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Old 08-29-2012, 07:54 AM   #16
Konflict Motorsports
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Quote:
Originally Posted by syzygy9 View Post
I am struggling to see how an increase form the stock 0.48 to 0.70 is required. I had my own (2011 990 Adv) forks resprung to 0.56 with a revalve to suit - that's an ~17% increase in spring rate and it seems fine for my 85kg 'naked' + gear + load.

On a recent trip across Australia with lots of fast and slow dirt roads (and some really gnarly sections) I am not aware of ever bottoming the forks but did use all of the suspension travel. Front and rear were set to 'max payload'; with no load this setting feels quite stiff.

I am no suspension guru so happy to defer to the experts, but my understanding was that if you are using all of your travel and not bottoming, you're pretty close to the mark. Of course, if all you are doing is riding on smooth roads than compliance may not be your primary concern, rather things like fork dive under braking, and you can get away with much stiffer and less compliant forks.

Bottoming control is not done via the springs, it is done by the air gap (air spring). This is why setting the oil level correctly on these forks is much more sensitive than smaller size dirtbikes.
.48kg springs are very light, thats what we install in a 4 stroke ktm for riders who weigh in the range of 195 to 210 lbs, and this is on a ike that weighs around 230lbs less not including rider weight etc.
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Old 08-29-2012, 08:26 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Konflict Motorsports View Post
Bottoming control is not done via the springs, it is done by the air gap (air spring). This is why setting the oil level correctly on these forks is much more sensitive than smaller size dirtbikes.
.48kg springs are very light, thats what we install in a 4 stroke ktm for riders who weigh in the range of 195 to 210 lbs, and this is on a ike that weighs around 230lbs less not including rider weight etc.

Springs keep the ride height in the position that the valve likes. There should be a spring chart but I have not seen one for the Adventure. You suspension tuners are like doctors and lawyers. Only tell them what they need to know. That's fine with me but it would be neat to see the recommended spring chart.
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Old 08-29-2012, 08:34 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stumpalump View Post
Springs keep the ride height in the position that the valve likes. There should be a spring chart but I have not seen one for the Adventure. You suspension tuners are like doctors and lawyers. Only tell them what they need to know. That's fine with me but it would be neat to see the recommended spring chart.
I wish there was a spring chart availible, its between my ears after years of R&D. We cant share everything as it is very easy for another company, someone to copy our valving mods, machine work, etc. Its how we make our living, the Raiders dont make their playbook public...
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Old 08-29-2012, 09:37 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noto View Post
Well.. there's no way I'm ever going to be under 200 pounds (hell, i might go back to 280 if i leave the exercise/diet thing) and i do end up on the slab a lot (i still wouldn't call romanian roads smooth). Might as well accept it and prepare for it. Either way, slab or offroad, it's still underspung.

Now, I *might* have a way to send the forks to SPS without paying an obscene amount for shipping but it's not something definite so ... might as well learn as much as possible.


Thank you, Alex
I'm in Venezuela, and i will get my suspension to superplush, but what i'm goin to do with the forks is open them up (not really hard), take the oil and the spring out and closed them, without the spring and the oil they weight less and you can packed them colllapse so they won't be as tall.
Shipping back to you is another thing.
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Old 08-29-2012, 11:06 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GZERO View Post
I'm in Venezuela, and i will get my suspension to superplush, but what i'm goin to do with the forks is open them up (not really hard), take the oil and the spring out and closed them, without the spring and the oil they weight less and you can packed them colllapse so they won't be as tall.
Shipping back to you is another thing.

Shipping them back to me would be pretty much the same cost as the actual job. I just don't have that kind of funds available.

If the "alternate" shipping method fails, I'll get the biggest pair of springs that don't required modifications, and run with that. It won't be the best option but it would be an improvement to the present setup.

Thing is ... since i can't find anything remotely resembling a suspension tuner locally (most "tuning" involves switching to progressive springs and using thicker fork oil), i can't do the test/modify/test again procedure so i would prefer to get the forks to someone with a lot of experience, kind of a one-shot deal. We'll see if that works out.

Thank you, Alex
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Old 08-29-2012, 11:39 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noto View Post
Shipping them back to me would be pretty much the same cost as the actual job. I just don't have that kind of funds available.

If the "alternate" shipping method fails, I'll get the biggest pair of springs that don't required modifications, and run with that. It won't be the best option but it would be an improvement to the present setup.

Thing is ... since i can't find anything remotely resembling a suspension tuner locally (most "tuning" involves switching to progressive springs and using thicker fork oil), i can't do the test/modify/test again procedure so i would prefer to get the forks to someone with a lot of experience, kind of a one-shot deal. We'll see if that works out.

Thank you, Alex

If you are capable of tearing down the forks, why dont we just send you a kit to revalve the springs with fluid, seals, bushings, and valving stacks?
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Old 08-29-2012, 11:44 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Konflict Motorsports View Post
If you are capable of tearing down the forks, why dont we just send you a kit to revalve the springs with fluid, seals, bushings, and valving stacks?
That can be done ?!?! AWESOME !!!

Let's do the PM dance
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Old 08-29-2012, 11:53 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noto View Post
Shipping them back to me would be pretty much the same cost as the actual job. I just don't have that kind of funds available.

If the "alternate" shipping method fails, I'll get the biggest pair of springs that don't required modifications, and run with that. It won't be the best option but it would be an improvement to the present setup.

Thing is ... since i can't find anything remotely resembling a suspension tuner locally (most "tuning" involves switching to progressive springs and using thicker fork oil), i can't do the test/modify/test again procedure so i would prefer to get the forks to someone with a lot of experience, kind of a one-shot deal. We'll see if that works out.

Thank you, Alex
Hi Alex,

A lot of this thread is way above my knowledge of how forks REALLY work, however I've been in the same boat as you, so researched this a fair amount.

By all accounts 0.64 springs are as strong as you can go without re-valving the forks. You'll end up with preload about halfway in, and rebound on the max.

0.64 is what I've decided on. I'm 240lbs with kit on the bike, hoping to be less, but that's what it is right now. I ride aggressively, and I always though heavy on the forks, however borrowing other bikes and talking to some suspension tuners it turns out that I'm not actually heavy on the front, I just like to feel what the front wheel is doing, and don't mind a bit of front wheel slip.

Not that this really helps you, but the fact of not needing a revalve tipped the balance for me. As an above post said, air pressure is also a factor; oil level, etc..

I've put an order in for the 0.64's with KTMTwins in the states - as of two days ago they only have 3 remaining sets of 0.64s in stock. They'll order more obviously, but it'll take a month or so.

If you like I am in Miami from 18th Sept to 6th Oct, so can bring some back for you and send them on (ordered mine delivered to Miami). PM me if you like.
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Old 08-29-2012, 03:29 PM   #24
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Being in europe you should also check out Hyperpro, Ive used them on sportbikes before and they know their stuff...seems looking at their site they have a distributor in Bucuresti and also in Hungary and Bulgaria. Drop them a mail, ive always found them helpful.

http://www.hyperpro.com

The infamous Colebatch also used them for the X-Challenge RTW bike...shhhh I know its not orange!

http://advrider.com/forums/showpost....6&postcount=20
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Old 08-30-2012, 12:50 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sacal View Post
Being in europe you should also check out Hyperpro, Ive used them on sportbikes before and they know their stuff...seems looking at their site they have a distributor in Bucuresti and also in Hungary and Bulgaria. Drop them a mail, ive always found them helpful.

http://www.hyperpro.com

The infamous Colebatch also used them for the X-Challenge RTW bike...shhhh I know its not orange!

http://advrider.com/forums/showpost....6&postcount=20
Salutare Sacal :)

I know i can get the parts, it's the know-how to make it work as well as possible that's lacking :).

Multumesc, Alex
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Old 08-30-2012, 10:28 PM   #26
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The cheap wya

I would suggest you to buy stronger springs first and see what you can do with the clickers. If not good enough, then experiment with thicker oil. Springs and oil are easy to DIY.
It might not be perfectionist good, but it will be probably much better than stock and maybe it might be all you want. If not happy, all you will have lost is some time and the price of oil, since springs you have to upgrade anyway.

I had issues with the SE fork valving, which was stupid hard. I did not have the funds to go to a 'tuner' so I asked a local suspension guy to install the 990-R valving and while not perfect, it surely does the job much better (almost perfect) at a small fraction of the cost, since he did not sell tuning expertise, only labor. Maybe thinner oil would have worked just as well, who knows.

I have also ridden an 09 990R with .60 springs and SE valving (essentially SE stock fork setting). I am about 200-220 depending on gear and what was crazy stiff on the SE worked really well on the mighty ninety.

mousitsas screwed with this post 08-30-2012 at 11:16 PM
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Old 08-31-2012, 01:48 AM   #27
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Oh well

Quote:
Originally Posted by mousitsas View Post
I would suggest you to buy stronger springs first and see what you can do with the clickers. If not good enough, then experiment with thicker oil. Springs and oil are easy to DIY.
It might not be perfectionist good, but it will be probably much better than stock and maybe it might be all you want. If not happy, all you will have lost is some time and the price of oil, since springs you have to upgrade anyway.

I had issues with the SE fork valving, which was stupid hard. I did not have the funds to go to a 'tuner' so I asked a local suspension guy to install the 990-R valving and while not perfect, it surely does the job much better (almost perfect) at a small fraction of the cost, since he did not sell tuning expertise, only labor. Maybe thinner oil would have worked just as well, who knows.

I have also ridden an 09 990R with .60 springs and SE valving (essentially SE stock fork setting). I am about 200-220 depending on gear and what was crazy stiff on the SE worked really well on the mighty ninety.

Well, the "alternate" shipping method fell through so i'm back to square 1. No SPS. I'll just get the biggest springs that can be fitted without modifications for the time being and i'll get some .70 at a later time...whilst i try to learn as much as possible about suspensions... Who knows, maybe i'll find a suspension tuner hidden away in the neighboring countries.

Thanks everybody! Alex
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Old 08-31-2012, 08:44 AM   #28
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I don't consider myself a tuner but I have revalved and serviced many WP 48mm forks.

If Konflict Motorsports or somebody else is willing to share a good shim stack with you (you could at least buy the springs and other parts there), I can put them together for you. I am not exactly around the corner but I can ship a set of forks to Romania for 20 so I assume it's the same the other way around, and we are both in the EU so there are no hassles with import taxes or paperwork.
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Old 08-31-2012, 08:48 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noto View Post
Well, the "alternate" shipping method fell through so i'm back to square 1. No SPS. I'll just get the biggest springs that can be fitted without modifications for the time being and i'll get some .70 at a later time...whilst i try to learn as much as possible about suspensions... Who knows, maybe i'll find a suspension tuner hidden away in the neighboring countries.

Thanks everybody! Alex
Just keep in mind that with the 990R valving on stock springs (.60) on my SE, I have both compression and rebound clickers close to max (min preload), so I would assume that this is close to the stiffest spring you can use with stock oil and valving.
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Old 01-13-2013, 03:52 PM   #30
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990R Spring Rate

So what is the recommended spring rate for a 990 Adventure R with stock valving? I just want to eliminate some of the dive. I've checked Race Tech's website for recommended spring rates, and it list 0.72. Is this correct?

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