ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Gear > The Garage
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 01-12-2013, 08:45 AM   #31
indr OP
.
 
Joined: Feb 2010
Location: mom's ovaries & dad's balls
Oddometer: 1,197
Quote:
Originally Posted by H96669 View Post
How about the bearing shells, could they be also mated to the case/crank? BMW does stuff like that.Someone somewhere found out how time consuming and expensive it can be sorting that out of 2-3 engines and boxes of parts.
No bearing shells. One side of the shaft has bearing that takes the set pin/dowel. The other has a bearing that takes a set ring.



Quote:
So...if we ignore the case damages for now would just pulling that pin out and installing a new one suffice to keep the oil where it belongs?
Yes.

Quote:
How big is that hole and is there a lip on the bottom, as in the pin not pushed down far enough to contact the case? Then maybe rig some kind of hammer puller, a small one and carefully bang it out.
~ 3.3 mm without the pin. There is a lip at the bottom that prevents it from going all the way the way down. It is contacting the case at the bottom. I don't know HOW that happened because the pin on the other shaft doesn't do that. There is about 2 mm of it sticking out. IE. the lip is high enough to have the pin not go in as much as it has in my case.

Quote:
Depending on how tight that pin is, can't be very tight if it walked in there? How did that happen anyway? If you pushed it in by mistake, then you'd know how tight it is.
Very tight. It'd be hard for me to take it out without cutting up more of the case.

Quote:
Maybe just roughening up the inside with the proper dremel bit and then installing a bolt/anchor in that hole could be enough to provide some pull.The proper bit probably wouldn't be in the accessories that usually come with them dremels.
The steel is apparently very hard. Even the spiral extractors can't get a hold.

Quote:
Now that you have that engine all apart, did you ever find out why it was knocking? Starting to look expensive, is that high milleage bike worth all that expense of time and money?

This is the bottom half of the crankcase.
During the valve change (about a year ago), the cam chain got hooked onto parts of this thing and broke off chunks.

A crankcase found fairly cheap on eBay is inbound.
indr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2013, 01:27 PM   #32
gsweave
Yinz, blinkers are on.
 
Joined: Apr 2005
Location: The Paris of Appalachia
Oddometer: 11,157
Its a little late.


could of tapped threads, inserted corresponding bolt and used a slide hammer and heat.



maybe on the next one.
__________________
"The Holy Spirit does not want you to be afraid of people, but to be wise and strong, and to love them and enjoy being with them" 2 Timothy 1:7
gsweave is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2013, 03:22 PM   #33
sailah
Lampin' it
 
sailah's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2005
Location: Turning expensive metal into scrap
Oddometer: 5,358
Is it just me or is anyone else saying why the fuck would you grind a journal away to get a dowel pin out when there are a half dozen solutions mentioned in this thread that would have worked?

First off get some real penetrant, tap it and insert bolt with slide hammer and yank out.

I'd be looking for a used engine at this point.
__________________
We're not out here to rough it. We're here to smooth it . Things are rough enough in town.

Nessmuk
sailah is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2013, 06:44 PM   #34
Ratski
Studly Adventurer
 
Ratski's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2009
Location: Eastern WI
Oddometer: 736
I gotta say, all the reccomendations of tapping the dowel, while a good idea, will not work. Dowels like this one are hardened steel, they are too hard to be tapped. That is why the bolt extractors aren't working, they are softer than the dowel. Trust me, I know. Not long after starting in my current position at work, i was chasing a 1/4 pipe tap hole in a block of hardened steel, before any thread cutting occurred I broke the tap clean off and we had to EDM it out.

If you try to tap that dowel, all you will succeed in doing is having to deal with a stuck dowel with a broken tap in it.

You said that the outside diameter of the dowel is ~3.3mm right, that means the ID is about 1.5 or so? Any tap this small is REALLY easy to break!!
__________________
1983 Honda CB650SC Nighthawk
1984 Honda GL1200A Goldwing Aspencade, a work in progress
1996 KTM 300 EXC Plated
Ratski is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2013, 07:26 PM   #35
sailah
Lampin' it
 
sailah's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2005
Location: Turning expensive metal into scrap
Oddometer: 5,358
He doesnt need to thread it, just get something in there with enough purchase to grab with a vise grip slide hammer. It's barely in there.

I would have welded it first, but thats me and I have a tig welder. I def would not have gone at it with a dremel and wrecked the journal
__________________
We're not out here to rough it. We're here to smooth it . Things are rough enough in town.

Nessmuk
sailah is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2013, 08:10 PM   #36
speedracertdi
Studly Adventurer
 
speedracertdi's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2009
Location: Hollywood, FL
Oddometer: 985
Wow talk about ham-fisted.
__________________
Roads? Where we're going we don't need roads.
-Doc Brown
speedracertdi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2013, 09:06 PM   #37
anonny
What could go wrong?
 
anonny's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2007
Location: Beautiful Revelstoke BC
Oddometer: 5,457
Wow this got expensive fast.
__________________
Kawasaki H1 build thread

71- 450 Honda CL re & re

Just another pathetic sheep following the herd

anonny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2013, 10:12 PM   #38
Mike Ryder
Kriegerkuh
 
Mike Ryder's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2003
Location: Peachland B.C. Canada
Oddometer: 889
Even I feel decidedly unsettled.
__________________
Yes I am quite serious.
Mike Ryder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2013, 11:37 AM   #39
docsherlock
Gnarly Adventurer
 
docsherlock's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2009
Location: BC, sometimes
Oddometer: 455
Well and truly fucked now - at least you got a second hand set of cases.

Blob of weld and pull or spark erosion would have solved this problem - for next time.

Or try an ezee out or tap and if that broke it's just easier to blob the weld on.....
docsherlock is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2013, 06:47 PM   #40
CaptTeach
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: Dec 2008
Location: Grenada - MS....... not the Island!!!!
Oddometer: 209
OOOOppppppssssss!!!!!
__________________
CaptTeach

96 Heritage Softail Classic
89 XT 600
71 CB 200 Cafe Racer
70 CL 100
63 Sporty XLCH
CaptTeach is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2013, 11:42 AM   #41
ohgood
Beastly Adventurer
 
ohgood's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2010
Location: alabama
Oddometer: 2,175
Quote:
Originally Posted by indr View Post
Here's my hasty fuck up with a Dremel.



The extractors are turning out to be too soft themselves to get a hold of the thing. Even with the sides heated up.

Tons of WD-40 was sprayed to seep into the sides to get it to even slide but it's not working.

I'll try again tomorrow.

Assuming that dowel is staying in there, I'm thinking:

1. Grind down whatever little bit it protruding.

2. Make a similar sized hole to the left of the saddle and put the dowel in there.

Something I want to re-itterate. All the dowel is doing is holding the outer race of the shaft bearing in place so the OUTER RACE doesn't spin. I don't know what the pressure is like when the crank case is rejoined, what if I used some gasket material on the saddle just before installing the shaft. Clamped down with the case shut, would that be enough to provide a force to hold the outer bearing from moving?
3mm or so hole in the dowel you say ?

i've made extractors (smalllll bearing pullers) that work great for small things:

imagine 1/2 of a nail, slip it down the hole, and move one way so the nail head catches the back edge of the dowel/bearing/whatever.

then another 1/2 nail, also slipped down in, allowed to catch on the opposite side of the back edge of the dowel/bearing/whatever.

drive a small (piano wire sometimes, yikes this is small!) down between them. this not only forces a LOT of pressure on the 'nail' heads, but also keep them from slipping and turning while you...

glue the assembly to a regular puller bolt. weld works too, but for tiny stuff weld can kill the elasticity of the metals. then, with plastic pads against the machined surfaces that matter, put a regular puller against the face of the case and begin turning (pulling) the screw. a little head, a little penetrating oil, and even 20 year old dowels will come free. patience is a virture.


i hope someone aritistly inclined can draw a picture, cause my explainations suck.



oh, just saw your picture. good lord, find a machinist, quick, and put down the tools ! (not an insult, a helpful suggestion) :)
__________________
Donkeys are flying
ohgood is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2013, 05:47 PM   #42
troidus
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Sep 2010
Oddometer: 12,083
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohgood View Post
oh, just saw your picture. good lord, find a machinist, quick, and put down the tools ! (not an insult, a helpful suggestion) :)
Too late for that. I dont' see any way to unFUBAR that bearing support.
troidus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2013, 01:57 AM   #43
Twilight Error
Going nowhere slowly
 
Twilight Error's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2002
Location: The Submarine Mines
Oddometer: 22,502
Quote:
Originally Posted by troidus View Post
Too late for that. I dont' see any way to unFUBAR that bearing support.
Find a good welding shop, add the lost material back with filler and re-machine to spec.

This, of course, will cost more than a full case in good condition.
__________________
If you're all about the destination, take a fucking flight.
Twilight Error is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2013, 09:57 AM   #44
ohgood
Beastly Adventurer
 
ohgood's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2010
Location: alabama
Oddometer: 2,175
Quote:
Originally Posted by troidus View Post
Too late for that. I dont' see any way to unFUBAR that bearing support.
i'm not so sure that piece is toast, looking again. that's barely half of five degrees of material. so long as the rest of it is round, it should wear just fine for a long time. is that portion directly in line with the stroke of the piston ? if not, it wouldn't bother me to run it as is.

you could even fill it and file it however you liked, to prevent stuff from getting in the gap and swarfing up the crankshaft.
__________________
Donkeys are flying
ohgood is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 03:31 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014