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Old 08-16-2013, 07:24 AM   #46
byron555
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500 vs larger

Quote:
Originally Posted by MookieBlaylock View Post
if the weight difference were substantial between a 500 and 750 it would be ok but it wouldnt be much different and end up being slower than the old at. Bike needs a nice modern smooth torquey v twin with a 100 hp and in the lower 400 lbs range with topflight suspension . But this is honda so it will be nothing like that
My thoughts about the 500 mill is it's architecture is more compact than the nc 700 mill. Also by using a budget suspension on the base version but designing the triples and rear suspension to directly accept a suspension and wheels (maybe even swing-arm) from a CRF450f means that those who want/need the expense of a topflight suspension can add it, or Honda can easily offer it in an "R" model. Same wheels makes "ebay" replacements a breeze.

Also in this size, it is easier to relate it (marketing wise) to the Dakar CRF450. Hell they could even offer a limited run 450 Dakar HRC version.

I guess the African Twin name may not suit the bike I have in mind. But to each their own
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Old 08-16-2013, 09:12 AM   #47
Paulvt1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Two Plugs View Post
From www.VCI-forum.com (picture is included there under 'Honda News')
Very interesting development Bernard.

If true then it could be priced quite reasonably if it uses the XL 1000 motor.
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Old 08-16-2013, 09:25 AM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Two Plugs View Post
From www.VCI-forum.com (picture is included there under 'Honda News')
Where exactly? Show us!

Rgds,
D
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Old 08-16-2013, 11:02 AM   #49
MookieBlaylock
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Old 08-16-2013, 12:46 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MookieBlaylock View Post
Bike needs a nice modern smooth torquey v twin with a 100 hp and in the lower 400 lbs range with topflight suspension . But this is honda so it will be nothing like that
I'd be happy with ~80-85 hp if they keep the weight down, that's plenty for a ~400lb bike. I'd like to see a focus in good suspension, balance & handling, and practical service intervals.
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Old 08-16-2013, 05:50 PM   #51
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If this is true and they release an AT that is basically just a Varadero, all hope will be lost for Honda. To take the memory of the original AT and bastardize it like that would prove once and for ever that the idiots running Honda are a bunch of brain dead, crack smoking fools.
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Old 08-16-2013, 06:11 PM   #52
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Another negative for basing a new AT on the Varadero motor is MPG. Currently, the fuel injected Varadero motor only delivers about 41 mpg in US gallons. Just because BMW and Yamaha are making 1200cc+ Tractors doesn't mean that's what you should do too, Honda .
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Old 08-16-2013, 06:16 PM   #53
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The market doesn't really need another bloated 500lb+ "adventure-style" bike. The Wee already has that covered nicely in the US. The XT660 Tenere has it covered fine overseas. Honda already offers the Varadero in some markets.

Honda needs to make an EFI twin with similar-or-better power compared to the Wee, smoothness, 2up comfort, lighting, stator output, and optional ABS...but about 50-100lb lighter, with real (or easily-swappable) suspension, and 21/18 or 21/17 wheels. Spoked and tubeless would be awesome, but I don't even really mind tubes. I'd even pay extra for a CB500X with options like that.

A CB500X ABS, with adjustable suspension, skid, and 21/18 wheels, would get me into the dealership if it was still in the same realm of pricing. The video of the CB500X with dirt wheels/knobs, on the trail, got me psyched.
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Old 08-16-2013, 06:18 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kommando View Post
A CB500X ABS, with adjustable suspension, skid, and 21/18 wheels, would get me into the dealership if it was still in the same realm of pricing. The video of the CB500X with dirt wheels/knobs, on the trail, got me psyched.
This for me too
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Old 08-16-2013, 06:20 PM   #55
GrahamD
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorCalTA View Post
If this is true and they release an AT that is basically just a Varadero, all hope will be lost for Honda. To take the memory of the original AT and bastardize it like that would prove once and for ever that the idiots running Honda are a bunch of brain dead, crack smoking fools.
That pic above was around as an arty version of the 450 Dakar bike. But yes it may have been meant for something else.

It also looks like it uses either 17 / 19 or 19/21. The last combo is a bit weird isn't it as regards tire choice?

So that means 17 / 19. So if it is based on the 1000cc Veradero it MAY be a warmed up Veradero. It may be more off road oriented. It may be a more dirty V-Strom. 1000cc is probably a bit big to be a direct AT replacement.

Wait and see. It may not be anything like the press leaks.

If it is really a new proper AT, I would guess it will be run in small numbers, as there is no real reason for it to exist other than a small group of enthusiasts. If that is the case It will be a toe in the water model to see how many enthusiasts actually give a big enough shit to pony up the required money for a small run model.
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Old 08-17-2013, 01:24 AM   #56
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A CB500X ABS, with adjustable suspension, skid, and 21/18 wheels, would get me into the dealership if it was still in the same realm of pricing. The video of the CB500X with dirt wheels/knobs, on the trail, got me psyched

Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinJake View Post
This for me too
It is interesting!

Sorry about size of pic.

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Old 08-17-2013, 08:46 AM   #57
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Now THAT would be a nice "new" AT.
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Old 08-17-2013, 11:39 AM   #58
RaY YreKa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paulvt1 View Post
Very interesting development Bernard.

If true then it could be priced quite reasonably if it uses the XL 1000 motor.
The problem with that motor is that it was built when fuel was cheaper; being from the old Firestorm, I hear 33mpg imperial is normal.

And the only guys I see on varaderos are big; really big.
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Old 08-17-2013, 12:38 PM   #59
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I would rephrase it: "the hope lost will not be regained".
hate to be so pessimistic but they are just off my radar in a big way.
the local Honda dealer looks like a ghost town on weekends.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by NorCalTA View Post
If this is true and they release an AT that is basically just a Varadero, all hope will be lost for Honda. To take the memory of the original AT and bastardize it like that would prove once and for ever that the idiots running Honda are a bunch of brain dead, crack smoking fools.
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Old 08-17-2013, 01:16 PM   #60
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Given the way that Honda has been pounding out new product, I believe this new Africa Twin is something we'll see. There sure are a lot of good bikes to choose from.
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