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Old 07-25-2013, 07:19 AM   #166
JimVonBaden
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slartidbartfast View Post
Honda was offering complete or partial reimbursement for some courses at one point - I think they were offering $100 toward the MSF BRC, which in Louisiana would cover the entire course. I'm a bit fuzzy on the details and it may have been Goldwing-related, I don't recall exactly, but it's certainly not true that no manufacturers ever offer free or subsidized training.
Was that Honda, or an isolated local dealer or chain?

Doesn't matter, it is not a regular thing with any company other than HD from what I have seen.

Jim
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Old 07-25-2013, 07:30 AM   #167
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimVonBaden View Post
Was that Honda, or an isolated local dealer or chain?

Doesn't matter, it is not a regular thing with any company other than HD from what I have seen.

Jim

I remember one of the Japanese manufactures were offering reimbursement for MSF class with a first bike purchase, I want to say it was Kawasaki or Suzuki. this was back in the 90s....It was definitely a manufacturer program not the dealer.
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Old 07-25-2013, 07:40 AM   #168
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Originally Posted by Offcamber View Post
I remember one of the Japanese manufactures were offering reimbursement for MSF class with a first bike purchase, I want to say it was Kawasaki or Suzuki. this was back in the 90s....It was definitely a manufacturer program not the dealer.
Anything recent?

Jim
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Old 07-25-2013, 07:41 AM   #169
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All of the rider clubs offer some sort of reimbursement, not much typically.

A quick google search came up with this info from a Boston area riding school:

Quote:
HONDA
Honda Rider Club, 800-847-HRCA (4722), reimburses up to $75.00 of tuition of a Boston area class with a paid membership. Membership is included with the purchase of new vehicle, or can be obtained for an annual membership of $39.95 for used vehicles. You will need to provide a VIN (Vehicle Identification Number). HRCA will reimburse you each time that you successfully complete course.
KAWASAKI
Kawasaki Good Times Owner Club 800-433-GTOC (4862) reimburses up to $50.00 of tuition for an annual membership of $35.00. GTOC applies to new and used bikes. You will need to provide a VIN.
HARLEY DAVIDSON
Harley Owners Group, HOG, provides up to $50.00 HOG dollars which may be used for purchasing HOG merchandise or for Harley Davidson Motor Clothes from Boston area dealerships.
YAMAHA
Yamaha (800 962 7926) provides a $50.00 US Savings Bond for Boston area MSF course tuition when you purchase a new bike from a Boston area dealer.
From This Site

They reference Boston, but I'm certain it applies to anywhere as long as the Club recognizes the curriculum.
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Old 07-25-2013, 08:13 AM   #170
JimVonBaden
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Originally Posted by dazeedmonds View Post
All of the rider clubs offer some sort of reimbursement, not much typically.

A quick google search came up with this info from a Boston area riding school:



From This Site

They reference Boston, but I'm certain it applies to anywhere as long as the Club recognizes the curriculum.
Not really much incentive there when many of the club dues are more than the incentives offered, you have to belong to a club, or you get "Hog Dollars" so you are forced to spend the full amount, then get a discount of apparel.

If the dealers/clubs/manufacturers really gave a shit about rider competancy they would pay for the classes instead of promoting themselves in the guise of rider safety.

Jim
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Old 07-25-2013, 08:24 AM   #171
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Originally Posted by rocker59 View Post
How is it manipulation when the dealer sells what the customer is buying?
I fully agree.

I actually did a sales no-no two months ago when I tried to change the customer's mind on what he had come in to buy. Frail 91 year old man (probably 5 foot 2 inches high, and very possibly 100 pounds) and his not much younger wife. He wanted one more new car before the inevitable end, and his wife suggested he go back to a two-door coupe like the ones he always used to have.

Now I saw their limitations in his height, in pulling themselves up out of and getting into the car, and even with the weight of the much bigger doors, but a sports car is what he wanted. I took about an hour of trying to persuade him into a small SUV that is MUCH easier to get in and out of, much easier for them to see around them in traffic, and for various other reasons... but the answer was 'No'.

Add to that that this gentleman, when we finally picked a car out, refused to let anyone drive it. Problem being that this style and engine size was at our other dealership, and we had planned on driving it to this dealership - which would put about 40 miles on a car that had 3 miles on it. Since he had already beaten us up so badly on price there just wasn't money left over for a tow (seriously - he had spent hours negotiating this deal and damn near having a heart attack over it), the only other option available that night was that coupe model he had test driven that had a much larger engine in it.

He knew he should go for the smaller engine, but here was a car with everything he wanted, sans the smaller engine, and no one else had ever test driven it before he did that evening... so we spent another two hours negotiating the price of that car.

One month later his wife suffered a medical emergency, and he showed up at the dealership telling me that he had made a mistake buying the two door car, and could he now trade it in (it was a lease) on a four door car? His daughter had flown down to be with her family and, upon me suggesting the small SUV again, she completely agreed since it would be so much easier for her mother to get in and out of... but again, he disagreed and went for the four door version of the coupe he had bought.

Now I have the utmost respect for this customer, and feel very bad about what happened with his wife, but he made two bad choices IMHO that I (and even another salesman) tried to steer him clear of.

---------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andyvh1959 View Post
As to sales pressure at HD dealers? I had a new rider/student few years back. The man was near 80. Never ridden. Give him credit for wanting to still ride his dream, but he could barely handle our 250cc bikes and he did not complete the class. He was taking the class to prepare to ride his brand new HD that he had already bought at a local HD dealer. That, to me, is sales manipulation of a customer. That was not the only instance of this type of sales that I have seen.
Moral of the story is, Andy, that there isn't much dealerships can do since we aren't family, and since buyers won't listen to us either. At times - even as a nothin' fancy car dealer - we're here to make people's dreams come true, just like Harley is, and here in America people are going to buy what they want to. If their dream includes owning, but not really using, said item, then so be it. Many a motorcyclist doesn't ever get anywhere near the use of their bike that I would get out of it - so to me they aren't really able to 'use' that bike despite them covering miles with it. Should they have not been sold that sports bike then?
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Old 07-25-2013, 08:42 AM   #172
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We don't know what conversations the guy had with the salesman......the story says he visited the dealership often so I'm guessing he had some relationship with the dealership. I'm thinking this guy was pretty set on what he wanted to buy and no salesman was going to talk him into anything else. For all we know they suggested he take a class. This wasn't a 17 year old buying a Busa..
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Old 07-25-2013, 09:24 AM   #173
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That won't stop a dealer from selling you the bike and letting you ride away without a m/c endorsement. It's admirable that you'd be willing to do some impromtu training before letting someone leave on a bike, but by even opening that door you're sticking your neck out in a big way. "Training" someone without a license and letting them leave on the bike is probably the worst possible scenario from a liability perspective. The requirements for a m/c endorsement might be a joke in most states, but it's the legal green light as determined by the state, not by an individual with an opinion of someone's riding ability.

My policy was no endorsement, you don't leave on the bike, period. I'll deliver it for you, or you can have a friend with an endorsement ride away with it. If he rides it a block away and and turns it over to you, then you're his problem, but you're not leaving on a bike I sell you without an endorsement. I don't need someone's injury or death on my conscience just because it might interfere with a deal or be an inconvenience. On top of the moral issue, it's just a really stupid business practice, and it's a lot easier to go broke in the motorcycle business than it is to make money, and there's no reason to add to the mountains of liability that already exist in the industry without laying traps for yourself.





Quote:
Originally Posted by DAKEZ View Post
I get to know something about my customers. If they didn't ride in I make damn sure they know how to ride out.

Here in Oregon they at least force you to take the Basic Rider course to get your license.
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Old 07-25-2013, 09:28 AM   #174
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If the bitch would have let him ride forty years ago he would have known how to do it by now.
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Old 07-26-2013, 03:59 AM   #175
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Originally Posted by JimVonBaden View Post
Was that Honda, or an isolated local dealer or chain?

Doesn't matter, it is not a regular thing with any company other than HD from what I have seen.

Jim
As of 2011 (when I got my CBR250), Honda (the company) offered a $100 rebate check if you took the MSF BRC within X number of days or months. You had to sign up with the Honda Rider's Club, which is free. Not a whole heck of a lot but would cover almost all the MSF fees here in VA.

Speaking of dealers, in VA it's a wildcard. MOST dealers are going to try to register your bike for you as they can charge several hundred bucks plus the state required fees and taxes. All just for them to fill out a form that you can otherwise do yourself at the DMV. As a result, they're required to get proof of insurance and license, though you don't have to have a motorcycle endorsement for them to plate the bike.

I did buy one motorcycle from a dealer who flat out asked if I wanted to save some cash and register it myself -- which I did -- as well as knock some money off the MSRP AND comped me for the freight charges. All without me even beginning to negotiate. In that case, he just gave me a 30 day temp tag and never bothered to check insurance or license.

That same dealer had one rider buy a new ZX and proceed to gun it down their parking lot, across the road, up the neighboring hill and land on top of a car amongst other stories.
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Old 07-30-2013, 05:55 PM   #176
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Oh, I agree the "customer is never wrong" is the biggest line of BS in sales. Very often the customer is completely wrong, but a good sales person realizes when the customer has the purchase in their mind and done, not much you can do about it.

But some sales are flat out wrong in my book. Maybe I just have not been in floor sales long enough to get over it.

My main job is hydraulic hose and connector sales to large OEMs. Totally different kind of sales because it involves logic, reason, cost effectiveness, contracts, etc. Floor sales, especially motorcycles, deals mostly with emotional sales.
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Old 08-01-2013, 11:20 AM   #177
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Originally Posted by Offcamber View Post
I remember one of the Japanese manufactures were offering reimbursement for MSF class with a first bike purchase, I want to say it was Kawasaki or Suzuki. this was back in the 90s....It was definitely a manufacturer program not the dealer.
BMW currently offers $500 toward gear if you take a course shortly before purchasing a new bike.

http://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/us/en/...ide_Smart.html

There is no restriction AFAIK on previous rider experience. I've been eyeing an F800GS at the local dealer and the sales guy clued me in on how to get some gear upgrades in the process.
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Old 08-01-2013, 11:21 AM   #178
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Originally Posted by k5mitch View Post
BMW currently offers $500 toward gear if you take a course shortly before purchasing a new bike.

http://www.bmwmotorcycles.com/us/en/...ide_Smart.html

There is no restriction AFAIK on previous rider experience. I've been eyeing an F800GS at the local dealer and the sales guy clued me in on how to get some gear upgrades in the process.
How much is the class?

Jim
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Old 08-01-2013, 11:22 AM   #179
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Its the MSF BRC

The local community college offers it for about $120 or so.
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Old 08-01-2013, 11:52 AM   #180
JimVonBaden
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Originally Posted by k5mitch View Post
Its the MSF BRC

The local community college offers it for about $120 or so.
So it is really $380 savings on gear. Sounds like a typical promotion, but with a twist.

Jim
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