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Old 09-21-2012, 10:38 AM   #136
larryboy
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Originally Posted by LukasM View Post



Dry weight is also an irrelevant number, what you want to compare is wet weight ready to ride, but no fuel, so you don't punish the bikes with bigger tanks.



Fill 'em up for a true wet weight, I've never ridden a bike that didn't have gas in it. That's the only number that matters on any bike.
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Old 09-21-2012, 10:50 AM   #137
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Originally Posted by larryboy View Post
Fill 'em up for a true wet weight, I've never ridden a bike that didn't have gas in it. That's the only number that matters on any bike.
Then by installing a lighter but bigger plastic tank instead of a steel one the manufacturer would make a bike worse by your standards?

I can tell you that I definitely won't fill up the tank on my bike when I am going on a hard off road ride (as in trials style steps/climbs/drops etc) where weight really matters and I don't need the range. Just like I will have to carry extra gas bottles or bladders in addition to a full tank when I go touring with other bikes with bigger tanks or in an area where there is no gas.

The necessary fuel weight is more or less the same between each bike for each ride, since the differences in consumption are quite small in general, maybe 10 - max. 20% if ridden at the same pace. There are huge differences in tank capacity however, think 100% between KTM 690 and a KLR for example.

That's why IMO it makes sense to weigh the bikes with the same amount of fuel in them (or none at all).
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Old 09-21-2012, 10:56 AM   #138
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Originally Posted by LukasM View Post
That's why IMO it makes sense to weigh the bikes with the same amount of fuel in them (or none at all).

You're talking in circles about a gravel road bike, fill it up, can't ride this bike without fuel. Your IMO is wrong IMHO, that's all.
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Old 09-21-2012, 11:03 AM   #139
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You're talking in circles about a gravel road bike, fill it up, can't ride this bike without fuel. Your IMO is wrong IMHO, that's all.
I'm trying to explain the one weight standard I feel is best to make all bikes comparable.

You don't have to fill up a tank just because you have the capacity, just like you are not going to get around carrying extra fuel because your tank is small if you need it.

Leave the fuel out of it, IMHO.
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Old 09-21-2012, 11:11 AM   #140
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Originally Posted by LukasM View Post
I'm trying to explain the one weight standard I feel is best to make all bikes comparable.

You don't have to fill up a tank just because you have the capacity, just like you are not going to get around carrying extra fuel because your tank is small if you need it.

Leave the fuel out of it, IMHO.

I have yet to put half a tank of gas in a motorcycle in 30 years of riding.

By your thinking we should take the tires off too, some weigh more and it's just not fair to that bike. Chains too, oh no...the old 610 came with an aluminum rear sprocket...no sprockets allowed in the LukasM weight standard.

The only number that matters is full of fuel and ready to ride.


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Old 09-21-2012, 11:19 AM   #141
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Alright man, I gave up, we'll just have to disagree.


Spoke to the local Husky dealer today, he said there won't be any test rides this year. Still looking forward to seeing if the new 644 is finally a (somewhat) fun engine that can even come close to the 690.
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Old 09-21-2012, 11:31 AM   #142
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Originally Posted by LukasM View Post
Alright man, I gave up, we'll just have to disagree.


Spoke to the local Husky dealer today, he said there won't be any test rides this year. Still looking forward to seeing if the new 644 is finally a (somewhat) fun engine that can even come close to the 690.
I'm going to have to agree with Lukas on this one. If I compare the tank full of my DR and another's KLR the KLR loses even more, but the first thing I do is put an IMS 4.9 tank on the DR. I want a real comparison not one that is skewed by personal taste for a stock tank or an aftermarket tank. I can deduce the difference from there.
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Old 09-21-2012, 11:33 AM   #143
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Originally Posted by LukasM View Post
Alright man, I gave up, we'll just have to disagree.


Spoke to the local Husky dealer today, he said there won't be any test rides this year. Still looking forward to seeing if the new 644 is finally a (somewhat) fun engine that can even come close to the 690.
Kinda hard to imagine it having anything like the same performance as a 690 when it is pushing close to 100 extra pounds. I think this bike is about hitting a price point not performance.
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Old 09-21-2012, 11:46 AM   #144
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Kinda hard to imagine it having anything like the same performance as a 690 when it is pushing close to 100 extra pounds. I think this bike is about hitting a price point not performance.
Exactly, it it was aimed at the KLR, not the 690. Low bux upside down forks, rebound only shock. That's KLR material, probably a bit better because it's more modern, but nowhere near the 690.
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Old 09-21-2012, 12:10 PM   #145
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I have yet to put half a tank of gas in a motorcycle in 30 years of riding.

By your thinking we should take the tires off too, some weigh more and it's just not fair to that bike. Chains too, oh no...the old 610 came with an aluminum rear sprocket...no sprockets allowed in the LukasM weight standard.

The only number that matters is full of fuel and ready to ride.



I fill up my GSA half way all the time if I am going to be riding it where it shouldnt be ridden and I dont need the range.. but I have only been riding for 20 years so I guess I am just too boot to realize I have been doing it wrong

I know you think you are making a logical point, but really all you did is make yourself look like an ass.. IMHO your leap to tires and sprockets is just a ridiculous attempt at extrapolating a valid argument into the inane. That is poor form and smacks of lazy thinking and probably belongs down in Jo Mamma.
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Old 09-21-2012, 12:21 PM   #146
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I fill up my GSA half way all the time if I am going to be riding it where it shouldnt be ridden and I dont need the range.. but I have only been riding for 20 years so I guess I am just too boot to realize I have been doing it wrong

I know you think you are making a logical point, but really all you did is make yourself look like an ass.. IMHO your leap to tires and sprockets is just a ridiculous attempt at extrapolating a valid argument into the inane. That is poor form and smacks of lazy thinking and probably belongs down in Jo Mamma.
Yet another's OPINION heard

If your wonderbike comes with a super-duper extra range tank, it should be weighed with a full tank.
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Old 09-21-2012, 01:24 PM   #147
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How about if I carry luggage? should that be weighed too. I am with Lucas on this. In a perfect world, ready to ride without gas. Full tank?, at least tell us how many gallons, I can do the math.
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Old 09-21-2012, 01:38 PM   #148
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Your wasting your time guys. They'll never get it. Why anyone would weigh a bike with fuel and then use that weight, as a comparison to another bike, is just crazy. Especially, when the bikes have different fuel capacities. How could you know what the true weght is? Every bike needs fuel, no doubt but the fuel load is not relevant as it can be changed. If my bike carries extra fuel in separate tanks, should that be counted in the true weight of the bike? No! I just want to know what the BIKE weighs. I already know what fuel weighs.

I agree with Lukas assessment of wet weight, dry tank. That levels the field and takes the fuel load out of the equation.

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Old 09-21-2012, 01:53 PM   #149
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Maybe this will settle the arguement. Wet weight with 1 gal of fuel. The bike will run with one gallon of fuel and every tank holds at least that amount. Level the field, so that everyone can agree. Whether or not they will is a different matter. That means the new TR650 weighs around 380lbs ready to ride. I'll take that, and I'll have mine down to 350lbs ready to ride in no time.
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Old 09-21-2012, 01:55 PM   #150
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Your wasting your time guys. They'll never get it. Why anyone would weigh a bike with fuel and then use that weight, as a comparison to another bike, is just crazy. Especially, when the bikes have different fuel capacities. How could you know what the true weght is? Every bike needs fuel, no doubt but the fuel load is not relevant as it can be changed. If my bike carries extra fuel in separate tanks, should that be counted in the true weight of the bike? No! I just want to know what the BIKE weighs. I already know what fuel weighs.


I agree with Lukas assessment of wet weight, dry tank. That levels the field and takes the fuel load of of the equation.
That's like so many when asked about gas mileage answering that they get 200 miles a tank? Duh!
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