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Old 09-03-2012, 11:56 AM   #1
rburkat OP
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dirty oil and dirty coolant after water pump change

I had some oil in my coolant and some milky stuff in my oil the other week so I changed the water pump with a CJdesigns kit. I have a scotts filter so did not have oil pressure issues.

I went for a 100 mile ride and noticed that my engine ice was becoming dirty. I thought maybe I did not clean the engine enough so I flushed the pump again, and even ran vinegar and water through it for 30 minutes while running the engine and adding water mix till the water coming out of the pump upper drain was crystal clear.
I changed the oil again and put new engine ice in.


Went for another ride and after 40 miles of hard offroad I see the following.

Engine ice sample compared to original after 40 miles...


Some oil from the reservoir after 40 miles...


Oil is pretty dark compared to what I put in.

Is this a head gasket? Maybe it was not the water pump in the first place? What's my next move?
I want to fix this asap so I can ride to the ktm rally next week.

Thanks

rburkat screwed with this post 09-03-2012 at 12:47 PM
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Old 09-03-2012, 03:23 PM   #2
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You replaced all of the gaskets?
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Old 09-03-2012, 04:05 PM   #3
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You replaced all of the gaskets?
I replaced the 2 gaskets that came with the CJdesigns kit. Cleaned surfaces and put in the large clutch cover one and a new rubber water pump one.
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Old 09-03-2012, 04:19 PM   #4
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Mine turned grey because the rear clip poped off, but it took longer than that. Side effects I saw were coolant increases, then it changed to coolant decreases. Then spooge. Changed it out because it killed the seal too. The impeller was garbage after that and a few flushes showed chunks of plastic.
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Old 09-04-2012, 11:47 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by rburkat View Post
Is this a head gasket? Maybe it was not the water pump in the first place? What's my next move?
I want to fix this asap so I can ride to the ktm rally next week.

Thanks
Head gasket would leak exaust gas in the radiator. Have you seen bubbles in the coolant?
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Old 09-04-2012, 07:53 PM   #6
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Possibly similar to what happened to me. I did the whole water pump fix and still had some white stuff in my window. I also flushed my coolant system very well. I ended up flushing my oil 5 times to make sure I had no more coolant in my oil. There will be some residual coolant in your system for a while. I even flushed my oil tank. I have had no issues however. Coolant has not moved in my expansion tank since my pump fix. I'd just run it and keep an eye on your coolant tank for a while.
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Old 09-05-2012, 10:16 AM   #7
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I got one of these CO2 testers in coolant and the results.....

Test liquid before....



Test liquid 20 seconds into the test...



Green/yellow means combustion gases are getting into the coolant :(

Which cylinder head gasket goes first or should I be doing both? Is this a easy job or should I take it to the shop?
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Old 09-05-2012, 10:47 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by rburkat View Post
Which cylinder head gasket goes first or should I be doing both? Is this a easy job or should I take it to the shop?
I Don't know how to find out which gasket is leaking, perhaps start the engine without 1 sparkplug and repeat the test? it should run on 1 cyl.

To change the gaskets you need to remove the engine from the bike, nothing extremely complicated, i did it by myself, but of course you know your limits and the tools you have.

Changing only the bad gasket should be enough, if it's just a "random" failure also the brand new gasket could fail, so no reasom to change a good one (assuming you can find which one is leaking.) YMMV
How many km on the bike?
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Old 09-05-2012, 11:20 AM   #9
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Radek,

Look at the spark plugs, they will often tell you if there is anything bad going into the cylinder. Additionally there is usually a pressure buildup in the cooling system if it is the head gasket. And even the residual stuff from the old bad seal can show. If you are not loosing or using coolant or oil I would not be as quick to tear it down.
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Old 09-05-2012, 04:22 PM   #10
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So just did a leak down test.

Rear cylinder is perfect

Front is leaking bad. Odd thing is the air is coming back up the intake valves.
They are in spec and at tdc do that's weird.
Taking front cylinder off to investigate
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Old 09-06-2012, 11:45 AM   #11
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So front cylinder removed.











The clean spot on the piston I think is where it was being cleaned by coolant coming in.

Lots of crud everywhere but I'm not sure if this is normal or not. Does anyone have some pics of what their cylinder/valves look like after say 20K miles?

Thanks
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Old 09-06-2012, 12:58 PM   #12
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Looks like you found the problem. Are you going to pull the rear as well? It would be tempting not to.
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Old 09-08-2012, 09:06 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by rburkat View Post
Lots of crud everywhere but I'm not sure if this is normal or not. Does anyone have some pics of what their cylinder/valves look like after say 20K miles?

Thanks
I think your engine is not too dirty, here my intake valves and head/piston after 67K Km






Btw, you can remove the front engine mount, it should be easier to work on the front cylinder.
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Old 09-08-2012, 09:24 AM   #14
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Hope you get it together quickly, looking forward to seeing you next week.
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Old 09-08-2012, 09:58 AM   #15
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I think your engine is not too dirty, here my intake valves and head/piston after 67K Km
Btw, you can remove the front engine mount, it should be easier to work on the front cylinder.
Thanks for the pics...it's my first time looking at this so nice to hear it's not out of the ordinary.

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Hope you get it together quickly, looking forward to seeing you next week.
I should be good to go. It's being cleaned and put together right now. Unless I find something else wrong I should take it for a test ride tonight/tomorrow and then I'll be ready to roll Monday.

Also wanted to give a shout out to Ron at KTMTwins for overnighting me a the head gasket kit. I had ordered one from my shop early in the week and it was supposed to take only 3 days but Thursday the shop tells me that it would not be in till next thursday...arghh. So I called ktmtwins in the afternoon, Ron physically confirmed that he had the kit, and overnighted it to me. I picked it up yesterday and am using it now. Thank you for that great service.
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