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Old 07-30-2013, 11:18 PM   #421
OldManSandman
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Tenere & new V-Strom 1000 are two cool looking bikes! I'm waiting to see the new Strom in person. A TL based motor should get a rider's blood flowing. Would be awesome if it came with similar off-road capabilities of the S10 (spoked wheel option maybe?). Let's hope for the best.
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Old 07-30-2013, 11:36 PM   #422
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Originally Posted by Mighty Kentor View Post
A big appeal of the V-Strom to me is that it doesn't weigh the better part of a ton. I'm a fan of the Tenere, but that heft is unnecessary. I'm hoping the new DL1000 is equal or less weight than it's predecessor.

Waaaay back in the day. I used to love my '00 ZX-9R, 400 lbs, loads of ponies for the street, but also owned a '99 VFR and wished I could blend the comfort of the VFR with the light weight of the ninja.

Why can't the ADV and touring bikes come in at a reasonable weight? BMW, bless their hearts are doing okay with the GS series, but I'll not buy a BMW for reliability reasons. I don't trust them like I do the big four.

Why do the Yammy, Triumph and Honda options have to weigh so much? The magazines boast that they ride so nicely despite their weight, what engineering!!! I'd rather the engineers use their talents to shave pounds.
Have you tried an S10? The CoG is very low so it's extremely easy to lift off the side stand, wheel around in a parking lot and it's a cinch to do u-turns on. As easy as my 196kg F650GS, if not easier.

A glance at the R1, R6 etc and it's obvious that Yamaha knows how to build very light bikes. But with the S10 they chose instead to build it as tough as a brick sh*thouse so when it can take an offroad licking and keep on ticking. To each his own but imo that's far better than light but more fragile bike that leaves you stranded in the middle of nowhere.
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Old 07-30-2013, 11:41 PM   #423
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It MUST have spoked wheels and a center stand. Otherwise its the 1200 tenere for me.

I really like the design of the new vstrom it reminds me so much of the 800 BIG.

Really hoping for spoked wheels and center stand. Or mayby a taller adventure version with huge fueltank, spoked weels, center stand, chrashbars, extra lights and alu luggage comes out in 2015
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Old 07-30-2013, 11:56 PM   #424
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Originally Posted by twinrider View Post
To each his own but imo that's far better than light but more fragile bike that leaves you stranded in the middle of nowhere.
Heavy doesn't mean more reliable. Heavy means lower costs to manufacture the components / buy the materials. Besides, if I was riding to the middle of nowhere I would be on a different bike all together. Something in the 600 - 800cc range.

Otherwise I agree with your post. The Tenere is a bike that could be a replacement for my V given the riding I do. But if the new DL stays the course with it's weight, power output and has ABS, it wouldn't even be a close contest.
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Old 07-31-2013, 12:14 AM   #425
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Originally Posted by Mighty Kentor View Post
Heavy doesn't mean more reliable. Heavy means lower costs to manufacture the components / buy the materials. Besides, if I was riding to the middle of nowhere I would be on a different bike all together. Something in the 600 - 800cc range.
Beefy components engineered to handle far greater than expected stress are much harder to break than parts designed to be as light as possible and only handle normal stress. Some people have been hammering the S10 pretty hard offroad and I've yet to read of broken frames or any other failures other than wheels.
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Old 07-31-2013, 12:34 AM   #426
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Originally Posted by twinrider View Post
Beefy components engineered to handle far greater than expected stress are much harder to break than parts designed to be as light as possible and only handle normal stress. Some people have been hammering the S10 pretty hard offroad and I've yet to read of broken frames or any other failures other than wheels.
Hold your arm straight out infront of you and wave it back and forth as fast as you can. Now hold a 10lb weight and to the same. Which will produce a failure faster? Sure you could beef up the shoulder joint and build a way bigger muscle, but it doesn't mean more reliable. It just means you have to build heavier to equal reliability. This is a cost saving in building a motorcycle as the light materials / manufacturing methods are more expensive.

Either way, we both have valid points. Mine outmost is that I'd prefer a light weight bike to a heavy one. A heavy one may be made to steer light through well sorted CoG, but it will still take more fuel to propel it, more braking power to stop it and more tire grip to turn it all the same. Imagine how an equally well sorted bike, weighing 100lbs less will feel to ride!

A light bike will take less fuel to propel, less braking distance to stop and less tire grip to turn.
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Old 07-31-2013, 01:56 AM   #427
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Does anyone know when this bike will be in showrooms?
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Old 07-31-2013, 02:38 AM   #428
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Deal breakers for me are generally the salesman and there attitude , When i bought my wee a few weeks ago , i had wandered in just to pass the time , i sat on a 2010 wee with 16500 on the clock and the price was , $8500 if memory serves me right ,
I liked it and sat on a Tenere 2012 model liked it but was told $19,000 with the hard bags , .

I told the salesman its nice but for a second bike a bit costly for me , so i looked at the v strom , did'nt buy straight away went and looked at a new one elswhere , Any way got given a terrific price on my bonnie , and a price of $ 10500 for a 2012 wee .

I told the yammy dealer sorry but your secondhand wee at $8500 does'nt stack up to a brand new one for 2 grand more especielly when i've been offered $2500 more for my trade in , so the deal was done .

Anyway 3-4 weeks later , risers added , new seat added , i'm happy with the wee and the adventure bike scenario i am finding it suits me, so much i'm not out on my rocket much anymore, so my second bike is fast becoming my first bike , and i'm thinking bigger motor needed for all the touring i have coming up after i retire in 8 weeks .

So i went into the yammy store todeay , and this tme for a real good look at the tenere , , speaking to the salesman i was honest and said , at this stage if i knew 4 weeks ago i was going to enjoy this style of bike so much i would off bought the 1000 v or the tenere .

I sat on the tener and the seat fit , it was the same height has the wee without touching it , the bars did'nt need risers , paying more attention the bike fits me and feels good , I'm thinking shit this may well be my one bike does all , I know i will drop money on the wee but heh , i could sell the rocket , and save money on rego , insurance ect ect .

So without even disccusing , trade in price , i say how much WITHOUT the bags , $20,000 i'm told ,, i say it was 19 with the bags a few weeks ago , whats happenned ,

That was a top price then he said but you did'nt take it so that deal is off the table ..

No worries i said , we won't bother , I think i'll wait for the v strom to come out , or go to another dealer and buy a current model ,, you on the other hand i said can , send back that bike to japan , and strip it down for spare parts to sell , because i doubt very much you'll sell it when its a 2012 UNLESS you deal .

Salesmen for me make or break a deal , he broke it , i won't go elsewhere for a Tenere because the other dealers are to far
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Old 07-31-2013, 03:42 AM   #429
twinrider
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Originally Posted by Mighty Kentor View Post
Hold your arm straight out infront of you and wave it back and forth as fast as you can. Now hold a 10lb weight and to the same. Which will produce a failure faster? Sure you could beef up the shoulder joint and build a way bigger muscle, but it doesn't mean more reliable. It just means you have to build heavier to equal reliability. This is a cost saving in building a motorcycle as the light materials / manufacturing methods are more expensive.
Besides the Tenere, I've also got an F650GS Dakar and a Djebel 250XC, which is basically a DRZ250 with a 17 liter metal tank and big headlight. So I know exactly what you're talking about regarding weight. But the Tenere doesn't feel heavy at all. It's even easy to pick up. It wouldn't be my choice for single track, but it makes a damn good touring bike that can handle pretty rough dirt roads as well.

Yamaha obviously could have used an aluminum frame to make it lighter but aluminum is more brittle than steel and harder to repair. Steel can be banged and welded into shape even with the most basic tools in remote places.
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Old 07-31-2013, 04:00 AM   #430
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Originally Posted by Mighty Kentor View Post
Hold your arm straight out infront of you and wave it back and forth as fast as you can. Now hold a 10lb weight and to the same. Which will produce a failure faster? Sure you could beef up the shoulder joint and build a way bigger muscle, but it doesn't mean more reliable. It just means you have to build heavier to equal reliability. This is a cost saving in building a motorcycle as the light materials / manufacturing methods are more expensive.

Either way, we both have valid points. Mine outmost is that I'd prefer a light weight bike to a heavy one. A heavy one may be made to steer light through well sorted CoG, but it will still take more fuel to propel it, more braking power to stop it and more tire grip to turn it all the same. Imagine how an equally well sorted bike, weighing 100lbs less will feel to ride!

A light bike will take less fuel to propel, less braking distance to stop and less tire grip to turn.
Yamaha can and has made, along with many Japanese manufacturers, some expensive exotic machinery which more than not has sat in the showroom.

The reason the Bikes are heavy is that they are made tough from materials that cost what the Average consumer will tolerate. You will not sell enough $USD30K DL1000's to cover the engine development costs let alone the specialists capital costs and training on Foam magnesium, Carbon Fibre and Titanium.

So, what you are saying is known to engineering 101 students. Unfortunately then there is the real word.

Light and affordable in the real world = small, less pistons and less CC.
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Old 07-31-2013, 04:49 AM   #431
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Unless there is some Adv-version coming up, and about this not a word from Suzuki so far, it will not have spoked wheels.
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Old 07-31-2013, 08:07 AM   #432
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Yammi's built to last, sure thing. Take lighter bmw and get less reliability. Gelandewagen of motorcycles -- heavy but solid. It likely will be better offroad than the Strom anyways since the powerplant configuration allows more ground clearance and lower cog.

However it can't keep up with the Vee on motorway even now, that is with 15+ year old motor. Although speed is not a main factor here, this isn't exactly what i would expect from the modern technology.
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Old 07-31-2013, 08:40 AM   #433
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Does anyone know when this bike will be in showrooms?
January 2014 according to a guy at Suzuki GB.
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Old 07-31-2013, 08:46 AM   #434
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Have you tried an S10? The CoG is very low so it's extremely easy to lift off the side stand, wheel around in a parking lot and it's a cinch to do u-turns on. As easy as my 196kg F650GS, if not easier.

>snip
I did, it's a nice handling bike. I did not like the de-tune for gear 1-3 but I understand there's a work-around.
Also looked at both GS's, Multistrada, updated wee, 990, and both Tigers and Explorer. Were it not for the 800 Tigers I'd be on a Super Tenere. I pretty much scratched all of the liter+ bikes for weight and cost, Stelvio in there too. I'll bet you're a pretty big guy, right? The weight of the Tenere was an issue for me - I'm a 175lb aging weakling.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Mighty Kentor
Imagine how an equally well sorted bike, weighing 100lbs less will feel to ride!
And that's how a Triumph Tiger 800XC ended up in my garage.

It has the extra oomph the wee is missing, and the lighter weight, build quality, and refinement both wee and vee are missing. They do cost more though, it's been asked before is a Tiger 800 worth four grand more than a DL650. Experienced riders comparing them side by side will generally say yes, it is.

What I didn't expect is just how capable the XC really is. After a year and 8K miles I would now choose the Explorer XC over S10 and and GS on the bigger bikes. I've also learned bigger is not necessarily better. There are a few XC to Explorer converts that have gone back. Seems the 800 is a 'right size' for a lot of riders.

I also have never had so many people ask about it when out riding it. They just can't believe the old brand Triumph makes a bike like that - not that this is any reason to buy one. But it is fun to have a recognizable marque with a long history - it's almost as recognizable as Harley Davidson - pretty much everyone has heard of Triumph. What they dont get it that the new company has no resemblence to the old, bikes neither. Just kind of fun though. I'm not a big fan of anything made in England, but these guys hit a homerun on this one. I've always been a fan of German/Austrian built motorcycles.
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Old 07-31-2013, 08:53 AM   #435
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The designer seems knowledgeable and committed, spending countless hours on this project. Which makes it all the more baffling how he could come up with that goofy beak and possibly think it looks good.




the beak doesn't bother me - it's the two welded on braces holding up the muffler that bother me. One would be OK, but two? Just how heavy is that muffler?
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