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Old 02-07-2013, 05:28 PM   #1
Dr Klaun OP
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Chevy Cruze "Clean Diesel"

Hadn't seen any posts on this, but was curious about the engine they'd be using (GM sourced)?

http://autos.yahoo.com/blogs/motoram...140108500.html

From th article:

"For the past decade, automakers around the world have vowed to bring a fleet of new cars to America powered by the same diesel engines popular in Europe and other countries. And for a decade, most of those plans were cancelled in the face of a tough buying argument for diesels in this country. The revolution may finally kick off this year if this car succeeds: the 2014 Chevrolet Cruze Clean Turbo Diesel.
The economics of diesel engines for cars in the United States don't pencil out as favorably as they do in Europe, where a supermajority of new vehicles come with oil burners under the hood. There, diesel fuel enjoys a tax break versus gasoline; in the United States, diesel fuel often costs 10 percent more than regular gas, with prices that fluctuate wildly. Tougher emissions rules mean diesels cost more here, and come with extra service costs; the urea tank used to treat exhaust gases in most models must be refilled every 10,000 to 15,000 miles or the car won't restart, a requirement of the Environmental Protection Agency.
As a result, diesel cars accounted for only 0.8 percent of U.S. vehicle sales in 2012. But with fuel economy rules pushing for ever-more efficient models between now and 2025, the industry expects diesels to finally catch on. This year, Jeep and Mazda will offer diesel variations of the Grand Cherokee SUV and the Mazda6 sedan, and more non-luxury diesels are expected in years to come.
Unveiled at today's Chicago Auto Show, Chevrolet says the new version of the Cruze powered by a 2-liter, four-cylinder turbo diesel will offer buyers 42 mpg on the highway and a range of 650 miles between fill-ups. With 148 hp and 258 ft-lb of torque, Chevy claims the Cruze Clean Turbo Diesel it's proper name, a bit of over-eager marketing will outrun its major competitor, the Volkswagen Jetta TDI, reaching 60 mph in 8.6 seconds.
The Jetta represents the best-case scenario for Chevy's offering of its first diesel passenger car since the 1986 Chevette. Older GM buyers still remember the debacle of GM's early 1980s diesels, renown for their unreliability. Younger buyers have shown a willingness to embrace diesels from other automakers; VW says its diesels account for 20 percent of its U.S. sales, and diesel variations of German luxury sedans also sell well.
With gas prices already rising well before the typical summer surge, the Cruze diesel may have arrived just in time. But Chevy will have to sell the Cruze diesel on its benefits, thanks to a starting sticker price of $25,695, about $2,600 more than a base Jetta TDI and $2,000 more than a top-line gas-powered Cruze. If Chevy can score with a diesel-powered version of its mainstream compact sedan, expect many others to follow close behind."
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Old 02-07-2013, 06:01 PM   #2
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Before someone else says it, get a TDI! Actually, this car should be interesting to see how it does.
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Old 02-07-2013, 06:04 PM   #3
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Come fall is going to be SkyD instead of TDI.

I'd be excited about the Cruze diesel, but Mazda's SkyD is much more interesting...

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Old 02-07-2013, 06:25 PM   #4
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People who are diesel shopping for the fuel economy are probably also interested in saving money on the car, too. Why force people to buy expensive option packages just to get the diesel? Put A/C in it and call it a day. I can live with manual windows and locks, vinyl seats, and no radio.
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Old 02-07-2013, 06:29 PM   #5
It'sNotTheBike
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vtwin View Post
Before someone else says it, get a TDI! .


There's a bit more to it than that, if you know about the evolution of various
VWAG TDI engines.


VW / Audi TDi engines sold in the US after the 2003.5 model year have various
issues which can result in VERY expensive problems. Blanket advice to "get a TDi"
leaves out significant information that a wise buyer would do well to avail himself
of before making a purchasing decision which may well prove regrettable.


I know a guy who works for VWoA -- his job is to travel around and solve problems
with cars the techs at local VW dealers are unable to fix. This guy is not just a mechanic,
he is the mechanic who solves problems when every other tech has reached the limit of
his knowledge and ability. In other words, this guy knows what he is doing. I will share
with you what he told me : "You do NOT want a current generation TDi".


The current generation TDi is the common-rail injection engine. By the way the
Pumpe Deuse ( PD ) TDi engines also have significant problems. Before buying
a VW / Audi TDi, do your homework at this website, with which I have no affiliation :


http://www.tdiclub.com/


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Old 02-07-2013, 06:42 PM   #6
It'sNotTheBike
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ko View Post
Come fall is going to be SkyD instead of TDI.

I'd be excited about the Cruze diesel, but Mazda's SkyD is much more interesting...

Ko


Agreed.

The Mazda engineers were really thinking outside the box when the designed their
new diesel engine. The low compression ratio makes use of urea injection unnecessary
and the engine seems to be a very well thought out design. Still, I'd avoid buying
a first-year production engine because there are always glitches which only appear
after cars are in actual use.


However, unless you drive a LOT of miles, fuel in the US is still cheap enough in most
of the country that a diesel doesn't necessarily make sense like it obviously does in
the UK and the EU where a gallon of fuel can cost in excess of $8 / gallon.


I did some math and compared my gas car to a TDI I owned and the much
higher repair and maintenance costs of the TDi pretty much canceled out the
economic advantage of the TDi's better fuel economy. So I sold the TDi and have not missed things like the
much more expensive timing belt job and the turbocharger vane regulation device
which sticks and dumps boost ( rendering the car about as powerful as a rickshaw ),
and the clogged EGR hassles, and so forth. The modern turbo diesel engine is a complex
high tech device and keeping them running right is a lot more involved than many mechanics
realize. So you need to connect with a mechanic who really knows TDis if you want
a happy ownership experience.


A gas fueled car like a Honda Fit or Toyota Yaris makes more sense in the US market than
a diesel does unless you drive lots of miles per year, or you want to be able to brag to eco-poseur
chicks about your fuel economy so maybe they will take you home and show you their braided armpits.


.

It'sNotTheBike screwed with this post 02-07-2013 at 06:52 PM
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Old 02-07-2013, 06:45 PM   #7
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Let me get this straight: The Cruze Diesel burns fuel that is up to 25% more expensive but gets the same 42 mpg that the Cruze eco gasser gets, and the diesel version costs thousands more to purchase. Got it.

Way to go GM. You've re-entered the passenger car diesel market for the first time in a quarter century and right out of the gate you offer no quantifiable advantage whatsoever for driving an oil burner. All you need now is a track record to rival your previous generation converted Olds 350 Diesel and you can kill the passenger car diesel market in North America all over again
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Old 02-07-2013, 06:48 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by troidus View Post
People who are diesel shopping for the fuel economy are probably also interested in saving money on the car, too. Why force people to buy expensive option packages just to get the diesel?
Why ? Because they can

VW has forced people to buy packages for as long as water-cooled VWs have
been sold in the US. The blame for this can be placed squarely on VWoA,
not on VWAG in Germany. VWoA has been run by one bozo or another for decades
and they have been doing stupid things since the days of the 1976 Rabbit. In Germany
you can order a car exactly as you wish it to be, but not in the US, where various
"packages" are rammed down your throat. Same goes for Mercedes, where in Germany
you can order a car with manual windows in front and power windows in the rear if you
like. Try that in the US and see how far you get.


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Old 02-07-2013, 07:01 PM   #9
It'sNotTheBike
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bueller View Post
Way to go GM. You've re-entered the passenger car diesel market for the first time in a quarter century and right out of the gate you offer no quantifiable advantage whatsoever for driving an oil burner. All you need now is a track record to rival your previous generation converted Olds 350 Diesel and you can kill the passenger car diesel market in North America all over again

Except for saving the jobs of GM employees, it was a mistake for the US government
to bail GM out. GM will continue to prove this is true and it will remain true because
the corporate culture of GM is infected with flawed decision-making methodology.
In comparison, look at the new stuff from Ford, where Alan Mulally came in and
kicked some ass and made some core changes in how things were done.


In the past GM was run by immoral men who made sure that there was no viable public
transportation in much of the US. If there is a place like hell those greedy corrupt
swine richly deserve to be there.


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Old 02-07-2013, 10:06 PM   #10
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The more diesel car options we have, the lower the prices of those cars. Seems to me.
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Old 02-07-2013, 11:05 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by troidus View Post
People who are diesel shopping for the fuel economy are probably also interested in saving money on the car, too. Why force people to buy expensive option packages just to get the diesel? Put A/C in it and call it a day. I can live with manual windows and locks, vinyl seats, and no radio.
Realistically, the number of buyers who want manual locks and windows, vinyl seats and no radio or AC are slim to none. A few fleet buyers and that's about it. I can't think of too many cars that you can even buy that stripped down. Maybe some fleet pickups, and the Jeep Wrangler (mine has manual windows and locks, but I do have AC).
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Old 02-07-2013, 11:37 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by discochris View Post
Realistically, the number of buyers who want manual locks and windows, vinyl seats and no radio or AC are slim to none. A few fleet buyers and that's about it. I can't think of too many cars that you can even buy that stripped down. Maybe some fleet pickups, and the Jeep Wrangler (mine has manual windows and locks, but I do have AC).
Fine. At least offer the engine in all trims and not just the highest one. I do think it's nearly criminal to not offer options carte blanche, though.
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Old 02-07-2013, 11:54 PM   #13
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The Automobile Magazine blurb I read had the Cruze at the same EPA fuel economy and a lower price point than the VW Jetta TDI. I heard it's also available with the Ford 7.3 Powerstroke, the best engine ever made that isn't a 22R or TDI.
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Old 02-08-2013, 07:22 AM   #14
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Beefed up front suspension with the 7.3 option
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Old 02-08-2013, 07:47 AM   #15
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Those little cars could really take off. With a little early buzz about really good fuel economy, in a car that's a really nice package (compared to the cheapened current Jetta), and dealers on every street corner, I think Chevy could get some good volume of cars on to the street.
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