Japen scooter becoming like bristish motorcycle before they went down for the count.

[JerryH]

I have a Weber carb on my Pinto, and had dual Webers on 2 of my VW bugs. But the other one always had the stock Solex and I never had a problem with it. I did replace the oil bath air cleaner with a paper element, in a chrome housing. Most of the electrics on the bugs were Bosch.

[max57]

Originally Posted by vortexau

Motorcycles and scooters from Japan were quite oil-tight and lack any participation from Lucas: Prince of Darkness! That's mainly where the products from Honda, Suzuki, Yamaha, Bridgestone, Lilac, & Kawasaki leapfrogged British-built motorcycles.



Japan also pioneered electric-starting, separate oil for Two-Strokes, and near-universal fitting of Flashing Turn Indicators, on motorcycles, stepthroughs, & motorscooters.



Kawasaki H2 Mach IV

Honda's C72 Dream - Electric Starting, Flashing Turn Indicators, and no oil leaks from the crankcase.
Leaving aside lower unit pricing; what has China innovated (apart from poorly-performing integrated mp3 ports)?

I never before saw a Dream with turn signals. And it cruised way over 60! My bike!

[Speedo66]

Originally Posted by JerryH

I have a Weber carb on my Pinto, and had dual Webers on 2 of my VW bugs. But the other one always had the stock Solex and I never had a problem with it. I did replace the oil bath air cleaner with a paper element, in a chrome housing. Most of the electrics on the bugs were Bosch.

A one barrel (or choke) Solex downdraft is a whole different animal than a 2 barrel sidedraft.

[nicholastanguma]

Originally Posted by MOPED MEDIC

One thing that is really going to affect the quality and availability of Chinese scooters in the near future is the fact that they were recently banned in 200 of the largest Chinese cities.
http://www.dealernews.com/dealernews...s-drop-sharply

China's state capitalism (bloody COMMUNISM) makes this inevitable. Finally open up some capitalistic free market ability to your people so they can actually make money through manufacturing and purchasing, but then don't provide appropriate infrastructure to handle the newly capitalized people's lifestyles.

[JerryH]

Originally Posted by nicholastanguma

China's state capitalism (bloody COMMUNISM) makes this inevitable. Finally open up some capitalistic free market ability to your people so they can actually make money through manufacturing and purchasing, but then don't provide appropriate infrastructure to handle the newly capitalized people's lifestyles.

Looks like Indian motorcycles might at last be a success, but not for Polaris. But really, bikes made in India are not such good quality either, as evidenced by the LML Stella and the Royal Enfield. And like I said, there is a lot more to the Chinese invasion than just cheap scooters. They have infiltrated pretty much every major brand of products sold worldwide. High dollar prestigious brands are now either made out of Chinese parts, or actually made in China.

[fullmetalscooter]

Love the thread debate . Interesting to read what you all are saying. When I wonder will the day come back that scooter / motorcycle are a must have for cheap , high MPG transport. Then I wonder if scooter / motorcycle are going to be able to compete on MPG with cars. Already a host of cars get 24 K per L. Far better then or equal r then lots of bikes. 10 years from now you scooter has to Get 100 MPG to be a real transport instead of fun for the weekend. Honda nx700 is a nice start but will the MPG keep going up? Are they just going to keep feeding us MORE CC instead of More MPG?

[nicholastanguma]

Originally Posted by JerryH

They have infiltrated pretty much every major brand of products sold worldwide. High dollar prestigious brands are now either made out of Chinese parts, or actually made in China.

Yes, and the irony of buying high dollar quality from China is that you must, like with high dollar quality built anywhere else, pay high dollar amounts.

I don't so much minding spending money on Chinese products as I do spending money on Communist Chinese products. I wish I could buy American made quality parts without paying blood like I'm being interrogated by Communist Chinese secret police.

Among others, Piaggio, Vespa, BMW, and yes, even Harley Davidson all have partnerships with Zongshen in China. In fact, Vespas are ENTIRELY built in the Zongshen factory. And Vespatista are still paying 6 thousand USD for a new scoot.

How is it Communist workforces in China can build for less than Communist labor unions in the USA? Oh, right, in China they just shoot anyone that creates a labor union.

[nicholastanguma]

Originally Posted by fullmetalscooter

Are they just going to keep feeding us MORE CC instead of More MPG?

In America, for the most part yes. Because here in America we're still rich enough to view motorcycles as recreational vehicles more than commuters and grocery getters.

This is okay with me, as I don't begrudge the USA its wealth, of course.

The annoying part, really, is the mentality that comes along with recreational motorcycling: that because the manufacturers decree it and advertising confirms it and the consumers keep buying it--that I also consider the size of my wang to be directly proportional to how many thousands of horsepower my machine puts to the ground.

[JerryH]

I am 100% blue collar, I am not wealthy, but I view bikes mostly as toys. A big part of that is their absurd cost compared to used cars. I drive a used car for transportation that gets 30 mpg, and has A/C, really important in Phoenix, AZ. I paid $4000 total for the car, and it requires very little maintenance. I am a mechanic so I do it all myself. I am expecting at least another 100,000 miles out of this car before serious problems develop. I just bought a new Zuma 125. I paid $3200 OTD. It has none of the advantages of a car, other than it is more fun in decent weather. It is also too small to be ridden on freeways. I most certainly will not last 200,000 miles. So for me there is no money to be saved by using a bike for transportation. In fact it would actually cost more. I'm not leaving a nice $10,000 bike sitting out in a parking lot. Bikes are my hobby, and an expensive one. They need to last a long time to justify their price. Even scooters cost more to buy and operate than a good used car. Yes I know a lot of people drive $30000-$40000 cars and suvs, but I'm not one of them. I just saw a 5-6 year old BMW 7 series in a McDonalds parking lot today, with half the paint burned off of it by the sun. Some people can afford to waste that kind of money. I can't. My $4000 car is sitting in the driveway. My motorcycles and scooters are in the garage.

[fullmetalscooter]

Originally Posted by nicholastanguma

In America, for the most part yes. Because here in America we're still rich enough to view motorcycles as recreational vehicles more than commuters and grocery getters.

This is okay with me, as I don't begrudge the USA its wealth, of course.

The annoying part, really, is the mentality that comes along with recreational motorcycling: that because the manufacturers decree it and advertising confirms it and the consumers keep buying it--that I also consider the size of my wang to be directly proportional to how many thousands of horsepower my machine puts to the ground.

Gee a confirmed way to get a largler wang with out poping any pills . I wonder what Miss ying going to think about that?

[Süsser Tod]

I got my Japanese scooter because the Chinese scooter I had tried to kill me twice...

[JerryH]

Originally Posted by Süsser Tod

I got my Japanese scooter because the Chinese scooter I had tried to kill me twice...

That is one of the reasons why I would like to see the U.S. put a heavy tariff on anything imported from China. Not only is the stuff cheap junk (though it wouldn't be "cheap" anymore) but it is dangerous as well. Everything from scooters to baby food. The worst thing about it is how many jobs have been lost because of it. Maybe they could raise taxes on business' that use Chinese parts as well, though if they cost a lot more, there wouldn't be so much of an incentive. Looks to me like the U.S. is on the losing end of this "global economy" thing.

[max57]

Originally Posted by Süsser Tod

I got my Japanese scooter because the Chinese scooter I had tried to kill me twice...

What happened?

[Süsser Tod]

Originally Posted by max57

What happened?

1. The front brake disk/rotor broke.

2. The front brake master cylinder seized "ocasionally", without warning.


Sold that scooter with 1500 miles on the clock, after these repairs:

- Complete clutch assembly.
- Steering head bearings.
- New front brake disk.
- New front brake master cylinder.

I knew the bike would be crappy, I knew it would be "unreliable", fragile plastics, prone to breaking CVT belts, electrical gremlins, bad bearings, that I can deal with. Brakes not working when going downhill?

No thanks. That very same day I went to the Suzuki dealership and got my AN125.

[hugemoth]

Sounds almost as bad as my friends 2008 Harley.

Originally Posted by Süsser Tod

1. The front brake disk/rotor broke.

2. The front brake master cylinder seized "ocasionally", without warning.


Sold that scooter with 1500 miles on the clock, after these repairs:

- Complete clutch assembly.
- Steering head bearings.
- New front brake disk.
- New front brake master cylinder.

I knew the bike would be crappy, I knew it would be "unreliable", fragile plastics, prone to breaking CVT belts, electrical gremlins, bad bearings, that I can deal with. Brakes not working when going downhill?

No thanks. That very same day I went to the Suzuki dealership and got my AN125.