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Old 09-11-2012, 04:35 PM   #31
hilslamer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foot dragger View Post
Yah,its not KTM's design flaw,they didnt build that plate. That's amazing to bolt a skidplate to a oil reservoir. Having a dirt going bike with an oil reservoir under the engine is a excersize in hope.
I think someone else said that the oil tank could take an IED hit, and this is why KTM built it this way. It's a structural holding tank as well as a means of cooling; it serves three purposes with the same component. Fuel and oil tanks on aircraft, trophy trucks and F1 cars are the same way. Done right, it's structure first, tank second and in the airflow/painted black, cooler third...and KTM has achieved this.

There is no place else practical to put the oil tank, that is in the airflow(dry sump cooling) and is practical to make a simple tank to do. If you can find another place to put that much oil at crankcase level on the bike that is any less vulnerable, send a letter to KTM, and see if they hire you on as their latest head engineer. It's there for a reason and quite honestly, if you break the tank or land on the skidplate so hard that it breaks the oil tank, you've likely got a lot bigger issues to worry about by then(and afterward).
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Old 09-11-2012, 05:15 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foot dragger View Post
Yah,its not KTM's design flaw,they didnt build that plate. That's amazing to bolt a skidplate to a oil reservoir. Having a dirt going bike with an oil reservoir under the engine is a excersize in hope.

Before you get all excited. I think what people are trying to say is, It's not a good design to have a floating mount in the rear and have the plate solidly mounted to the oil tank. And then leave the motor mounting completely out of the equation which KTM used on the stock plate.

Now if one wants to modify a BD one as some have done, well that's fine, fabricate away. But there are alternatives out there. Geez.
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Old 09-11-2012, 06:00 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by LoFlow View Post
... It's not a good design to have a floating mount in the rear and have the plate solidly mounted to the oil tank. And then leave the motor mounting completely out of the equation which KTM used on the stock plate.....
bingo.
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Old 09-11-2012, 06:21 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by hilslamer View Post
It's not a design flaw at all, it's just not designed to be outright abused. I don't know what you hit, but with both ends fully bottomed and the tires flattened out even the BD skid plate still has ~1.5" clearance on flat ground. You probably bottomed both ends with rocks or other undulations between the wheels. The "shock block" probably prevented what would have been much more damage by buffering any further hinging of the plate about the rear mount bolt axis into the radiator/forward mounts.

While the mount points are questionable for that kind of load, you are going to find a lot of other "design flaws" if you keep putting the bike through circumstances like that and not noticing the noise or the carnage beneath you. I don't mean to sound callous, but IMO you are expecting a bit much from both the bike and the skid plate, stock or not, to be landing on whatever you did that hard(and most likely, multiple times).

Look into much stiffer springs(especially forksprings - go with ~.64kg/mm or more(stock is .59)) if you want to take an SE skyward consistently and land on flat ground, and expect not to end up in this scenario again with any skid plate installed. More bottoming resistance/progressivity in the suspension will help more than you might think, although it will still bottom somewhere and you will still need to be more consious of where/how you are landing.You will also find that the rear bumpstop is going to have a very short lifespan if you are bottoming it that hard and that consistently.

Another tip is to always flat land with an SE (or moreso, an Adventure) rear wheel first, with a little bit of power on, so that the chassis "rolls into the landing" instead of expecting both ends to just absorb all of the load. You just can't hide ~375+your weight lbs of suspended weight when it is plummeting to earth, and springs truly stiff enough to jump and flat land one would be unbearable to ride on over chatter, crossgrain and loose roly-poly rocks etc.

I appreciate the tips Tim, but I have been riding it like this for 4/5 years without issues. The bike has been re-sprung and re-valved by SuperPlush for my riding weight and style.

I must have hit a rock (no major dings in the skid plate) or more likely a rise in the trail.

I don't plan on altering my riding habits and curbing my fun, I'll just have to pay to play.

I still think KTM could have done a better job on the skid-plate design by incorporating a smaller removable sub-frame that is not connected to the oil tank or the radiator. That is just silly.

Another tip is to always land rear wheel first, with a little bit of power on, so that the chassis "rolls into the landing" instead of expecting both ends to just absorb all of the load.

This is a good tip and something I always do. If you land and do not have any power applied the rear wheel acts a a brake and forces the front suspension to dive along w/ the rear to squat --> NOT GOOD.

Thanks for all the input guys. Looks like I have a G-IT on the way.
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Old 09-20-2012, 06:27 AM   #35
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Wish I would have known this before I ordered my BD plate. Now, how to fix it without buying something different?

Saw somewhere, after reading this thread, of someone who attached the 'wings' of the BD plate to the long motor mount bolt with what looked like some steel straps bent to shape. He had posted the length of the new bolt needed.
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Old 09-20-2012, 04:13 PM   #36
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I read this thread this morning. After, I removed the BD skid plate to do an oil change. The right side lower bolt in the bracket holding the oil tank was sheared off. Hmmmmm. The radiator was not bent thankfully. I don't even remember any big hits since I last had the skid plate off a couple months ago.

This gave me a chance to check out the new Harbor Freight store in town, and I got some left hand drill bits and some easy outs. Even with my swamp cooler, the garage is still a little gruesome so I'll probably wait for tomorrow morning to pull the bolt out.
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Old 09-20-2012, 08:58 PM   #37
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Good luck getting the bolt out and not messing up the oil tank.
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Old 09-20-2012, 09:07 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by Yellow Pig View Post
Good luck getting the bolt out and not messing up the oil tank.

A good reason for a custom underseat oil tank!
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Old 09-20-2012, 10:06 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by Navin View Post
A good reason for a custom underseat oil tank!

That's just crazy talk...



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Old 09-21-2012, 05:20 AM   #40
dogsslober
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Under seat oil tank

Quote:
Originally Posted by Navin View Post
A good reason for a custom underseat oil tank!
And a crazy skid plate
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Old 09-24-2012, 08:38 AM   #41
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G-iT on order... thank your the info guys!
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Old 09-24-2012, 09:19 AM   #42
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Originally Posted by traveltoad View Post
G-iT on order... thank your the info guys!

From where? I thought they were out of stock.
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Old 09-24-2012, 09:23 AM   #43
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From where? I thought they were out of stock.
That is true... from what I have been told, they are gone.
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Old 09-24-2012, 03:55 PM   #44
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While the 3-point fastening of the GiT plate is more rigid than the floating BD (and anectdotally that seems to make a difference ), the fundamental issue IMO is that you have a soft (metallurgically speaking) Aluminium bash plate with no structural support from the bike at the front.... and a very heavy bike. Any big hit will bend the plate, and move the oil tank, and bend the rad.

Albeit on the adv, my Alu bash plate took a direct hit when the front wheel dropped off a ledge into a hole. Bike bottomed on the ledge. Very un-dramatic - didn't even interrupt riding rhythm. But it bent the plate like a piece of cheese.
And if I thought I underestimated the impact, it took just one(1) blow with the 10lb hammer to straighten it.

The only sure solution is to relocate the oil tank & mount the bash plate to the frame/engine mounts.
It's been done - can't remember who now... ;)
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Old 09-24-2012, 04:38 PM   #45
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The only sure solution is to relocate the oil tank & mount the bash plate to the frame/engine mounts.
It's been done - can't remember who now... ;)[/QUOTE]

Your thinking of Power Cells SE
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