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Old 11-02-2013, 10:18 AM   #1141
ibafran
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Originally Posted by ibafran View Post
Yes. But, as kids, there was no instruction. We learned as a pure trial and error/stimulus response activity. Cognition of what we were trying to learn often got in the way of actually learning how to do it. Thus, some kids seemed to "get it" right away. And other kids struggled for some period of time. In the comic strip Calvin and Hobbs, Calvin struggles with learning to ride a bicycle while his Dad who does ride often is of no real help. Ask any kid who rides how he/she does that and teach it to a kid who does not ride for an example of frustration.

Some years ago, a guy was selling a vhs tape of how to teach a kid to ride a bicycle in about 20-40 minutes. I haven't seen it. but am led to believe that it works pretty well.

A cupple years prior to that "Bicycle" magazine ran a blurb on how tough it was to teach a highly motivated and well intentioned adult to ride a bicycle. The guy eventually learned. At the time it amazed me that that such 'experts' would not know how to do that?

My grandkids cannot ride a bicycle and seem to have no interest, wtf?

tbc
Nice one. Boon Boon. That exemplifies the current thinking on how to get the job done. I took the pedals off the crank for my grandkids to use as a hobby horse learning steering and balance. Their interest was less than stellar.

But, the bicycle riders still do not have the cognition to understand what they are doing. And that lack of knowledge prevents them from teaching the technique. Another poster noted that none of the non-bicycle riding students in the MSF class passed and that the skill was too hard to teach there. I concur as none such students in my MSF class learned to ride either. But, I didn't know then what I know now about teaching how to ride a bicycle. The bicycle is the cheap and less dangerous way of learning the skill which then can be transfered to motorcycles.

I know some pretty accomplished motorcycle road racers who do not understand how a bike steers nor how they do it for themselves. Their talent for riding is not diminished for that lack. But their ability to instruct is hampered.
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ibafran screwed with this post 11-02-2013 at 11:11 AM
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Old 11-03-2013, 05:26 AM   #1142
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Originally Posted by ibafran View Post
Yes. But, as kids, there was no instruction. We learned as a pure trial and error/stimulus response activity. Cognition of what we were trying to learn often got in the way of actually learning how to do it. Thus, some kids seemed to "get it" right away. And other kids struggled for some period of time. In the comic strip Calvin and Hobbs, Calvin struggles with learning to ride a bicycle while his Dad who does ride often is of no real help. Ask any kid who rides how he/she does that and teach it to a kid who does not ride for an example of frustration.

Some years ago, a guy was selling a vhs tape of how to teach a kid to ride a bicycle in about 20-40 minutes. I haven't seen it. but am led to believe that it works pretty well.

A cupple years prior to that "Bicycle" magazine ran a blurb on how tough it was to teach a highly motivated and well intentioned adult to ride a bicycle. The guy eventually learned. At the time it amazed me that that such 'experts' would not know how to do that?

My grandkids cannot ride a bicycle and seem to have no interest, wtf?

tbc
There is an app for that.
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Old 01-29-2014, 11:56 PM   #1143
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Old 02-01-2014, 05:12 AM   #1144
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I just wanted to say thanks for the discussion here. I've been riding for a couple of years and am familiar with the "push right, go right" mantra. I believe most riding schools in the UK teach that right off the bat, presumably that's mentioned during MSF over the states too.

What I picked up from this thread was the hint about pulling gently with the outside arm during turns. Perhaps I was subconsciously stiffening that arm before but I found that making that change had a big impact on my cornering skills - I can now routinely take corners 10mph faster than I was doing before.

I also believe that part of the improvement that riders see when trying out new techniques comes from raw belief - the feeling of "Well, that guy says this technique works so it'll improve my cornering too!" That positive thought helps them trust the bike a little more and lean in just that little bit further, corner a little bit tighter and, as if by magic, the whole experience really *is* better!

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Old 02-01-2014, 06:14 AM   #1145
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I actually am more of a puller, than a pusher when riding, don't know why, just how I always did it.
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Old 02-01-2014, 11:01 AM   #1146
David R
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I actually am more of a puller, than a pusher when riding, don't know why, just how I always did it.
I read in total control to turn with the inside arm. I tried it and found I twist both arms pulling and pushing depending on the situation using my shoulders.
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Old 02-01-2014, 11:25 AM   #1147
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I actually am more of a puller, than a pusher when riding, don't know why, just how I always did it.
When I pull I feel like I am moving a sail.
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Old 02-01-2014, 05:50 PM   #1148
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The best way I have found to show someone who rides, but doesn`t get it, is to learn while riding in a straight line in a safe place without traffic and plenty of room to play.

Take one hand off the bar (cover the grip, but not touch it) and very gently push or pull with the other hand. I will explain how to expect it to behave, and reinforce to be slow and smooth with the pressure, increasing the slight weave that results as it becomes more comfortable. Then put the other hand back and keep practicing. I tell them to just let the bike stand itself up if it gets too weird too fast, and then use less pressure, just pushing slightly harder than only thinking about it.

This helps eliminate the"lock up" effect some get when using both hands. Once they get it by doing a little weaving, progressing to curves is easy.
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Old 02-02-2014, 07:58 AM   #1149
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Originally Posted by scootrboi View Post
When I pull I feel like I am moving a sail.
Pulling makes me feel spazzy. Pushing allows finer adjustments.
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Old 02-02-2014, 09:58 AM   #1150
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Originally Posted by MotoTex View Post
The best way I have found to show someone who rides, but doesn`t get it, is to learn while riding in a straight line in a safe place without traffic and plenty of room to play.

Take one hand off the bar (cover the grip, but not touch it) and very gently push or pull with the other hand. I will explain how to expect it to behave, and reinforce to be slow and smooth with the pressure, increasing the slight weave that results as it becomes more comfortable. Then put the other hand back and keep practicing. I tell them to just let the bike stand itself up if it gets too weird too fast, and then use less pressure, just pushing slightly harder than only thinking about it.

This helps eliminate the"lock up" effect some get when using both hands. Once they get it by doing a little weaving, progressing to curves is easy.

i was told some thing close to that.

i was told to ride one handed and then push down on the bar and the bike will move . ie if you push the right bar down towards the ground the bike will go right. and if you push the left bar towards the ground if will go left simple.
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Old 02-02-2014, 12:56 PM   #1151
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Originally Posted by orangebear View Post
i was told some thing close to that.

i was told to ride one handed and then push down on the bar and the bike will move . ie if you push the right bar down towards the ground the bike will go right. and if you push the left bar towards the ground if will go left simple.
Push the bar forward, not down towards the ground. But otherwise, yes, simple.
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Old 02-02-2014, 01:28 PM   #1152
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Push the bar forward, not down towards the ground. But otherwise, yes, simple.
if the bars is pushed down they will pivet and it will turn easy. it means if you lean your body to the left and pushed the left bar down at the same it will turn left quick and easy.
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Old 02-27-2014, 11:19 AM   #1153
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Ok I got as far as page 12 and got a headache. I thought I was in the WTF thread

My question is if I am in a paved corner going to the right, I am leaned over as far as I can, my rear tire is not sliding, but i am going to fast and will cross the center line which I do not want to do.
Do I push with my right hand and pull with my left hand causing my front tire to start turning to the left and keep looking to were I want to go? Or just say fuck it and bail
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Old 02-27-2014, 03:39 PM   #1154
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Originally Posted by Skidding650 View Post
Ok I got as far as page 12 and got a headache. I thought I was in the WTF thread

My question is if I am in a paved corner going to the right, I am leaned over as far as I can, my rear tire is not sliding, but i am going to fast and will cross the center line which I do not want to do.
Do I push with my right hand and pull with my left hand causing my front tire to start turning to the left and keep looking to were I want to go? Or just say fuck it and bail
If your tires aren't sliding, then you're not leaned over as far as you can.
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Old 02-27-2014, 04:27 PM   #1155
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If your tires aren't sliding, then you're not leaned over as far as you can.
You can have all sorts of hard parts on the ground before the tyres start sliding. You are 100% on having a go though. Nothing to lose by trying, deverything to lose by bailing
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