What Dual Sport should Honda build next

[what broke now]

"Well let me be your little dog, 'till your big dog comes
Let me be your little dog, 'till your big dog comes
When the big dog gets here, tell him what this little puppy done
Yeah I'm sitting here wondering, will a matchbox hold my clothes
Yeah I'm sitting here wondering, will a matchbox hold my clothes
I got no matches, got a long way to go
Let 'er go boy, go-go"

Apologies to Carl Perkins

[ADVNCW]

Originally Posted by what broke now

"Well let me be your little dog, 'till your big dog comes
Let me be your little dog, 'till your big dog comes
When the big dog gets here, tell him what this little puppy done
Yeah I'm sitting here wondering, will a matchbox hold my clothes
Yeah I'm sitting here wondering, will a matchbox hold my clothes
I got no matches, got a long way to go
Let 'er go boy, go-go"

Apologies to Carl Perkins

That made me grin! Thanks.

I see that you list owning a WR250R. I have not decided, but that may be my CDR motorcycle next year. Unless a street legal tourable CRF450 Rally becomes available.

Would keep the little dog though. Would not really think of the WR250R as a big dog though.

A street legal CRF450 Rally would be the big dog for me....

[jasonmt]

Funny thing, I currently actually own (and maintain) a Husky TXC 449, a Husky TE 630, a Honda CRF 250X and had a KTM 530EXC prior to the Husky 449. As already mentioned SHMBO had a CRF 230F before her skills outgrew it and she moved on to a TM EN144.

The Husky 449 cost me under $6500 CDN brand new and with ~50 hours on it has required less less work on it than the CRF did by 50 hours.

The KTM 530 had about 450 hours on it and I had checked the valves 12 times or so and had to change a few shims (easily sourced at the local HD dealer) while the CRF was on it's second time apart and second go around with valves by 400 hours.

My view of the 230's (after having one for a couple of years and then my 12-14 YO nephews beating on it for a few more years) is that it is a great starter bike for first time riders and teenagers moving up from smaller "trail bikes" like a XR, TTR etc. but the phrase "Monkey humping a football" comes to mind when someone his size is riding it.

After seeing ADVNCW's continued praising of the 230 with such evangelical fervour (and seeing the size of him and the amount of crap he has strapped to it) I have come to the conclusion he is either/or/and:

1. Trolling.
2. Delusional.
3. Not going over 10mph on any of the trails he rides.

[jasonmt]

Originally Posted by ADVNCW

If someone wants to ride a TW200 across the northern tier or around the world, or a scooter, KLR650, whatever their choice, and they like it and talk about it, great.


What is the problem with what anyone rides and enjoys, asshole? We are trying to talk about Hondas here, so I relate my Honda experience, WTF is your issue? Feel like you must prove something, insecure about yourself?

I do not give a rip for your approval or anyone's, and I am quite certain of what I talk about. But what do you care, are you so weak and insecure?

If anything I hope to give and generate intelligent feedback. Secondly, I hope to encourage folks to have fun on their dual sport motorcycle. It is really ok to enjoy riding a motorcycle that does not have this bs rep from punk assholes like you.

If someone wants to ride a TW200 across the northern tier or around the world, or a scooter, KLR650, whatever their choice, and they like it and talk about it, great.

I agree with many that I would like to see a dualsport Honda 300cc to 500 cc at around 270lbs, a motorcycle that one can ride trail terrain on.

Originally Posted by itrack

Holy crap this thread has turned a 180 from the topic. I was away from the computer all day RIDING my bike. ADVNCW please go troll another thread, we now have 4 extra pages of crap that has nothing to do with the topic. If I hear you post one more bashing KTM post or another 5 page essay on a CRF230L then your going on ignore bud.

Trolling it is then, off to ignore with our delusional troll ADVNCW.

[Ned1]

Troll is as troll does.

[Ham]

Okay, back on topic. I don't have time to read the whole thread so if I repeat I apologize. But I did read a lot.

Here is my two cents. I grew up on Hondas and my favorite was the SL350 '71 twin. Cruised easily at 70 with just a bit of vibe. Rode all day in the original seat and was just fine. Sat pretty low but had plenty of leg room. With FI, just a bit of weight reduction, vibe balancer, and a 50% improvement in front and rear susupension it would sell like hot cakes still today. They were easy to ride and easy to push hard till you crashed. And they got well over 50 mpg. And in those days it seems the Honda understood what first gear was for...creeping and manuevering.

I have taken the NC700X out and put it through the paces street and dirt. To my way of thinking the best points are missed or just not explained enough. That engine is plenty powerful for the vast majority of true Dual Sport riders, and the low COG is just phenomenal and makes it one of the easiest bikes I have ever ridden. But it needs higher wider bars. It needs a bit more seat room. It needs at least a modest attemt at suspension. The most important parts, the tranny and engine are fantastic. The guys who miss the idea with these two are like the guys who can't figure out why Romney didn't anihilate Obama int he last debate...yes he could but he would have lost. Fabulous power eminating in a fountain does not a dualsport make...that is a MXer or a Sportbike. We are talking the kind of bike normal people ride that can put a scare into you once in a while....not rooster to Kansas.

Last I think Honda and all the rest are just plain stupid...they need to look at the American Cruiser business. Put out a good engine and tranny, let the rest suck and then cash in while they upgrade it to the gotta have bike. Man some of these companies are just stupid...way more money in aftermarket upgrades than selling bikes.

[Off the grid]

More to the topic, and I'm sorry to say, but Honda will never, ever produce a dual sport bike that has:

E and kick start
40+hp, 500 +/- cc
Good suspension and brakes-stock (ie name brand)
FI
Decent ergos
Tank that holds 3.5g+
Under 275lbs dry

It will never happen. Honda makes its money by producing hundreds of thousands of cheap, 100-175cc bikes to countries like India, China and Brazil. There are literally thousands of models of Hondas that Americans have no idea about....and no interest in. They are made to a specific price point and have to skimp on things like suspension and brakes to make them cheap. Does a man who lives in India with a 10 year old, 150cc Honda Tornado as his family vehicle give a shit if the ratio between first and second gear is too much of a jump? No, he could care less. Does he care if his shocks bottom out over every bump or rebound like the ass on a cheerleader? No, all he wants is the engine to start. Every day. So it does.

The same thought process is shown in their US offroad bikes. Cheap, unchanged, built to meet a price point.

Does Honda make a good engine? Sure, no one can debate that. But if you are looking for innovation or anything state-of-the art, look elsewhere.

Honda ain't it.

If anything, pin your Japanese hopes on Yamaha for putting out a bike close to what I described above. At least they are innovating and taking chances with new designs and new models in the offroad market. (forward-canted engine, WR250R)

[siyeh]

Originally Posted by ADVNCW

I do not give a rip for your approval or anyone's

I don't post much here either, but I read a lot

it seems, on many threads, anyone who doesn't give approval you call an "asshole"

now you can call me an "asshole"

you keep digging that hole deeper advncw so deep no one will ever see you

(ignore)

[ADVNCW]

Originally Posted by tirebiter

I don't post much, in my 60's and consider all the chest thumpin' bs is usually due to a combo of hyper testosterone, guilt based on the unknown, wasted dreams and general BS.
You, sir, need to reflect back in your mind and find that feeling that only comes when your scooting down a trail and all's good- damn near infinity on the emotional scale- Dirtbike nervana.
Put yourself back on the trail RIGHT NOW, would you even care about anything here??

Yes, sir, thanks, you are correct, nirvana. This past week I rode 200+ miles of dirt, FS singletrack, FS roads,old roads, beautiful fall colors. Thanks.

I rode all of the same areas in the past on my excellent '83 IT490, as well on a TLR200 Reflex, now even more fun on the CRF230L since it is comfortable and very good on dirt and in the tight and gnarly, easy, 73MPG!

I like to share that but you know, not the right model for some of the punk chest-beaters. I have looked to see that the same punks are spreading similar crap elsewhere, and sharing troubling personal info at times in their posts here. They can only get away with this behind their keyboard, pond scum punks.

So, yea, I am not like most folks, and some of these punks would not like it at all in person...

There are many great folks posting here, I, and we all appreciate that.

I see others talk about riding their small Yamahas, TW200, etc, with equal enthusiasm.Cool. Got nothing against any other motorcycle, have ridden street, big dirt bikes as well. Great to hear from others about their motorcycle passion. Motorcycle riding is great!

[Bultaco206]

Originally Posted by siyeh

I don't post much here either, but I read a lot

it seems, on many threads, anyone who doesn't give approval you call an "asshole"

now you can call me an "asshole"

you keep digging that hole deeper advncw so deep no one will ever see you

(ignore)

I read lots of threads here. Some pertain to me and what I ride, some don't. But I enjoy reading and I always can learn something from someone here.

But I've never quite seen anything like this guy. His act is quite amusing.

[ADVNCW]

Originally Posted by jasonmt

Trolling it is then, off to ignore with our delusional troll ADVNCW.

Please do put me on ignore. But I doubt that you will, you thrive on what you are doing, some sort of attention getting behavior, one-upping to soothe your insecure self. You put effort into being smarmy and provocative in your personal attacks toward me- and others before. You are a shallow thinking punk. Please ignore me, great! One of your old posts shows the same behavior in posting toward another. What a punk. Bye bye!

[ADVNCW]

Originally Posted by Ham

Okay, back on topic. I don't have time to read the whole thread so if I repeat I apologize. But I did read a lot.

Here is my two cents. I grew up on Hondas and my favorite was the SL350 '71 twin. Cruised easily at 70 with just a bit of vibe. Rode all day in the original seat and was just fine. Sat pretty low but had plenty of leg room. With FI, just a bit of weight reduction, vibe balancer, and a 50% improvement in front and rear susupension it would sell like hot cakes still today. They were easy to ride and easy to push hard till you crashed. And they got well over 50 mpg. And in those days it seems the Honda understood what first gear was for...creeping and manuevering.

I have taken the NC700X out and put it through the paces street and dirt. To my way of thinking the best points are missed or just not explained enough. That engine is plenty powerful for the vast majority of true Dual Sport riders, and the low COG is just phenomenal and makes it one of the easiest bikes I have ever ridden. But it needs higher wider bars. It needs a bit more seat room. It needs at least a modest attemt at suspension. The most important parts, the tranny and engine are fantastic. The guys who miss the idea with these two are like the guys who can't figure out why Romney didn't anihilate Obama int he last debate...yes he could but he would have lost. Fabulous power eminating in a fountain does not a dualsport make...that is a MXer or a Sportbike. We are talking the kind of bike normal people ride that can put a scare into you once in a while....not rooster to Kansas.

Last I think Honda and all the rest are just plain stupid...they need to look at the American Cruiser business. Put out a good engine and tranny, let the rest suck and then cash in while they upgrade it to the gotta have bike. Man some of these companies are just stupid...way more money in aftermarket upgrades than selling bikes.

Good stuff, thanks. True about dual sports...

I sat on the NC700X and thought it felt great, low center of gravity. Too bad that it has the small wheels, I would be very tempted for easy trips like the CDR. The NC700X would be comfortable, dependable like a Honda, good gas mileage.

[ADVNCW]

Originally Posted by Bultaco206

I read lots of threads here. Some pertain to me and what I ride, some don't. But I enjoy reading and I always can learn something from someone here.

But I've never quite seen anything like this guy. His act is quite amusing.

Thanks! You would be equally amazed in-person

[kubiak]

i couldnt find the perfect honda dualsport so i made something that would work for me. i started with a 02 bmw f650gs, added yz426 frontend, made a 18 inch front wheel to run super cheap dualsport tires, modified a rear tw200 180 rear rim and tire to fit.now i have the perfect for me dualsport. cruises 80mph on the freeway all day long, super stable on and offroad, gets 65 miles per gallon, 4.5 gallon fuel tank, 50 hp bullet proof rotax motor and factory recomended 6,000 miles between oil changes.

[ADVNCW]

Originally Posted by kubiak

i couldnt find the perfect honda dualsport so i made something that would work for me. i started with a 02 bmw f650gs, added yz426 frontend, made a 18 inch front wheel to run super cheap dualsport tires, modified a rear tw200 180 rear rim and tire to fit.now i have the perfect for me dualsport. cruises 80mph on the freeway all day long, super stable on and offroad, gets 65 miles per gallon, 4.5 gallon fuel tank, 50 hp bullet proof rotax motor and factory recomended 6,000 miles between oil changes.

That is amazng! Thanks for posting that!