's rotation with a slow rotation. If the big bearing in the drive is going, you MAY feel it or hear it, but it's a test that may not show the problem. If you can, pull the rear wheel and look for any oil staining around the rear drive seal. That's also a sign that the bearing may be moving. And last (or first), drop the rear drive oil out and see what's on the magnetic plug. You may find nothing. You may find metal. A bit of sludge on the mag plug can be normal if you don't do the diff oil often. Bottom plug to drain, top plug to fill, and 250 ml of any good GL5 gear oil. Re-use the old crush washers. Look for a silver sheen to the oil that comes out. It may also be cloudy or dirty if it's been there a while. Start changing it every 10,000 kms with your engine oil.

06-25-2012, 03:32 PM	#5
JimVonBaden "Cool" Aid! Joined: Feb 2005 Location: Alexandria, VA Oddometer: 41,491	Kind of as above. First verify if it is your FD or your paralever bearings that are the issue. Hold the brake pedal down and try again. If your movement persists, it is your paralever. If no movement it is your FD! Jim __________________ Click here for BMW Maintenance and Repair DVDs and Corrections. "Combo-Order Discounts!"

06-27-2012, 08:32 AM	#6
Moto Bikemad ^OP Ride, see, fall off! Joined: Jul 2011 Location: Northern Ireland Oddometer: 63	Hi, Just changed the drive oil, nothing out of the ordinary, Looked at the hub no leaks. Nothing on the magnet, just a little dust, in oil. I do change the oil every 6000m with the other fluids. The movement is 3/9, with a little noise, click. No grinding or growling when wheel is spun. Still there when back brake is pressed........

06-27-2012, 07:53 PM	#9
Short-Johnson IBA# 34787 Joined: Jul 2008 Location: In a Drinkin Town with a Fishin problem ! Oddometer: 121	12-6 movement could you guys explain the 12-6 movement a bit more as to how much should be allowed and what would be the cause of lets say 1 inch of free play 12 to 6 ? __________________ 08 GSA 07 TW200 05 Wide Glide "Bad ass" 99 GZ 250 2011 WR450F

06-27-2012, 08:18 PM	#10
solarinsocal Adventurer Joined: May 2012 Location: Torrance Oddometer: 27	I think about 1" of free play will mean your wheel is about to fall off. I think you might be misunderstanding the play at 12 and 6.

06-27-2012, 08:36 PM	#13
Short-Johnson IBA# 34787 Joined: Jul 2008 Location: In a Drinkin Town with a Fishin problem ! Oddometer: 121	Thanks slowdon, took me a bit but I got it..... Nuttin gets by me !!! __________________ 08 GSA 07 TW200 05 Wide Glide "Bad ass" 99 GZ 250 2011 WR450F

06-28-2012, 01:46 AM	#14
Moto Bikemad ^OP Ride, see, fall off! Joined: Jul 2011 Location: Northern Ireland Oddometer: 63	I was looking at the back wheel from the exhaust side. Grabbing it at the top 12 and the bottom 6 and trying to move it. Doing the same at 3 o'clock and 9 Just a big guess on my side

06-28-2012, 02:07 AM	#15
MIXR Studly Adventurer Joined: Feb 2011 Location: Canberra, Australia, AKA 'Polly-World' Oddometer: 501	Yep - That's it. You've got it now guys. No rotation of the wheel involved. Just a static check on the centrestand with the rear wheel off the ground. It can be deceptive, but testing it each service and jotting down what you find is a good thing to do. As I said earlier, worn paralever bearings can be lived with for a long time if you want. They tend to 'squeak' when they get too bad and too dry, and the movement can become excessive. There a question that this can exacerbate other loads on the drive bearings, but I'm not convinced of that having had a lot of play on one bike and no drive failure, and no play on another bike and a drive failure after relatively few miles.

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