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Old 10-01-2012, 03:47 PM   #301
Butters
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SamM View Post
The bikes are not assembled in China.
Yes, you're correct. I should have said the engines are assembled there. And, according wiki, it is using parts manufactured by Rotax in Europe. Not sure if the G bikes directly relate to the Husky, but I would think so.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_F65...e#2009:_G650GS
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Old 10-01-2012, 07:46 PM   #302
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X bikes were not made in China and at least the 2007 model engines were not made in China either.

The motors that have been made or assembled in China have shown no drop in quality or problems reported rising. A check with the local BMW shop locally showed that the Chinese built/assembled motors actually had less reported problems, though the time frame is a lot shorter for this motor.
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Old 10-01-2012, 09:41 PM   #303
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Honestly, I don't have any issues with a Chinese produced engine. Nobody here builds bikes like this, so I already understand that my money is going overseas. The TR650 engine wasn't designed by the Chinese, so that would not be a concern. It was designed by Rotax and they have historically made very nice stuff. There doesn't seem to be any major issues reported by owners of Rotax powered BMW motorcycles. This bike shouldn't be any different. I'm very excited to find out if the Rekluse auto-clutch will fit in this version of the Rotax engine. Hopefully, it will. My last motorcycle project did not have the capability to use the Rekluse as it isn't available for the Kawasaki Versys engine.

Today, I made a call to my dealer and asked about the TR650. He said that he has a shipment on the way. Availability of this bike may be something that I will have to deal with. I don't want to spend all my cash this time of year and have a bike sitting for 6 or 7 months going out of warranty. A January or February purchase would be much better for me. That's what I'm looking at.
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Old 10-01-2012, 10:00 PM   #304
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Looks like a true Italian KLR to me. I'm sure that's what the suits were aiming for. Hard to dispute the following of the Japanese "dual sports" like the KLR, DR and XRL's. These bikes hold their own in the market. Maybe not the Honda compared to the other two, but...
I don't care for Japanese bikes, and the Husky (if I were in the market) would be a great choice.

That said, I'm sure glad I snagged my 630 when I did. While not perfect, it's a better choice for my riding needs than the new 650. I do look forward to seeng the new 650's in person. Maybe I'll even get a test ride if there any demos at Tri-County.
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Old 10-01-2012, 10:04 PM   #305
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Chinese built motor isn't a concern for me either, at the end of the day, Chinese folks have 5 fingers, 2 hands, and the ability to learn last time i checked. Its all about the process installed at the factory and BMW commitment ensuring quality and performance standards are met on continuous basis with high levels of reliability and repeatability. That is where lesser companies fail, American made, German made, Chinese made....its all about the process and commitment of the company.

Anyways, my concern is BMW electrical system and the reliability....certainly not a strong point for them. Motor may have the ability to go around the world, twice on Sundays, but any electrical glitch can stop you cold.
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Old 10-01-2012, 10:55 PM   #306
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I will dispute that the TE-630 had reached the end of its design cycle. The TE-610 was 576 cc. The TE-630 upped the displacement to 600 cc. It also added the DOHC cylinder head from the TE-510. It had what is still the best 6-speed transmission in a large displacement thumper.

I believe that it was expensive to produce (as all Huskies are) and provided direct competition (arguably a better product) for existing BMW products, and specifically to the KTM 690; hence, in buying Husky and consolidating, it was dropped. As were the TE-450 and TE-510 in favor of the BMW engined TE-449 and TE-511. It was all about economics and the cost of production. The TE-630 motor has some quirks, but it had less frequent maintenance and fewer issues than the KTM-690, which was its real competition. The TE-630 was too expensive to continue development in lieu of the availability of the Rotax-designed motor, but it hadn't reached its end of life. If it had been about the better motorcycle, the TE-630 would still be with us.

As I've said before, I'm disappointed with this reality, but it is what it is. BMW has to fix lots of issues with the F-series and R-series bikes, and was spread too thin to fix the TE's too. And, I believe that they had a bias toward their own product. But I agree with the statement made above: The TE-630 was the best large DS thumper ever made.

I also agree that the Terra is not trying to replace it - I see it as an Adventure bike, not a true dual sport, and as competition for the Sertao, which I don't understand at all. BMW may have gotten the cost of production arguement right, but they got the marketing and sector competition arguement all wrong. The new bikes will sell, sandwiched in between the KLR and the Sertao (F650GS), but they crowd that market. The TE-630 wasn't as powerful as the KTM-690, but it was a better DS bike. The only other bikes standing are the KLR, DR650 and XR-650L - older, reliable DS bikes. Without a 6-speed transmission, the Terra and Strada just make the "old" market more crowded. And it leaves the KTM-690 without significant competion.

Finally, this begs the question: what is BMW going to do with the 900cc version of the F800 motor that Husky has in the Nuda. With this engine, Husky dropped BMW's preference for high mpg in favor of competitive HP. That makes sense - it distinguishes the motor. Now, what's next? Husky promised street and Adv applications. But the 900cc motor COULD be better than either the F800GS and the Triumph Tiger on the off-road end of the ADV spectrum - if BMW lets Husky build the chassis for it. What ever BMW acutally does will speak volumes, much more clearly than the BMW marketing department.
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Old 10-01-2012, 10:59 PM   #307
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johngil View Post
Looks like a true Italian KLR to me.
It is clearly a bmw dakar with added gusto, perkier engine, lighter weight, minimal and beautiful design and (I guess) decent suspension.
I fail to see any resemblance to the KLR, which is the donkey of the dual sport world.
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Old 10-02-2012, 12:24 AM   #308
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Originally Posted by mousitsas View Post
I fail to see any resemblance to the KLR, which is the donkey of the dual sport world.
Ouch

Had this very discussion today with a friend and we both agreed on one thing: at least Kawasaki has some chips in the game.

Oh wait~Honda gave us the NX.
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Old 10-02-2012, 01:06 AM   #309
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gryphon12 View Post
I will dispute that the TE-630 had reached the end of its design cycle. The TE-610 was 576 cc. The TE-630 upped the displacement to 600 cc. It also added the DOHC cylinder head from the TE-510. It had what is still the best 6-speed transmission in a large displacement thumper.

I believe that it was expensive to produce (as all Huskies are) and provided direct competition (arguably a better product) for existing BMW products, and specifically to the KTM 690; hence, in buying Husky and consolidating, it was dropped. The only other bikes standing are the KLR, DR650 and XR-650L - older, reliable DS bikes. Without a 6-speed transmission, the Terra and Strada just make the "old" market more crowded. And it leaves the KTM-690 without significant competion..
What bike in the BMW range came up against the 630 Husky, especially in the last year of production?

I can't think of any?
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Old 10-02-2012, 04:45 AM   #310
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Honda has done nothing, Kawasaki is resting on their laurels (and will not update the KLR) and Yamaha had the best bike of the lot and refused to bring it to our market. The Husqvarna TR650 directly competes with MY KLR, because mine had KX450F inverted forks, a Cogent Dynamics rear shock and it weighed in the 350 to 370lb range. I went looking for more power and couldn't find any with the KLR engine. I see the TR650 at the top of the dualsport heap. When compared to the KLR, XRL and the non-existant XTZ it wins, hands down! Dualsport means, dual role or dual use. That means on and off-road use. The TR will go off-road that means it's a dualsport. It's not a dirtbike. The market has enough dirtbikes and in many states, mine included, those can be plated. If I needed a dirtbike, I'd just go buy one. I need a commuter bike that will rack up high mileage on trips and go light off-roading when I need it to. It needs to haul a load like my KLR did. The Husqvarna TR650 is the perfect replacement for my KLR.

I guess it all comes down to your opinion!
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Old 10-02-2012, 07:23 AM   #311
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mousitsas View Post
It is clearly a bmw dakar with added gusto, perkier engine, lighter weight, minimal and beautiful design and (I guess) decent suspension.
I fail to see any resemblance to the KLR, which is the donkey of the dual sport world.
I think most would equate a KLR to a Swiss army knife. That's more where I was headed.
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Old 10-02-2012, 09:34 AM   #312
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Originally Posted by mousitsas View Post
I fail to see any resemblance to the KLR, which is the donkey of the dual sport world.
Oh so true... which is why I ride my "donkey" into the middle of nowhere rather than my fragile "thoroughbred".
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Old 10-02-2012, 10:30 AM   #313
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SamM View Post
Honda has done nothing, Kawasaki is resting on their laurels (and will not update the KLR) and Yamaha had the best bike of the lot and refused to bring it to our market. The Husqvarna TR650 directly competes with MY KLR, because mine had KX450F inverted forks, a Cogent Dynamics rear shock and it weighed in the 350 to 370lb range. I went looking for more power and couldn't find any with the KLR engine. I see the TR650 at the top of the dualsport heap. When compared to the KLR, XRL and the non-existant XTZ it wins, hands down! Dualsport means, dual role or dual use. That means on and off-road use. The TR will go off-road that means it's a dualsport. It's not a dirtbike. The market has enough dirtbikes and in many states, mine included, those can be plated. If I needed a dirtbike, I'd just go buy one. I need a commuter bike that will rack up high mileage on trips and go light off-roading when I need it to. It needs to haul a load like my KLR did. The Husqvarna TR650 is the perfect replacement for my KLR.

I guess it all comes down to your opinion!
Couldn't agree more! What I really want is for Yamaha to build a dual sport (or sumo) around the 700 Raptor power plant, with a 6 speed & modern suspension. That's a bike that would EASILY be worth 10 grand & KTM would never sell a 690 enduro again.

I agree that it sucks the 630 is gone but, listening to Husky purists complain about the 650 Terra reminds me of Harley purists/pirates bad mouthing the V-Rod.

I take my KLR "ALMOST" anywhere I take my 450 EXC, I just do it ALOT slower & feel ten times the sense of acomplishment at having done so & that in itself gives me great satisfaction. Yes, I like the 450 EXC better than my KLR but, if I was FORCED to sell one I'd keep the KLR for its practicality. As a huge fan of the KLR I'm PAINFULLY aware of its short commings. The 650 Terra "APPEARS" to be an answer to every KLR owners prayers & if Husqvarna can't sell a boat load of them......Expect them to go out of buisness because they just don't know how to sell motorcycles.
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Old 10-02-2012, 10:48 AM   #314
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Originally Posted by Wallachian Spikes View Post
Couldn't agree more! What I really want is for Yamaha to build a dual sport (or sumo) around the 700 Raptor power plant, with a 6 speed & modern suspension. That's a bike that would EASILY be worth 10 grand & KTM would never sell a 690 enduro again.
They make 2 bikes with that motor, just not the modern suspension. there both under 10 grand US if you compare them to the UK spec bikes on Yamaha uk's site. im pretty sure they would still sell 690's even if Yamaha brought their big bore singles to the US. because there will always be people who think they need the needle point precision of the ktm as well as the few who actually do. For the rest of us the new 650 Terra is more than enough bike to get us in over our heads in the middle of BFE and have a smile on our face while doing it.
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Old 10-02-2012, 11:20 AM   #315
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The point of a bike like the 690 is that is a hell of a lot harder to get in over your head offroad when you are on an actual offroad bike.

But, believe it or not, I get this 650. It isn't my thing. But I do get it. Make it good enough to get you offroad even if you have to do it slowly, make it good for long distances on the highway and make it cheap enough to compete with Japanese companies. To me, that formula seems like a winning combination. I still wonder if Husky can make it viable just because of the pathetic state of their dealerships. But the bike sure seems positioned right.
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