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Old 05-23-2005, 10:19 PM   #121
Jinx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MountainMan
homebuilt. 554 cc V8
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Old 05-23-2005, 10:28 PM   #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jinx
well, poking around the URL's found this...






so I did some more and found this ...
http://dot.etec.wwu.edu/fsae/viking30.htm
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Old 05-23-2005, 10:36 PM   #123
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I know that I have a soft spot.

The gas turbine is not much to look at from the outside, but inside it's magic.




Ohhh and the power, to drive a transmission that is, not a fan.

This engine powers this boat, at a graceful 2650 hp.


Weirdo screwed with this post 05-23-2005 at 10:46 PM
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Old 05-23-2005, 10:44 PM   #124
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Old 05-23-2005, 10:57 PM   #125
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Next Generation Rolls Royce Trent 1000

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Old 05-23-2005, 11:01 PM   #126
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Mazda R26B 4-rotor "Le Mans"





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Old 05-23-2005, 11:01 PM   #127
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jinx
Next Generation Rolls Royce Trent 1000

Where's the pistons?
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Old 05-23-2005, 11:09 PM   #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by komet
Where's the pistons?
In the case of your BMW, precisely where your shins ought to go.
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Old 05-23-2005, 11:12 PM   #129
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MountainMan
homebuilt. 554 cc V8
yep... i checked out that pm you sent this morning. formual sae is cool stuff. young engineers do things experience tells older ones not to... they come up with some cool stuff
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Old 05-23-2005, 11:14 PM   #130
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nice pix jinx... was waiting for your input. more?
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Old 05-23-2005, 11:21 PM   #131
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Loadedagain
yep... i checked out that pm you sent this morning. formual sae is cool stuff. young engineers do things experience tells older ones not to... they come up with some cool stuff


Old Man (Soichiro) Honda always staffed his racing department with his youngest engineers. He thought that they were more creative in their thinking, and the cost of screwing up a race engine is pennies to the dollar of screwing one up in production.

When he retired, the reason he gave Honda's board of directors was that he could no longer drink or fuck very well. And he felt that a man who couldn't drink or fuck very well should not be in charge.

What is really amazing is how open Honda was in the 1960's about their technology. They published a series of SAE papers on engine design that still make my head hurt, and I have been reading them for 20 years.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loadedagain
nice pix jinx... was waiting for your input. more?

Who do you think gave it five stars, mate? Great thread. I am going nuts trying to find a picture of a 1913 Peugeot L3 GP engine. DOHC and 4-valves/cylinder........92 freaking years ago!
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Old 05-24-2005, 12:06 AM   #132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by configurationspace
I've heard noise about engines with fancy valve-trains.

I think some European car manufacturer has a car with an on-the-fly adjustable stroke. The cylinder geometry changes depending on what kind of load the engine is under.

Also there's a bunch of new big diesel engines coming out that have taken the "clockwork" out of engines -- computer-controlled, magnetically driven valvetrains. So the valve timing can change on the fly, depending on engine load.

Anyone know of these?
Lot's of "schemes" are always floating about, but they rarely live up to the promise.

Variable stroke? Sounds nice, but what happens to the compression ratio if your engine "shortens" it's stroke? I don't even want to think about a moveable crankshaft to compensate. Beware of complexity for complexity's sake. BRM once drew up a flat 16 GP engine where the design parameters were 500 BHP and 300 Lbs. They wound up with 300 BHP and 500 Lbs.

Magnetic valve systems have been around for a while, and they are OK on very low speed engines. But you ain't going to rev one to 14K.

So how about 19K and pneumatic valve springs like the GP guys run? The problem is they are designed to leak (You just replace the small amount that is always leaking with a pump or a tank), but what happens on the street if you don't ride for a week? No valve springs, and a bicycle pump is not getting them back. If you truly "seal" them the friction is way too high.

Stuff that works? BMW cars have a decent variable cam timing system that spreads the power a bit. Honda has their V-Tec system which deactivates an inlet valve until a certain RPM is reached to keep inlet flow velocities up. If you look at the Mazda pics I posted you will see the intake lengths are variable. One pic shows them extended for low RPM, the other shows them retracted for high RPM. Power valves in the exhaust system also seem to flatten the power curve and fill in some holes in the torque curves.....but they are not light, unless they are Ti or Composite, and in that case...$$$$$.

Stuff that could work? I am surprised more work is not being done with double sleeve valve designs (see the Napier Sabre pics earlier in this thread). These flow like a demon, have very fast "port" openings, and have nearly perfect combustion chambers with no hot spots. The downfall has always been sealing, but I would think some of the new ceramics could go a long way there.

But as long as we are dealing with four strokes, inlet velocities dominate how your power curve looks. Specifically, they detrmine where the torque peak will be in the RPM range. All the rest of the tuning (cams, inlet and exhaust length, etc) realy does is rotate the powerband around the maximum torque RPM. Like a see saw, you can tilt it towards top-end, or you can tilt it towards bottom end grunt. But the torque peak is pretty much fixed by port design. And port cross sections (which determine inlet velocities) are very difficult to make "variable". It would be intersting to combine BMW's variable cam timing with Honda's V-Tec working together on independant (one port per valve), as opposed to the siamesed (one port feeding both inlet valves) ports thast almost everyone uses.

Or we can just get engines with really good inlet and exhaust ports, which are currently much better than they used to be but not nearly as good as they should be. Especially motorcycle exhaust ports, which are still not very impressive. Then improve the machining process to get "real" squish bands, and marry that to the best engine management system we can afford. That would seem to be what Keth Duckworth (of Cosworth) would do, and he's a bloody genius. Cheers.
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Old 05-24-2005, 12:09 AM   #133
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Jinx, I got a question for you....metal fatigue, can it be caused by age alone without any stress/pressure/outside factors?
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Old 05-24-2005, 12:18 AM   #134
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Quote:
Originally Posted by komet
Jinx, I got a question for you....metal fatigue, can it be caused by age alone without any stress/pressure/outside factors?
No, fatigue by definition requires a cyclic load. Corrosion is a whole 'nuther story. What to watch is whether there is a defined fatigue life. i.e. Steel, if stresses are below a critical point, has an infinite fatigue life. At least for tension, torsion, and compression. Big dynamo shafts can run forever as long as they receive adequate lubrication. With stuff like threads you get effects like "fretting", which changes the picture a bit. Most aluminum alloys have no load point at which their fatigue life is infinite. Apply any load for X^X cycles and it will fail. And some of them never stop annealing. But I am not a metalurgist, and would love to hear from others with more experience.
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Old 05-24-2005, 12:43 AM   #135
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A tear down on one of the local utility turbine generators. I snapped this last month.

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