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Old 07-12-2013, 11:02 AM   #46
gogogordy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brianwheelies View Post
This thread is way off topic. Jerry is 110% correct here. I went to get a Zuma 125 yesterday and this is what they handed me....


These people are scumbags. It's no wonder you never see product moving.

Hopefully enough people speak with their wallets to shut down places like this. They try to monopolize towns as well.

Back to the regularly scheduled Fly 150 3V!

Well, thats the stuff they'd LIKE you to buy...service contract? Finance charge? Last I looked those can be told "NO" to...

Dont buy the SC, and pay cash or go to your CU. Save a shload.

Part of the equation is being a savvy shopper. Can't fault a business for TRYING to put their hand all the way into your pocket, thats just capitalism.

Businesses aren't going to volunteer a smokin' deal...that's the buyer's responsibility and can be had without being a dick about it too.
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Old 07-12-2013, 01:39 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brianwheelies View Post
This thread is way off topic. Jerry is 110% correct here. I went to get a Zuma 125 yesterday and this is what they handed me....


These people are scumbags. It's no wonder you never see product moving.

Hopefully enough people speak with their wallets to shut down places like this. They try to monopolize towns as well.

Back to the regularly scheduled Fly 150 3V!
Ah, proof. This is what we have here for dealers. With the single exception of that one Honda dealer with a small conservative dealership. And they are trying to put him out of business. He has held on so far, but the new mandatory "destination charge" Honda is adding to everything is going to hurt him. Places like Ride Now do not want to be undercut by local competition. They have no interest in bikes, they have no interest in their customers. Other than their money. Their huge fleet of fancy dealerships (and the owners multi million dollar mansion) were built with ill gotten gains from ripping off customers for 30 years.

The manufacturers are a big part of this scam as well. Why didn't Honda simply add that destination charge, and any other non government fees, onto the MSRP. That way you would know up front what you were actually going to pay, and make your decision without having to ever go to a dealership and put up with their BS.


I actually think the days of actual dealers should be about over. Bikes could be sold online, or at factory outlet stores. I bought a bike online once, back in '07. It was an American Lifan LF200GY-5 dual sport bike. I got it for $1399 which included shipping to my door. Someone else here has 40,000 miles on one just like it.

On new cars, my local credit union has a deal where they actually buy the car for you, so you don't have to even deal with a dealer. And they get a lot better deal than a customer would. Then the customer either pays cash for it or finances it through the credit union. I believe Costco has a similar program. Unfortunately it does not include motorcycles and scooters.
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Old 07-12-2013, 03:03 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by gogogordy View Post
Well, thats the stuff they'd LIKE you to buy...service contract? Finance charge? Last I looked those can be told "NO" to...

Dont buy the SC, and pay cash or go to your CU. Save a shload.

Part of the equation is being a savvy shopper. Can't fault a business for TRYING to put their hand all the way into your pocket, thats just capitalism.

Businesses aren't going to volunteer a smokin' deal...that's the buyer's responsibility and can be had without being a dick about it too.
I will start a new thread about my experience later as this is really bad for the MO of this thread.

Gordy, I hope folks like this aren't in government. Crap! It's too late and we get screwed over because of it.
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Old 07-12-2013, 03:18 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by brianwheelies View Post

Gordy, I hope folks like this aren't in government. Crap! It's too late and we get screwed over because of it.
Brian.....waaay too late for that.
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Old 07-12-2013, 03:20 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by JerryH View Post
Ah, proof. This is what we have here for dealers. With the single exception of that one Honda dealer with a small conservative dealership. And they are trying to put him out of business. He has held on so far, but the new mandatory "destination charge" Honda is adding to everything is going to hurt him. Places like Ride Now do not want to be undercut by local competition. They have no interest in bikes, they have no interest in their customers. Other than their money. Their huge fleet of fancy dealerships (and the owners multi million dollar mansion) were built with ill gotten gains from ripping off customers for 30 years.

The manufacturers are a big part of this scam as well. Why didn't Honda simply add that destination charge, and any other non government fees, onto the MSRP. That way you would know up front what you were actually going to pay, and make your decision without having to ever go to a dealership and put up with their BS.


I actually think the days of actual dealers should be about over. Bikes could be sold online, or at factory outlet stores. I bought a bike online once, back in '07. It was an American Lifan LF200GY-5 dual sport bike. I got it for $1399 which included shipping to my door. Someone else here has 40,000 miles on one just like it.

On new cars, my local credit union has a deal where they actually buy the car for you, so you don't have to even deal with a dealer. And they get a lot better deal than a customer would. Then the customer either pays cash for it or finances it through the credit union. I believe Costco has a similar program. Unfortunately it does not include motorcycles and scooters.
Everything can be done online Jerry.
Even YOUR occupation....
YouTube. Nobody "needs" mechanic anymore.
Also, there's always someone willing to do what you do, for less then you do it for.

See what I did there? (don't bother to answer, I already know you dont get it)
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Old 07-12-2013, 04:36 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brianwheelies View Post
This thread is way off topic. Jerry is 110% correct here. I went to get a Zuma 125 yesterday and this is what they handed me....


These people are scumbags. It's no wonder you never see product moving.

Hopefully enough people speak with their wallets to shut down places like this. They try to monopolize towns as well.

Back to the regularly scheduled Fly 150 3V!
Wow looks like they ate your trade. This is more than I paid for my Zuma 125 without any trade and its not like I got a great deal. Not all dealers are completely up front on a lot of things. I have caught a few trying to eat my trades. One time I was looking to trade like 5 bikes for 2 and the deal was so complicated I had to take it all home and audit it. The math made no sense and in the complex mix of numbers it literally looked like they had stolen my trade.

I am glad not all dealers operate this way. Most of the ones around here are now out of business and the few that practiced it have changed.

Its not that they are being completely dishonest. Its all full disclosure on the form. A lot of those products are grossly overpriced though but if someone is willing to pay it then its not a crime. I do agree though that they should not offer these things unless a customer request it however in business they always put it up front first.

Back to the Fly 150!

Did a bunch of riding around today. I am now at 141 kilometers and I managed to stop by the dealer and picked up some Motul 5W-40 scooter oil and some Motul 75W-90 final drive oil plus the appropriate washers and the oil filter.

I had no problem removing the drain plug. Sometimes on new bike they were put on super tight but not this one. The oil filter however was on super tight and my tool for removing the Piaggio filters actually managed to strip the tip out on the filter. So a trusty pair of vice grips and some extreme force got it loose. The factory/dealer fill looked pretty good but it did have some silver looking swirlies in it. It was not really necessary to change but it did not hurt. The internal pre filter had a few metal flakes stuck in the mesh witch I cleaned off.

The final drive oil was perfectly fine and still light in color. Usually it darkens pretty fast and on a few bikes that first change even before 100 miles is pretty nasty. Only evidence in this oil was a small sheen of very fine swirls and maybe just a few small and benign chunks in the bottom of the bowl I drained it in.

Its of my opinion for future owners that it does not hurt to dump the engine oil early but not totally necessary. As for the final drive it was really not necessary at all and its easily good until 600 miles or 1,000 kilometers. After that you can probably go almost forever. Some say 2 years but I think 3 years is perfectly fine for final drive oil unless you hit the mileage interval first of coarse.

I also managed to stop by the gas station. From empty it took 1.1 gallons and $4.20 to fill up. I used Premium as I did not bother to check and see what octane they recommend but usually the European stuff requires premium so that is what I used. On the fuel door they have a warning sticker about not using anything higher then E10 and that E15 and E85 are No No's. No octane requirement listed though.

I did document the miles at fill up and will now ride it until its mostly empty. Probably try to achieve maximum economy without actually getting run over and see what it will do.

I tell you I am just amazed at how well this scooter runs. It climbed the 40 mph hill at 50 MPH no problem. On one stretch of road on Highway 2 the speed limit is 45 but everyone does at least 55 on it. I was doing 60 indicated (probably 52 MPH true) like it was nothing. I am pretty sure this scooter can handle short freeway runs and keep up with all but the fastest traffic.
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Old 07-14-2013, 10:03 AM   #52
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under seat storage

Longhaul747, congrats on your Fly 150 3v.

I presume from your user name that you are or were a pilot, so may I ask what is your height and weight? I'm trying to judge your reported performance of the Fly.
I have a favor to ask you. I like to use a 20" monopod with my camera, and I'm curious if it will fit in the under seat storage? I would appreciate if you would measure the length of the under seat storage. Thanks.

I was recently using the updated Google Maps and noticed an option to route for pedal bikes , this allows me to prepare routes that avoid the interstates. I realize that the Fly is legal on the interstates, I'm just not sure that it is safe. Seeing alternatives without using the interstate hwy. is interesting and fun. As an old guy who is retired, I have the time to take the long way.
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Old 07-14-2013, 10:33 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave92029 View Post
Longhaul747, congrats on your Fly 150 3v.

I presume from your user name that you are or were a pilot, so may I ask what is your height and weight? I'm trying to judge your reported performance of the Fly.
I have a favor to ask you. I like to use a 20" monopod with my camera, and I'm curious if it will fit in the under seat storage? I would appreciate if you would measure the length of the under seat storage. Thanks.

I was recently using the updated Google Maps and noticed an option to route for pedal bikes , this allows me to prepare routes that avoid the interstates. I realize that the Fly is legal on the interstates, I'm just not sure that it is safe. Seeing alternatives without using the interstate hwy. is interesting and fun. As an old guy who is retired, I have the time to take the long way.

Many routes for pedal bikes include interstates. Here in the southwest it is legal to ride pedal bike on the shoulders of freeways, but not motorized vehicles. There is a solution though, that I just recently found. I have always used paper highway maps and Mapquest to find routes, but you can do a lot better on Google Maps. http://advrider.com/forums/showthrea...=831961&page=6
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Old 07-14-2013, 12:16 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by Dave92029 View Post
Longhaul747, congrats on your Fly 150 3v.

I presume from your user name that you are or were a pilot, so may I ask what is your height and weight? I'm trying to judge your reported performance of the Fly.
I have a favor to ask you. I like to use a 20" monopod with my camera, and I'm curious if it will fit in the under seat storage? I would appreciate if you would measure the length of the under seat storage. Thanks.

I was recently using the updated Google Maps and noticed an option to route for pedal bikes , this allows me to prepare routes that avoid the interstates. I realize that the Fly is legal on the interstates, I'm just not sure that it is safe. Seeing alternatives without using the interstate hwy. is interesting and fun. As an old guy who is retired, I have the time to take the long way.
I just use the "avoid highways" feature - it mostly just takes out interstates and a handful of other divided highways.
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Old 07-14-2013, 12:59 PM   #55
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New routes to the same destination.

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I just use the "avoid highways" feature - it mostly just takes out interstates and a handful of other divided highways.
Thanks, I also do that, but the bike choice gives different routes. It's funny how my mind automaticly thinks about certain destination via a specific route. Change the route and that same destination is a whole different trip.

There are several different ways of getting from my home to ScooterWest w/o using the freeways, that look like fun trips, with lots of opportunities to stop and take some pictures.
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Old 07-14-2013, 01:41 PM   #56
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Originally Posted by Dave92029 View Post
Longhaul747, congrats on your Fly 150 3v.

I presume from your user name that you are or were a pilot, so may I ask what is your height and weight? I'm trying to judge your reported performance of the Fly.
I have a favor to ask you. I like to use a 20" monopod with my camera, and I'm curious if it will fit in the under seat storage? I would appreciate if you would measure the length of the under seat storage. Thanks.

I was recently using the updated Google Maps and noticed an option to route for pedal bikes , this allows me to prepare routes that avoid the interstates. I realize that the Fly is legal on the interstates, I'm just not sure that it is safe. Seeing alternatives without using the interstate hwy. is interesting and fun. As an old guy who is retired, I have the time to take the long way.
Aviation is another big hobby/interest of mine. I have my PPL and ATP once trained at United facilities when they were doing so and was current on the 737-300-500 and trained on the 747-400 but got grounded because of a bad back from a car accident and other minor medical issues. So other then private flying when I can borrow a friends airplane I am not not much into it other then getting my thrills from M$ Flight Simulator.

I am 5'11"tall and weigh 220 lbs. I find the seating position and overall comfort on the Fly 150 to be fine. I suppose compared to my Reflex and my SilverWing its not as roomy but definitely better then my Elite 110.

As for power so far it moves my butt around just fine. I have had it up to 100km indicated witch is likely about 52 MPH true and it felt like it had plenty more pep to go faster. I am sure you will eventually hit a brick wall with the Fuel Injection but I have not found it yet. As it gets more broken in I will eventually top it out at some point.

Today I was riding around on my Honda SH150i. For the record I found the SH150i both had more power and speed in most if not all situations. However its water cooled so that is probably the reason why. The Fly 150 is definitely quicker then my PCX 125. I manage to pull off 90 MPG on my SH150i. If I get better then this with the Fly 150 then its all good.

Tomorrow I am back on the Fly 150. It actually got berried in the back of the garage as I road other bikes this weekend. Under seat storage is fairly generous but not Elite 110 generous. I will get a measurement and pictures for you tomorrow.

So far really digging this scoot. It seems to have a lot of personality just in the way it runs and feels. No nothing bad it just mysteriously has more entertainment value then most of the Japanese stuff in the garage.
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Old 07-14-2013, 07:59 PM   #57
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it just mysteriously has more entertainment value then most of the Japanese stuff in the garage.
It's Italian, of course it does
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Old 07-15-2013, 09:58 PM   #58
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Road around all day today and it did not miss a beat. Seems to be breaking in nicely as overall smoothness especially at higher speeds is better and it seems to have more get up and go.

I did not get a chance to take pictures of the storage area but I should be able to get that tomorrow. I did get a chance to measure to the storage area. Its 23.5" in length by 11.5" wide at its widest point by 8" deep at its deepest point. However most of the usable depth is more like 6".

Only fit and finish issue I have spotted has to do with the left hand mirror. It really needs to be turned more forward about 1 inch or so. The way it is now forces you to push the mirror really far forward and not only is this unsightly but makes the mirror less useful. Thinking the lock bolt just needed to be moved a bit I removed the mirror myself. However that lock bolt is literally frozen in place. I put all I had into it and then some and could not break it free. I see some evidence of it trying to be adjusted before without success. Likely during the prep process. I am thinking the mirror needs to be replaced along with that lock bolt under warranty if it can't be fixed. So tomorrow I will stop by the selling dealer and see if they can fix it and if not get it replaced under warranty.
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Old 07-16-2013, 05:39 AM   #59
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Originally Posted by longhaul747 View Post
Road around all day today and it did not miss a beat. Seems to be breaking in nicely as overall smoothness especially at higher speeds is better and it seems to have more get up and go.

I did not get a chance to take pictures of the storage area but I should be able to get that tomorrow. I did get a chance to measure to the storage area. Its 23.5" in length by 11.5" wide at its widest point by 8" deep at its deepest point. However most of the usable depth is more like 6".

.
Thank you! The size of the storage will hold my camera, lens, and the monopod. Wonderful news. I appreciate that you took the tme to measure the storage for me.
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Old 07-16-2013, 10:38 AM   #60
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Thank you! The size of the storage will hold my camera, lens, and the monopod. Wonderful news. I appreciate that you took the tme to measure the storage for me.
Here is some pictures to help you better decide. Overall pretty generous amount of storage space. Its not as great as the Elite 110 but far more generous then most scooters in this class.

Under seat storage area. Good but lots of bumps could make loading some things more difficult then it should. Typical scooter though!



Pretty good and generous glove box. Its also the location of the battery. Dealer installed battery tender cable as standard. They said they got tired of people coming back 6 months later with a dead battery and getting mad at them. So they just put the cable on during the prep process. The glove box is locked and you access it by inserting the key into the ignition and pushing it in and the door pops open.



Not storage but I also took a shot of the gas door. Placing the gas tank in this area allows for maximum storage under the seat. It is a bit tough on the back (if you have a bad one) to fill but I manage. Its not as low as my Elite 110 witch is located in the back part of the floor board.



I am now about to head off to the dealer so they get fix the mirror. I tried last night and that sucker is pretty messed up. The locking bolt won't budge so you can find the proper place for the mirror to seat. My guess is they will have to warranty a new mirror but maybe they can fix it. You can see the 14MM bolt parts all chewed up. For the record they were a bit chewed up before I touched it. So they tried to fix it during PDI but could not.

I mentioned it once before delivery but they did not touch it. I figured I could just tweak it myself until I found the problem. Its a safety issue so it will need to be addressed.

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