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Old 02-14-2013, 06:29 PM   #106
UnsureFooting
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ill have to disagree with you there....
You can if you'd like to, but you'd be wrong. It's not an opinion thing, it's physics.
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Old 02-14-2013, 06:31 PM   #107
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Huh. My Sportster is not what I'd call "smooth" at any speed. It shakes at idle, and it vibrates the crap out of my hands, feet, and butt going down the highway. In fact, it is the shakiest bike I have ever owned. I guess the big Harleys are smoother, but I don't like em that big.
If you don't hold the front brake at stops it won't shake quite so bad. It'll still be paint-shaker level, don't get me wrong, lol.
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Old 02-14-2013, 08:26 PM   #108
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Originally Posted by Eye of the Tiger View Post
Huh. My Sportster is not what I'd call "smooth" at any speed. It shakes at idle, and it vibrates the crap out of my hands, feet, and butt going down the highway. In fact, it is the shakiest bike I have ever owned. I guess the big Harleys are smoother, but I don't like em that big.
What year is your Sporty? I know they switched to rubber motor mounts at some point; my '08 had them and was way smoother than my buddy's '96, which did not.
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Old 02-14-2013, 08:31 PM   #109
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My FXRP vibrates at idle and once I'm moving it has none that I can notice, very smooth. I also have very good brakes, maybe it has something to do with being a police model. Handles well, sits up tall with a 30" heat height and gets pretty good fuel mileage for a big bike, and......I still have never owned a Harley T shirt but then I won't pay $30 for any T shirt.
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Old 02-14-2013, 09:28 PM   #110
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Originally Posted by the kawasaki kid View Post
What year is your Sporty? I know they switched to rubber motor mounts at some point; my '08 had them and was way smoother than my buddy's '96, which did not.
Mine is an '08, too. Rubber mount, EFI, smoother than the older ones, but I wouldn't call it smooth. It's not designed to be smooth. Someone took a slice of an aircraft radial engine and put it on two wheels. That's about all there is to it.
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Old 02-14-2013, 09:40 PM   #111
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You'll fit in ...

Might as well fit in ... but it you're not interested in the status quo maybe you should go to a show, ride a lot of different brands and models and see which fits you, your lifestyle, build, comfort and pocketbook and then make up your mind. I have a BMW F650GS and a Honda Shadow Spirit 750. I have them because they both fit me ... Good luck, hope you find just the perfect bike for you Honda or Harley or Ducati or Yamaha or whatever - Cruiser? Sport Bike? Dual Sport? Trike? Spyder? Go for it
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Old 02-14-2013, 10:07 PM   #112
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Words cannot adequately describe the Harley experience. This is the main reason to get a Harley. Listen to the sound, and watch the whole bike shake. Sounds and shakes like a well built V8 drag race motor with a hot cam. You just won't get this from any other bike. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bQGvtW4c6Hw
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Old 02-15-2013, 03:23 AM   #113
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Jerry, I have to agree with you on this one. Not sure about your hint to a V8 drag motor (I mean, really...) but the Harley gives you an unique experience indeed.
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Old 02-15-2013, 04:27 AM   #114
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Originally Posted by JerryH View Post
First of all, I am not ATGATT. I would give up riding first, as it would no longer be fun.
Then an HD or cruiser is probably for you. My father for example swore he would never wear a helmet ever again once he retired and stopped commuting to a state that required one. After that he limited his riding to states that did not require the 'lid. He bought his 'bagger' new/leftover in 1990 and rode it for over 20 years until he 'retired' from riding altogether.

On the other hand, if you are a devout ATGATT believer, or even aspiring, there are far better options. Full face helmets and full suits detract from the HD/cruiser experience, in my opinion.
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Old 02-15-2013, 06:36 AM   #115
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You can if you'd like to, but you'd be wrong. It's not an opinion thing, it's physics.
Im no physicist and I havent spent a lot of time on a track, but enough to notice that the guys that are going really fast are obtaining a more significant lean angle than the guys going more slowly.

am I missing something?
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Old 02-15-2013, 07:28 AM   #116
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Im no physicist and I havent spent a lot of time on a track, but enough to notice that the guys that are going really fast are obtaining a more significant lean angle than the guys going more slowly.

am I missing something?
Yes.

The turning radius of a given turn at a given speed is a function of how far to the inside of the turn the center of gravity of the rider/bike unit. This can be observes by watching stunt riders or people doing tricks on bicycles. It is perfectly possible to lean the bike over and continue in a straight line, provided you keep the total center of gravity directly above the contact patch. This can be accomplished by leaning your body in the opposite direction of the bike. Similarly, if you shift the center of gravity toward the inside of the curve, regardless of the lean angle of the bike, you will initiate a turn. Fast riders on a track achieve significant lean angle, more than the slower riders, because they are shifting the COG further toward the inside. Leaning the bike is but one component, though the major one, of shifting the COG.

When riding a motorcycle with a relatively low COG, such as a big harley, and one with low clearance angles, such as a big harley, it becomes necessary to use your body more in the effort to shift the COG to ride at what is referred to as a "spirited pace" in some circles. This is because the COG of the bike itself cannot shift up and down, but only from side to side as you lean it. Think of it like a lever, with the contact patch being the fulcrum. The lower the COG, the shorter the lever, and thus more difficult to shift the COG inside the turn, away from the contact patch. (Edit: not difficult as in more effort, difficult as in the lateral movement of the COG is limited by the length of the lever) If you then use your body mass to shift it further, by leaning or shifting your body to the inside, ie hanging off, you can achieve a smaller radius, or faster speed, through a given turn with the the same lean angle of the bike itself.
This works because the COG must stay over the path of travel. When riding in a straight line, like in the example above using stunters, the COG stays above the contact patch. When turning, it shifts to the inside of the turn.

:)


It's actually far more complicates than this, but this is the simple version for persons not interested in physics.

:)
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Old 02-15-2013, 07:38 AM   #117
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interesting stuff - good read.

Im sure we could go back and forth about real world applications of lean angles etc etc but we are already pretty far off topic....

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Old 02-15-2013, 07:51 AM   #118
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Originally Posted by eatpasta View Post
Im no physicist and I havent spent a lot of time on a track, but enough to notice that the guys that are going really fast are obtaining a more significant lean angle than the guys going more slowly.

am I missing something?
You're taking his statement slightly out of context, and you're still right.
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Originally Posted by UnsureFooting View Post
You just have to learn to ride it. Going quick around a corner is not about lean angle, it's about where your center of gravity is. Riding one bike is not the same as riding another. Harley's and other cruisers require a different style to hustle them around corners... a more... active style, we'll say.
I believe he's refering to hanging off the bike, like you would with knobbies. Your bike stays more upright but your "center of gravity" moves further from the bike's centerline.
There's still not a chance in hell of going around a corner as quickly as sportier bikes. That IS physics. Getting your butt out of the seat helps, but it's a poor substitute for lean angle. The bike just won't carry the same centriptal force with less lean angle because your body weight outside of centerline can't make up for the bike's weight being at a higher angle, and your body mass AND the bikes are lower when leaned over.
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Old 02-15-2013, 08:01 AM   #119
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Originally Posted by JerryH View Post
Words cannot adequately describe the Harley experience. This is the main reason to get a Harley. Listen to the sound, and watch the whole bike shake. Sounds and shakes like a well built V8 drag race motor with a hot cam. You just won't get this from any other bike. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bQGvtW4c6Hw

I like Harley's a lot but stock Harley's don't sound much like the bike in the video. You need to at least change the cam, mufflers, and lower the idle to get that idle.
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Old 02-15-2013, 08:41 AM   #120
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You're taking his statement slightly out of context, and you're still right.


I believe he's refering to hanging off the bike, like you would with knobbies. Your bike stays more upright but your "center of gravity" moves further from the bike's centerline.
There's still not a chance in hell of going around a corner as quickly as sportier bikes. That IS physics. Getting your butt out of the seat helps, but it's a poor substitute for lean angle. The bike just won't carry the same centriptal force with less lean angle because your body weight outside of centerline can't make up for the bike's weight being at a higher angle, and your body mass AND the bikes are lower when leaned over.
Yup. I was speaking to hustling a cruiser round the twisties, though. My point was that lean is a consequence, not a cause.
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