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Old 09-23-2012, 06:48 AM   #31
markk53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maalstroom View Post
This is not Jm, and you aren't helping.

To the op, keep at it, and if you aren't happy with your experience, raise hell until you get a refund and a decent instructor.

Depends on what you are getting help with... It was a great lesson in what should be written on the ADVrider forum.

Of course your recommendation is spot on. I'd be bitching (the proper word) too. I'd complain to the DOT license bureau supervisor and even go as far as to at least threaten to go to my state legislator if that supervisor dismissed my complaint without a redo if felt necessary on my part. Be courteous, but be firm.
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Old 09-23-2012, 06:54 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by thunderkat59 View Post
MSF course is better than nothing, but theoretical BS and dopey, arrogant teachers aren't going to provide you with most of the skills needed to handle your bike in adverse conditions and situations. Anybody can be an MFS instructor, Your "instructor' might have only had a few years of uneventful riding experience himself.

If you want to invest in your riding career, and possibly life, buy a 125 dirt bike off of Craigslist and ride it every weekend. There are zillions of places around GA where this is possible. You will learn advanced bike handling skills that will be applicable in real world situations. You will also learn to fall. It sort of defies explanation, but its an important part of being comfortable on your bike. There is just nothing like trail/woods riding to hone your reflex's and bike handling skills.
Good luck, and dont let arrogant, prickish MC bro's wreck your riding experience
BIG +1 on this and I would add that a small 4 stroke would be the best bet as it's throttle response will be more like a street bike than a snappy 2 stroke. There is really no better way to learn the feel of a bike than to rip around a field on a small dirt bike. Get some good armored mx gear, have your husband talk you through any questions then have him step aside and watch from a distance. Just ride and slide and get your knocks and mistakes out of the way on a nice relatively soft hayfield and you will be confident in no time.
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Old 09-23-2012, 07:03 AM   #33
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My 2 cents. While I encourage all I come across who express a desire to possibly learn to ride someday to take an MSF (or similar) course, I realize that the course is not for everyone; some people do better with one-on-one instruction. I myself am not an MSF instructor, but I have "taught" dozens of people to ride over the years (my first street legal bike was a Honda Nighthawk 250, which I kept for years even after moving onto to bigger bikes. it was a perfect learner bike). From what I'm reading Mrs6Gun, an MSF type class may not be for you; you might do better with one-on-one instruction. While I can appreciate how your husband/significant other may not be the best candidate to teach you, you must have a friend with a lot of riding experience that may be willing to do so? I see in your other half's sig line that he has a Super Sherpa? That makes for a perfect learner bike. Now all you need is someone to show you how to use it, and an open parking lot in which to practice. I always found that public schools parking lots on the weekends were a great place to do so.

Good on you for not letting someone else crush your dreams, and good luck.
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Old 09-23-2012, 07:13 AM   #34
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I have to see the possibility at least of UP's side. In fact, that was my thought when I read your first post. I've seen it first hand in BRC classes (I am not an instructor, but I had considered it, and still do, and had visited several classes). Sometimes people expect to be coddled. I'm not saying that you did, but it does happy. Eventually those people leave unhappy. The class dues need to move on, and some people are talked out of the class, intentionally.

There are always two sides of a story.
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Old 09-23-2012, 07:15 AM   #35
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beginner class doesn't mean" virgin rider" it means hey i know how to use a clutch and ride im just not very good at it and i want to pass my riders test.. look locally for a used 185/250 cc bike practice on your own until your some what comfortable with riding then take the class.
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Old 09-23-2012, 07:20 AM   #36
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It's always hard to try and get your arms around another person's perception of their experience. A Basic Course does have time limits and there is a point where you have to say, 'Sorry, today ain't yer day." I've 'counseled out' a handful of riders in my time teaching and it's always hard to tell someone that the day is over. Usually this means that because they aren't keeping up they are a danger to themselves or others.

I counseled a rider out about 4 weeks ago because this person could not get their feet up because they wouldn't go fast enough to stabilize the bike. There were 12 people in the class and 4 were complete noobs. The other 3 passed. Why? I don't know. Since classes have a schedule there's only so much time you can spend for one on one remediation. We actually ran the first break long and tried to help this rider out...no joy.

You have a right to be treated like a human being. You have a right to be dealt with civilly. You have a right to try and learn to ride. You have no right to endanger others or hamper their learning experience.

That said: There are asshat RCs. When I started instruction there was a very, very boot camp feel to it. It was a tad...brusque. Believe it or not, now it's much more nurturing and there's a lot of focus on student accommodation. You might have had an old school instructor. (In fact when the terminology was changed from "Instructor" to "RiderCoach" there was a huge outcry. I remember one instructor telling me, "I'm not a Coach. I instruct.") Coaches as a general rule want you to succeed.

Retake the course. Find a different provider or, at least, a different coach. Keep hacking at it. Good luck!
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Old 09-23-2012, 07:22 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cardoctor1 View Post
beginner class doesn't mean" virgin rider" it means hey i know how to use a clutch and ride im just not very good at it and i want to pass my riders test.. look locally for a used 185/250 cc bike practice on your own until your some what comfortable with riding then take the class.
BASIC means you've never sat on a bike before in your life. That's how it's designed. That's why they even remind you to squeeze the front brake while mounting and to put the kickstand up.

BASIC 2 assumes you can clutch, turn, and brake.
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Old 09-23-2012, 07:25 AM   #38
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I am an MSF instructor. Not every other instructor is the cat's meow, but the vast majority I know are concerned about delivering quality coaching to the students. Not every student is the cat's meow, either, but most of them put forth a genuine effort to learn. Sometimes "anomalies occur" and a bad experience results. Sounds like this may have been one.


To the OP: please know that the course is designed to put the responsibility of learning on the student. It is no longer a "traditional" teaching course where the student "drinks from the firehose of experience" from a forty-plus year rider. Having said that, I hope you take another BRC. It is a very well designed course. Please feel free to pm me with any questions you may have. I'd love to help restore your confidence in the program.


Finally, here is a reason to pay for some professional help (pardon the language):

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Old 09-23-2012, 07:47 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by TheWorstKind View Post
I am an MSF instructor. Not every other instructor is the cat's meow, but the vast majority I know are concerned about delivering quality coaching to the students.
Is there a questionnaire or anonymous rating opportunity given after the course ?
I know some stuff has changed over the years . . .

In the OPs defense, In any situation where "class", "instructor" and other such adjectives are used, there is a perception of lots of knowledge, wisdom and patience required to instill.
When a person complains, it might be in everyones interest if these complaints were tracked?
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Old 09-23-2012, 08:01 AM   #40
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I'll second the two primary responses. Go practice and go take the course again. Work at it until either:
1. You have enough confidence and understanding of yourself to move on to another level or,
2. You have enough confidence and understanding of yourself to move off, of the rider position.

Operating a bike is not something that everyone can do safely.

You might consider looking for a course offered by, or taught by, a motorcop instructor. From time to time, they have to teach someone who really has no bike skills and, in short order, get them going through cone patterns. There are many ways to teach something and that skillset may help....one way or the other.

I have family members who I would never want riding due to their typical attention level, maturity, kinematics (motor skills) and just personality.

Grow thickskin as well. You may need it to get better and hear the nature of the criticism instead of the tone.
If you can't get the hang of riding, it is what it is.

Good luck.
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Old 09-23-2012, 08:11 AM   #41
TheWorstKind
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thunderkat59 View Post
Is there a questionnaire or anonymous rating opportunity given after the course ?
I know some stuff has changed over the years . . .

In the OPs defense, In any situation where "class", "instructor" and other such adjectives are used, there is a perception of lots of knowledge, wisdom and patience required to instill.
When a person complains, it might be in everyones interest if these complaints were tracked?
Yes, there is a critique form in the student's book. This is used to provide feedback directly to the MSF. Most classes also include a critique that is seen by various local administrators.
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Old 09-23-2012, 08:40 AM   #42
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What? The OP says she hasn't ridden but has been a passenger on a bike.

So you HAVE ridden, just have not been in control. How could you have needed extra instruction on the controls, starting, and the clutch when you've witnessed it all before, plus the fact most of the things are labeled on a bike.

If you didn't pick that much up riding with someone else, what made you think you were going to pick it up in MSF BRC? General around here they are dealership related because they provide bikes, and they just hire some sucker off the street for a day who needs beer money, then they tell him to mention a dealership discount or something.

We were told before our course that we should at least know how to ride a bicycle, in my mind that means being able to balance, while operating controls with your hands and feet (although they are different).

I knew the basic controls already from 4 wheelers, I practiced heavy 2 wheel vehicle balancing in the grass with a small dual sport. Hell, I rode dirty on the dual sport for a month or two before I took the course to make sure I actually liked motorcycling, and was capable of not dying in small town traffic.

These are all knowledge pieces your Mr6Gun should have shared with you.

Also I understand rage at an annoying instructor, but you ought to know that advrider is full of internet thugs. I swear there must be ten-thousand people on here who have never even seen a fuckin motorcycle in reality. You're supposed to verbal stab the first troll you see to assert your dominance and earn respect. You don't want to be sent to the kitchen by these twatwaffles, nor should you need a defender from your Mr.
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Old 09-23-2012, 08:59 AM   #43
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lol3 to Snarky

LOL Snarky. Thanks for the advice on Adv Rider posts.
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Old 09-23-2012, 09:32 AM   #44
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Never much support on here for complaints, rarely do they turn out good.
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Old 09-23-2012, 09:56 AM   #45
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Survey Form

There is a survey form, and I will definintely be sending it in along with my feedback of the class.
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