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Old 07-01-2013, 08:37 AM   #16
Cat0020
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andoulli View Post
I want the best, safest, sportiest tire I can get for my two wheel vehicles.
Not likely to find yourself the best, safest, sportiest tire; if you are not willing to experiment and try them all.
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Old 07-01-2013, 09:43 AM   #17
andoulli
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Originally Posted by Cat0020 View Post
Not likely to find yourself the best, safest, sportiest tire; if you are not willing to experiment and try them all.
No, I'm willing to try different tires made to be mounted on my FJR or Silverwing, that kind of experimenting is fine with me. I'm not willing to experiment with dark side rubber, I'll leave that to those willing to take the risks.
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Old 07-01-2013, 09:54 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by andoulli View Post
No, I'm willing to try different tires made to be mounted on my FJR or Silverwing, that kind of experimenting is fine with me. I'm not willing to experiment with dark side rubber, I'll leave that to those willing to take the risks.
I think you're missing the point of conducting experiments.

Yet you suggest those who are willing to experiment to try something that's not designed for powered vehicle; IMO trailer tires are far more dangerous than car tires mounted on motorcycles or scooters.

At least car tires are designed for heavier load with greater power output vehicles than motorcycles or scooters.
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Old 07-01-2013, 10:02 AM   #19
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The performance of any bike will always be limited by it's weakest link. In many cases that would be the nut that connects the seat to the handlebar.

Most bikes are also limited around curves by their clearance. I have yet to own a street legal bike that didn't start scraping stuff before the tires ran out of traction. It seems that most darksiders are on bikes that don't have really great cornering clearance so the car tire won't be a limiting factor anyway. I don't think that a car tire will have much affect on braking. The biggest problem I see with car tires is that it will change the way the bike feels. I talked to a darksider this weekend. He had a car tire on his cruiser. He said that the tire did feel weird but after a few weeks he got used to it and then it felt fine.

Let's face it, if you ride a lot it's a PITA and also expensive to constantly be getting new tires. How many of you run other than really sticky sport tires. If you do, you are compromising "safety" for economy.

I'm not planning on becoming a darksider myself but I'm not ready to critisize them when I have never tried it myself. If I owned a cruiser that I put a lot of miles on, I might try it.
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Old 07-01-2013, 10:32 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by klaviator View Post
The performance of any bike will always be limited by it's weakest link. In many cases that would be the nut that connects the seat to the handlebar.
AKA, rider or operator.

"Not willing to try" hardly constitute as a factor that car tires can not outperform moto tires when mounted on motorcycles or scooters.

You don't have to ride conservatively when you have a car tire mounted on your 2-wheeled vehicle.

Just as any new tires mounted on your bike, take the time to learn how it behaves, handles and its limitations.

Honestly, how often does anyone scrap pegs or center stands on their bike regardless of type of tires mounted?

On my car tire mounted Burgman 650, I did it once about every other week.

On my regular moto tires CBR or Ninja, nearly never, because body positioning can compensate a lot of bike lean, and I don't like to spend money on replacing pegs.
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Old 07-01-2013, 11:20 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by Cat0020 View Post
I think you're missing the point of conducting experiments.

I fail to see the humor here?

Yet you suggest those who are willing to experiment to try something that's not designed for powered vehicle; IMO trailer tires are far more dangerous than car tires mounted on motorcycles or scooters.

I'm not suggesting anyone do anything, just offering trailer tires as a possibility, especially smaller scooters. If you think a 15 hp scooter could over power a trailer tire, fine, that may well be the case. Like I said you made a number of good points, you want to continue to ignore that, that's fine as well.

At least car tires are designed for heavier load with greater power output vehicles than motorcycles or scooters.
I'm done.
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Old 07-01-2013, 11:41 AM   #22
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I make good point most of times with my posts, if not all of the time.

But regardless how many good points I make, closed-minded people will be that, of course you're done.

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Old 07-01-2013, 11:49 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Cat0020 View Post
I make good point most of times with my posts, if not all of the time.

But regardless how many good points I make, closed-minded people will be that, of course you're done.

Now that was funny there, I see what ya did.
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Old 07-01-2013, 01:29 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klaviator View Post
This topic has been extensively discussed in other parts of ADV. Has anyone seen a scooter running a car tire?
Yeah, I've got one in my garage. Last car tire I used went 35,000 miles. (and still had tread left.) I am going to change it and try out a tire that has a crazy long tread life warranty of 80,000 miles. Using the car tire is like riding the scoot with a scooter tire squared off from wear. No big deal really, easy to get used to. You might notice the need for more turn input than the stock tire requires but after a while you don't even notice really. We humans are amazingly adept at adapting. It lasted about 6X as long as stock and was every bit as good at traction for turning/stopping, plus better in the dirt and wet conditions. The car tire is made in ways so that it can handle a whole lot more than I could EVER demand of it.

I pioneered the use of a car tire on the Honda Reflex way back in 2008. That was about the time when Silverwings and 650 Burgmans started going darkside too though I was not aware of that then.
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Old 07-01-2013, 08:02 PM   #25
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I've been running car tires on the back of my Valkyrie for a decade. I've made dozens of these videos because I wanted to know what was happening back there.

The Valkyrie doesn't handle any worse than it does with a bike tire. A new bike tire handles better until it flat spots, which on the Valkyrie takes a few weeks. After that the car tire handles better for the next 20,000 miles. The other difference is car tires don't delaminate and blow apart like Valkyrie bike tires have been known to do.

I may switch back to a bike tire next year because the Koreans are finally selling tires that don't cost $400.
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Old 07-02-2013, 01:13 AM   #26
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Michelin do a decent tyre at the moment, the Commander II for cruisers.
I tried a CT on my Vmax, but I never much liked the difference in rim sizes and shapes for the 15" rim in particular, it made me a bit nervous, so I took it off.
After running a Metzeler to the wire in damn near 2500km (it gets to 45*C here a lot), I looked at other options again. I went for the Commander II and it has done 3000km, and will probably do between 6000-8000km at a guess, 3 times the Metzeler life.
On my other daily rides I always go to a CT, as long as the rims are close in size between car and bike.
Maybe try the Commander II on the Valkerie if you want a bike tyre again?
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Old 07-02-2013, 06:34 AM   #27
Jaseun
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I bought a 05 Goldwing with a car tire already installed by the previous owner. I was very disappointed with the handling. Especially since so many revere the GL1800's 'sport bike like' handling. Bottom line is that I had to fight the bike to turn, EVERY TURN, fast or slow. It was especially difficult at slow speed maneuvering. The bike could literally stand on it's own vertically. It was constantly trying to stand up, much unlike how a motorcycle is supposed to.

I gave it about 1500 miles and put a motorcycle tire on the back that matched the front manufacturer and model. All was right in the world again. I finally got the handling I was expecting. The previous owner was one of those dark sider disciples. When I was looking at the bike he was going on and on about how much better the bike rides and how much safer he felt riding with the car tire.

I tried it, hated it and never looked back. -Jason
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Old 07-02-2013, 07:57 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bandito2 View Post
Yeah, I've got one in my garage. Last car tire I used went 35,000 miles. (and still had tread left.) I am going to change it and try out a tire that has a crazy long tread life warranty of 80,000 miles. Using the car tire is like riding the scoot with a scooter tire squared off from wear. No big deal really, easy to get used to. You might notice the need for more turn input than the stock tire requires but after a while you don't even notice really. We humans are amazingly adept at adapting. It lasted about 6X as long as stock and was every bit as good at traction for turning/stopping, plus better in the dirt and wet conditions. The car tire is made in ways so that it can handle a whole lot more than I could EVER demand of it.

I pioneered the use of a car tire on the Honda Reflex way back in 2008. That was about the time when Silverwings and 650 Burgmans started going darkside too though I was not aware of that then.
Nice post Bandito!

We met when you showed up at the "Scooting the Ozarks Rally" in Arkansas from Michigan (by way of Pennsylvania I think?) hauling a single-wheel trailer with your darkside tire mounted on your Reflex. That was the first time I had seen that fitment, and I certainly was a skeptic. After watching you ride our twisties here in the Ozarks, I certainly was convinced of the maneuverability of the CT on your rig. I'm on my second set of tires in a year on my 650 Burgman. You are so right about the squared-off rear tire on a big scoot. I flattened out my Metzler in two weeks on my 1,000+ mile run up through the cornfields of the midwest to Chicago last week. My Burgie really wants to stand up now, and I've got to scrape off the edges on our twisties now that I am back home. My next tire will be a car tire, I'm convinced it is worth a try.
Shameless plug for that rally: STO Rally).
Tim
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Old 07-02-2013, 08:23 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cat0020 View Post
I make good point most of times with my posts, if not all of the time.

But regardless how many good points I make, closed-minded people will be that, of course you're done.

Refusing to consider something reckless, imbecilic or worse...does not make one closed-minded.

It makes one asserting a conscious, reasoned choice based on the available facts as perceived.

Now, refusing those facts...does not make one open-minded. It makes one either ignorant, unable to consider the facts presented...or, in the end, it might make one open-headed.

I don't need to crash without a helmet to know it's not good for the skull. And I don't need to wreck with an inappropriate tire, to understand that I'd made a damn-fool choice in forcing it on my wrong-sized rim.
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Old 07-02-2013, 11:53 PM   #30
Cat0020
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Originally Posted by CaseyJones View Post
Refusing to consider something reckless, imbecilic or worse...does not make one closed-minded.

It makes one asserting a conscious, reasoned choice based on the available facts as perceived.

Now, refusing those facts...does not make one open-minded. It makes one either ignorant, unable to consider the facts presented...or, in the end, it might make one open-headed.

I don't need to crash without a helmet to know it's not good for the skull. And I don't need to wreck with an inappropriate tire, to understand that I'd made a damn-fool choice in forcing it on my wrong-sized rim.
How about "refusing to try"?

Is that closed-minded or not?

What 'facts' are you referring?

Fact that car tires are designed to handle heavier load and more power output vehicles than motorcycle tire?
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