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Old 03-21-2013, 02:28 PM   #211
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Originally Posted by kraven View Post
I thought it was pretty slick how they used 3 cams.
But not as slick as the old flathead engines that used only two single-lobed cams to operate all the valves. The front cam operates both intake and exhaust for the front cylinder, and the rear does the same for the rear cylinder. all gear driven and very compact.

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Old 03-21-2013, 03:26 PM   #212
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Here's another slick cam drive setup for a V-twin; a single cam drives all four lifters and the pushrods are parallel:



More about the engine: http://thekneeslider.com/drysdale-godzilla-v-twin/

I like the "master-and-slave" connecting rods (like a radial aircraft engine) too:

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Old 03-22-2013, 04:11 AM   #213
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Originally Posted by Hughlysses View Post
Here's another slick cam drive setup for a V-twin; a single cam drives all four lifters and the pushrods are parallel:



More about the engine: http://thekneeslider.com/drysdale-godzilla-v-twin/

I like the "master-and-slave" connecting rods (like a radial aircraft engine) too:

I like.

All it needs is a radiator.
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Old 03-22-2013, 08:38 AM   #214
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I like it, without the radiator. Classic motorcycle engines should not have radiators. They have worked fine for over a century without them. What I specifically like about that engine is everything appears to be gear driven, no chains to break. As the owner of a bike with no less than 4 cam chains, I love the idea of a motor without any. I'm fairly sure that chain failure is what will eventually kill my motor.

And I have a Chevy truck with a small block that has an aftermarket geared cam drive. Fits right under the stock timing cover.

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Old 03-22-2013, 09:05 AM   #215
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Originally Posted by JerryH View Post
I like it, without the radiator. Classic motorcycle engines should not have radiators. They have worked fine for over a century without them. What I specifically like about that engine is everything appears to be gear driven, no chains to break. As the owner of a bike with no less than 4 cam chains, I love the idea of a motor without any. I'm fairly sure that chain failure is what will eventually kill my motor.

And I have a Chevy truck with a small block that has an aftermarket geared cam drive. Fits right under the stock timing cover.
You can get a much more efficient engine with water cooling. High compression with 87 octane is an awesome thing.
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Old 06-29-2013, 12:49 PM   #216
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You can get a much more efficient engine with water cooling. High compression with 87 octane is an awesome thing.
Then why does my air-cooled 1200cc Buell get 45-50 MPG, while the water-cooled 1125CR (1125cc) I had never break 35 MPG? Water cooling may be "more efficient" in terms of horsepower, but in terms of true thermal efficiency, not so much.
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Old 06-29-2013, 12:52 PM   #217
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Interesting interview with the Polaris Industry's VP of Motorcycles:

http://cyclenews.uberflip.com/i/139559/78

A couple of tid-bits: apparently they will eventually produce a Scout, and they may have other engine configurations in the future.
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Old 06-29-2013, 01:24 PM   #218
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Originally Posted by Hughlysses View Post
Interesting interview with the Polaris Industry's VP of Motorcycles:

http://cyclenews.uberflip.com/i/139559/78

A couple of tid-bits: apparently they will eventually produce a Scout, and they may have other engine configurations in the future.

Sadly he sees the Victory side as the "performance" brand of their operation, completely opposite of what Indian once was. I myself see Victory as the geezer side like Harley with their geezer bikes, Indian is a blank page that should lean to the hot rod side of things.
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Old 06-29-2013, 02:37 PM   #219
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Sadly he sees the Victory side as the "performance" brand of their operation, completely opposite of what Indian once was. I myself see Victory as the geezer side like Harley with their geezer bikes, Indian is a blank page that should lean to the hot rod side of things.
Couldn't agree more. The Indian moniker is associated with big brass balls and horsepower.
Victory has been trying to be the middle child running around shouting "hey, look what I can do!" for years now. They make a good product, but still haven't managed to hit a nerve in the market with a breakout product.

They should be the road couch division while Indian gets the heat.
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Old 06-29-2013, 07:34 PM   #220
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My opinion, as worthless as it may be, is, Polaris will dump tens of millions of cash into this venture... with scant little reward. They have been doing OK in this down economy selling ATV's and sleds, Victory doing well. The market for yet ANOTHER nostalgia bike is drying up as people old enough to give a fuck are dwindling in numbers. Soooo, after burning dumptruck loads of cash, it will fail as a business venture. Polaris may survive, but much weaker. Hopefully they won't wait too long to cut their losses.
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Old 06-29-2013, 09:18 PM   #221
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Originally Posted by larryboy View Post
Sadly he sees the Victory side as the "performance" brand of their operation, completely opposite of what Indian once was. I myself see Victory as the geezer side like Harley with their geezer bikes, Indian is a blank page that should lean to the hot rod side of things.
I'm young enough that Indian doesn't mean a ton to me - I'm happy to have the Indian represent nostalgia, because thats what I think when I see photos of old Chiefs and Scouts.

The idea that Victory is the performance brand is what kills me - they're just as heavy and lazily tuned as any other big twin, with some of the newer bikes being the worst offenders in the industry in terms of lean angle.
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Old 06-29-2013, 09:24 PM   #222
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I'm young enough that Indian doesn't mean a ton to me - I'm happy to have the Indian represent nostalgia, because thats what I think when I see photos of old Chiefs and Scouts.


I'm almost 58 and Indian was gone a couple years before I was born.....they don't mean much to me in terms of seeing many on the road, riding one, etc.

I think they will cover both bases pretty well though....nostalgia is built into the appearance of that motor, and it's design shows that it's intended to be a strong performer in the company it will be keeping.

I think they're going to do very well with it.
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Old 06-29-2013, 10:03 PM   #223
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Everybody pining for an inexpensive, performance oriented bike from Indian\Polaris will be disappointed.

Polaris has continually stated that Indian will be the heritage brand and Victory will be the edgier, more progressive brand. (205'd here by rider33, post 115)

You need to look no further than Indian's current print ad to get a vibe for where they're going.
If so I think thats a big mistake on Polaris's part. What polaris should do is dissolve the Victory line completely into Indian.

The Victory engine and bikes technically speaking are great. If they cosmetically redesigned those "Las Vegas gambler" themed Arlen Ness abortions to look like 21st century versions of bikes Indian may have built and gave them names like Scout, Crazy Horse, Tomahawk, White Buffalo, exc. I might actually consider buying one!

Again one of the biggest marketing problems for Victory 'aside form being Ness Abortions' Is the name Victory itself. To me, at least, Victory has never really found its own identity! And as a brand has always sort of seemed adrift. Thus, I ain't buying one.

But if it was INDIAN...

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Old 06-30-2013, 07:43 AM   #224
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Originally Posted by Glenngineer View Post
I'm young enough that Indian doesn't mean a ton to me - I'm happy to have the Indian represent nostalgia, because thats what I think when I see photos of old Chiefs and Scouts.

The idea that Victory is the performance brand is what kills me - they're just as heavy and lazily tuned as any other big twin, with some of the newer bikes being the worst offenders in the industry in terms of lean angle.
All Victory touring bikes....the Aluminum framed models, have some of the best cornering clearance in the industry. Not to mention the most suspension travel. If any newer models suffer from what you're saying, it's the Judge.
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Old 06-30-2013, 11:34 AM   #225
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Indian went out of business 6 years before I was born, and I have never had any interest in them. The old Chief is what I think of when I think of Indian, and that's what most people probably think of as well. Other than the Burt Munro thing, I've never heard of racing Indians, other than back during the boardtrack era.

As far as Victory, I see them mostly as choppers, with a couple of touring bikes thrown in. All those Vegas, Hammer, Jackpot, and 8 Ball bikes sure look like custom choppers to me. They are built strictly for looks. All of them have huge rear tires, just like the used to be Harley clone choppers. If they intend to compete with Harley, they definitely need to expand their model range, other than just changing the look of their one model slightly and giving it a new name. They basically only have 2 models, the choppers, and the touring bikes.

My guess is that the new Indians will sell, but in small quantities. Victory is the same way. Polaris does not seem to have a problem with this, most of their profit comes from ATVs, snowmobiles, and PWC. I wish they had stuck with the original V92C. At least kept it in the lineup. It actually looked like a motorcycle, instead of some kind of "custom"
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