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Old 03-04-2013, 06:19 PM   #31
AlsoRan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamie Z View Post
You did read that I have over 116,000 miles on my bike right? Factory fuel pump. Factory fuel filter.

The problem is that the filter is not easily replaceable. There are instructions floating around the web on how to bypass the filter and replace it with an automotive inline type.

But I can understand your hesitance. I'm going to have trouble trusting this POS after letting me down this one time.

Jamie


You put a $50.00 filter on it and you can figure about a 1/2 cent per mile for your next one at 230,000 mi! Amazingly reliable bikes.
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Old 03-04-2013, 07:19 PM   #32
Jamie Z OP
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Did the job today. Rode a bit more than 150 miles afterward. I think it's licked.

Not too hard of a job, but not simple, and sometimes tedious because I have to take off my engine guards to get the tank off.

Siphoned the fuel into a five gallon bucket. It was perfectly clean and clear. Pulled the tank. Removed the fuel pump. Easy. Disassembling the fuel pump to get at the filter was kind of a puzzle. A few screws and detaching wires. Make sure I remember where they go.

Got the fuel pump apart and using photos taken by Johnofchar at VSRI, I figured out where to drill the small hole. I was a little nervous, especially after I seemed to drill quite a ways and hadn't gone through yet, but I persisted and the bit poked through where it was supposed to. After drilling out the hole, a whole lot of gunk came out. Nasty black stuff, consistent with reports from others who made this modification.

Reassemble the fuel pump assembly and reinstall in the tank. Easy.

The hardest part of the whole job was removing the fuel line. One of the quick-disconnects is hard to reach and I had to fuss for a while before I could finally pull it off. Then just a matter of rebuilding that fuel line with the new fuel filter in.

Once I had it all back together, I cranked it over. And it cranked and cranked. And cranked. I thought there was something else wrong. Then, after long and repeated use of the starter button, the engine sputtered. And then it popped and fired. And then it started. And quit. Another press of the starter and it ran.

Yay!

The bike idled and revved up mostly pretty good. I let it idle while I put the rest of the bike back together.

On the road, there were some surging issues occasionally. I think there is still quite a bit of water in the tank, but I feel like after I run a couple of tanks of fresh gas through, it'll be fine.

A word about the water. How'd it get there? I noticed that the fuel filler hole had a bit of rust around it, and the rubber gasket on the filler cap looked like the beginnings of dry rot. It's possible that when it rains, it leaks into the fuel tank. In any case I plan to replace the rubber gasket and make sure the filler hole is clean and smooth.

Total cost: Fuel filter, $16. Fuel line, $10. Clamps, $10. And I think the job, from taking the tools out to washing my hands required about three hours.

Thanks for all the help!

Jamie
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Jamie Z screwed with this post 03-04-2013 at 07:34 PM
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Old 03-04-2013, 07:57 PM   #33
Flashmo
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[QUOTE=theloop;20865871]
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Just ride down to the burger joint and back, or what?

Sometimes Ya got to leave work on friday and try to make it to the campgrounds where the good riding is before it gets to late, but always seem to set up camp in the dark, or have to jump on I-75 to get across the Big Mac.
Burger King, I'll build a fire and cook over it.

Getting ready to cross the Big Mac.
NICE!
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Old 03-04-2013, 08:13 PM   #34
bwringer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamie Z View Post

A word about the water. How'd it get there? I noticed that the fuel filler hole had a bit of rust around it, and the rubber gasket on the filler cap looked like the beginnings of dry rot. It's possible that when it rains, it leaks into the fuel tank. In any case I plan to replace the rubber gasket and make sure the filler hole is clean and smooth.

Total cost: Fuel filter, $16. Fuel line, $10. Clamps, $10. And I think the job, from taking the tools out to washing my hands required about three hours.

Thanks for all the help!

Jamie

There's a drain tube that runs through the tank from the fuel cap area out the bottom. I bet that tube is plugged. When water can't drain this way, it'll fill the well around the gas cap and get into the gas.

Pop the gas cap and look for a little hole, about 6mm across, on the left side, where water would pool with the bike on the kickstand. You should be able to squirt compressed air through there -- it comes out the fitting on the bottom of the tank.

This happened on my Vee because some dipshit PO saw the drain hole and stuck a rubber cork in it.
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Old 03-05-2013, 01:30 AM   #35
Pecha72
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I'm going to have trouble trusting this POS after letting me down this one time.
Well, if your bike´s given you no trouble at all so far, and its done +110.000 miles (and even this time it was something that was at least in part caused by other things, than a real mechanical or electrical failure) then I´d be pretty happy about its reliability, if I were you.

Pecha72 screwed with this post 03-05-2013 at 03:10 AM
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Old 03-05-2013, 05:12 AM   #36
kitesurfer
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i had a ninja 500 with carbs. i was consistently pulling the carbs aND RUNNING a guitar string through the pilot jet. the alcohol gas absorbed water and left deposits all through the carb--in only a 3 week period! i went over and talked with my mechanic and he said the same thing was happening with injected bikes and described what just happend to you. his repair bill started at $500 for satock replacement of filter/pump. you may have a water problem from gaskets and seals but this alcohol gas needs to go away!
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Old 03-05-2013, 05:46 AM   #37
Pecha72
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this alcohol gas needs to go away!
Pardon me if it´s partly off-topic, but what exactly is the kind of "alcohol gas", that you guys get to (or have to) use in the States? And is it similar all over the country, or different states have different varieties?

 
(In Finland, we currently get fuel with either 5% or 10% ethanol... and I believe they want to raise the maximum ethanol amount to 15% in a few years.)
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Old 03-05-2013, 06:48 AM   #38
wos
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Pardon me if it´s partly off-topic, but what exactly is the kind of "alcohol gas", that you guys get to (or have to) use in the States? And is it similar all over the country, or different states have different varieties?

 
(In Finland, we currently get fuel with either 5% or 10% ethanol... and I believe they want to raise the maximum ethanol amount to 15% in a few years.)

Ethanol is what he is referring to. The alcohol breaks down quickly leaving behind water. there are products out there that stops or slows down this breakdown.
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Old 03-05-2013, 07:29 AM   #39
Boon Booni
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Ethanol is what he is referring to. The alcohol breaks down quickly leaving behind water. there are products out there that stops or slows down this breakdown.
It seems ethanol fuel gets blamed for everything, yet I have a '74 BMW R90/6 that sits for 4 months at a time, and starts right up the first or second try every time. Fuel lines don't break down, gaskets don't fail, jets don't clog and my fuel tank isn't full of water. Rarely is the bike put away with a full tank of gas. I think ethanol gets blamed for lots more problems than it actually causes.
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Old 03-05-2013, 08:09 AM   #40
Reposado1800
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It seems ethanol fuel gets blamed for everything, yet I have a '74 BMW R90/6 that sits for 4 months at a time, and starts right up the first or second try every time. Fuel lines don't break down, gaskets don't fail, jets don't clog and my fuel tank isn't full of water. Rarely is the bike put away with a full tank of gas. I think ethanol gets blamed for lots more problems than it actually causes.
Trust me. The ethanol is the devil's spawn. It is pulling dirt from everywhere plugging up filters and corroding everything else.
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Old 03-05-2013, 08:17 AM   #41
Jamie Z OP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boon Booni View Post
It seems ethanol fuel gets blamed for everything, yet I have a '74 BMW R90/6 that sits for 4 months at a time, and starts right up the first or second try every time. Fuel lines don't break down, gaskets don't fail, jets don't clog and my fuel tank isn't full of water. Rarely is the bike put away with a full tank of gas. I think ethanol gets blamed for lots more problems than it actually causes.
That's my experience too. I'm not a fan of ethanol, but I think a lot of people blame ethanol for things that it doesn't cause.

I've had bikes sit for several months, once in the heat of summer, the other time through winter. No fuel additive. Pulled out the bike after storage, fired right up. Ran fine.

Same with a '72 Pontiac I had. Put it away twice for about four or five months each time. Never used any additive. Car started right up both times. Didn't gum up the carb, nothing like that.

Not sure what happened in this case. Clearly something was wrong with the gas in my bike. I don't know if water seeped in, or it was condensation building up or what. But it's fixed, and today I filled it up with fresh gas and it continues to run fine.

Jamie
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Old 03-05-2013, 08:24 AM   #42
Boon Booni
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Trust me. The ethanol is the devil's spawn. It is pulling dirt from everywhere plugging up filters and corroding everything else.
I've currently got 4 bikes and that has not been my experience. My '74 CB350 and BMW get ridden the least, but my Transalp (when I had it), KLR (when I had it) Vstrom, and KTM all do their share of sitting (winter sucks). None of them has/had trouble starting or running after sitting. None of them have dirty filters, none of them have fuel tanks full of water. They all live in an un-heated un-cooled garage, and I don't use stabilizers or anything. Temps here in the winter are often in the 20's, and in the summer we get our odd 100+ days.

The worst I ever had was being out of the country for 13 months. When I went to start the BMW it ran poorly for the first tank of gas, then all was fine. My KLR started right up with a new battery like it has just been run the day before. I did fog the cylinders and put stabilizer in the fuel before leaving the country though.

I think ethanol gets blamed for lots more than it's share of problems. My opinion is that fuel breaks down faster on a motorcycle that's sitting outside. The carbs get baked in the day, then cool off at night and baked in the day again. That causes the fuel to evaporate and leave deposits behind. It's always been the case, long before ethanol. When I was a boat mechanic in the 90's we'd get all sorts of gummed up carbs on boats that had been used only a few months prior. They all sat outside, and they all lived under black cowls (guess what motors we worked on). Heated up in the day, cooled off at night.

Anyhow, that's my opinion based on my experience.
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Old 03-05-2013, 09:18 AM   #43
Pecha72
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Ethanol is what he is referring to. The alcohol breaks down quickly leaving behind water. there are products out there that stops or slows down this breakdown.
Yeah ok, but what percentage(s) of ethanol do you get in your fuel in the States?
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Old 03-05-2013, 10:23 AM   #44
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Yeah ok, but what percentage(s) of ethanol do you get in your fuel in the States?
Up to 10% in Texas.
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Old 03-05-2013, 11:37 AM   #45
mrbreeze
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water often gets into gas while it is in the underground tanks waiting to be sold. The tanks get old and develop leaks, and rain/ground water gets in.

I try to buy my gas at stations that I know have newer tanks. I try to avoid stations I know have older tanks, or where others who buy their gas there have discovered water in their tanks.

It's also a very bad idea to buy gas at the same time the underground tanks are being refilled from the truck. This stirs up whatever crap floated to the bottom of the tank, and makes it easier for the crap to get to you.

If I have to buy gas at some remote old station out in the country, I prefer a place that has the tank above ground. At least that way I can see it.
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