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Old 07-18-2013, 07:05 PM   #76
blk-betty
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedShark View Post
You seem rather focused on the meth...

Would a year's safe operation of a sub-50hp bike be too onerous ?

It certainly would never pass any legislature that doesn't require a simple helmet to be worn, so don't lose any sleep over it - not that you need much with all that crank you've got.
So is your idea of a tiered system based on hp, bike weight, both?

HDs weigh a ton but make little hp. A light weight sub 50hp standard will likely get one in more trouble faster than a 65 hp 700 lb HD. The biggest problem new riders have with their ginormous HDs is dropping them in the parking lot.

BTW, I had lots of bikes when I was a kid. In my experience its those of us who rode dirt as kids that are the better riders as adults and not the guy who started riding at 30+ who took a few riding classes.
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Old 07-18-2013, 07:05 PM   #77
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G$, I'm not following your "logic" at all. I'd start with trying to form complete sentences and work from there.

How do dead riders help the sport ? Would you recommend a large or small bike for a non-rider ?

Black Betty, I really don't HAVE an idea for tiers - and they'd never pass in the US anyway, so why even bother. But yes, - smaller/lighter would probably help, and in my experience ( 32 years with a street-ticket come next Friday) riders with lots of experience on small off-roaders don't have nearly as many incidents related to operator errors.
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Old 07-18-2013, 07:08 PM   #78
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This is the same as junior joins the military,
dies hours after his dream.
Who gave you the right to judge death,
as Americans follow there dreams?
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Old 07-18-2013, 07:10 PM   #79
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their ?

Any point you might be trying to make is obscured by your lack of literacy.

This has nothing to do with servicemen - except that they are REQUIRED to have training on motorcycles if they are to ride them on base, much like they train for everything else.

What many here are commenting on is the very predictable result of putting an untrained person on a 700 lb vehicle that requires balance and skill for safe operation. Do you think that is a good idea ?
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Old 07-18-2013, 07:13 PM   #80
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I think one of the contributors to such sad events is that the term "Easy rider" has been taken too literally and misconstrued to mean something it does not. What is easiest about riding is getting into serious trouble, but that does not fit the image of a lifestyle of relaxed, carefree cruising where you just amble down the road with your problems dwindling in the distance behind you. It requires active dismissal of any consideration of the obvious risks. One of my co-workers who likes to time his commute to ride home with me falls into that mold: he's so busy enjoying the sun on his face and wind around his beanie that he is oblivious to little things like lane position, the need for situational awareness at intersections, following distance, etc. I won't ride with him anymore. He has come close to running into me, forcing me into the oncoming lane to avoid a collision or to have to radically change my line in a corner and thereby cut my lateral margin to the bone. His laid-back approach makes him a danger to himself and anybody riding with him.

I have to say that IMO taking an MSF course is only a very small step in coming to grips with the realities of riding. I was not all impressed with the attitude of my MSF instructors toward risk awareness. They gave it lip service in terms of reciting the standard MSF platitudes, but when two women in the class objected that a returning rider's post-mortem on the fatal crashes of a couple of his friends and his own near-death experience was taking the fun out of the class for them and the MSF instructors opted to shut down the conversation rather than to offer useful insights into what went wrong and how it could have been avoided... well, I had to ask them at that point whether they were trying to offer survival strategies or to sell a lifestyle. The returning rider had a valid point that you need to go into this with eyes wide open, but since that threatened to diminish some post-course sales potential, he got squelched very quickly. Guess which brand the dealership was affiliated with?
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PalePhase screwed with this post 07-18-2013 at 07:25 PM
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Old 07-18-2013, 07:17 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedShark View Post
G$, I'm not following your "logic" at all. I'd start with trying to form complete sentences and work from there.

How do dead riders help the sport ? Would you recommend a large or small bike for a non-rider ?

Black Betty, I really don't HAVE an idea for tiers - and they'd never pass in the US anyway, so why even bother. But yes, - smaller/lighter would probably help, and in my experience ( 32 years with a street-ticket come next Friday) riders with lots of experience on small off-roaders don't have nearly as many incidents related to operator errors.
I understand your thinking,
You believe I should start out with small sentences and work my way up.
Do you get to determine at what point I can post what you feel are proper responses?
And could you show me what authority you have over me?
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Old 07-18-2013, 07:18 PM   #82
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Pale Phase - I've encountered similar myself:

"Your logic and rational critical thinking are Not Welcome Here."

okay....
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Old 07-18-2013, 07:19 PM   #83
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Originally Posted by *Gmoney* View Post
I understand your thinking,
You believe I should start out with small sentences and work my way up.
Do you get to determine at what point I can post what you feel are proper responses?
And could you show me what authority you have over me?

I was hoping for sentences that made sense. They don't have to be short, but COMPLETE sentences make reading much easier.

Author-a-TAY ? How absurd. I'm still wondering about your jump from untrained 'riders' to the tail-pipe/nutsack and somebody ( ? ) disrespecting servicemen. That lacks basic lucidity.
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Old 07-18-2013, 07:25 PM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedShark View Post
G$, I'm not following your "logic" at all. I'd start with trying to form complete sentences and work from there.

How do dead riders help the sport ? Would you recommend a large or small bike for a non-rider ?

Black Betty, I really don't HAVE an idea for tiers - and they'd never pass in the US anyway, so why even bother. But yes, - smaller/lighter would probably help, and in my experience ( 32 years with a street-ticket come next Friday) riders with lots of experience on small off-roaders don't have nearly as many incidents related to operator errors.
I have always been made fun of for my thinking,
but those that make fun, have never looked in the open caskets of 6 family members that where shot dead, then the shooter had sex with them.
And he is free, and walks the street today.

I admit
I could use help,
composing words to express my feelings.

And defend the dead as the courts and public opinion seem to fail them, so often.

*Gmoney* screwed with this post 07-18-2013 at 07:30 PM Reason: And defend the dead as the courts and public opinion seem to fail so often.
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Old 07-18-2013, 07:29 PM   #85
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YOU can not control everything. There will always be stupid people. Should we make laws that prohibit skydiving? Should we outlaw members of the military for putting themselves in danger? If I do recall, speeding is illegal, changing lanes without a blinker is illegal, drinking and driving is illegal, BUT PEOPLE STILL DO IT!!! Making a new law does not stop stupidity.

Easy there, Hoss. Nobody is looking to drag you off to a re-education center.

Why is it that a simple discussion about the deadly results of untrained riders reverts to a recitation of all things illegal and yet still occur ? I am surprised not to see murder, rape and arson in there.

Would requiring basic competence be a bad thing ? - I mean, you have to pass a practical test in most locations - what if that were more than just a 10-minute affair ?

I don't have a dog in this fight, so get as worked up as you want - I know that there will never be the sort of training required in other countries here in the US. Which is too bad - mangled riders don't make for good repeat business.

Gmoney, I rarely say this, but I'm sorry I even bothered trying to have a discussion with you.
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Old 07-18-2013, 07:32 PM   #86
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While at the dentist the 26 yr old hygienist was telling me how her husband who has a sport bike was going to teach her how to ride this weekend. When I mentioned the MSF course, she said he never heard of it but want worried about it either. Specially since he has dropped his several times.....I couldn't mention the benefits of the class enough.
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Old 07-18-2013, 07:39 PM   #87
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Originally Posted by *Gmoney* View Post
I have always been made fun of for my thinking,
but those that make fun, have never looked in the open caskets of 6 family members that where shot dead, then the shooter had sex with them.
And he is free, and walks the street today.


But what the hell does it have to do with the discussion here?!


Give this guy some pills please
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Old 07-18-2013, 07:41 PM   #88
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Years ago, at a small race track, doing a track day.

A rider with very poor skills comes off the track and one of the better guys in the group engages him in conversation, perhaps some hints...

I overhear; " My buddy taught me how to ride..." from the kook, "Yeah, we can see that." says the old hand.

"Buddies" giving riding advice is nearly as bad as no instruction at all sometimes - bad habits just get reinforced (not that all organized classes are 'right' either) - you are right in suggesting a real class.

I wouldn't have dared trying to teach my wife how to ride - instruction from a family member is just too fraught with baggage.
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Old 07-18-2013, 07:43 PM   #89
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That's the point dude. Just because another country makes a law doesn't mean that we have to follow.

I did't mean to sound like a political sign waiving douchbag, but... well you know how that road was paved.

Peace
well, yeah, but just because another country has a rule doesn't
mean that it's a BAD idea either ?

I mean, other countries have paved roads too, should we plow ours' up then ? ( the Japanese had extensive roadways long before we did afterall )
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Old 07-18-2013, 07:58 PM   #90
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Originally Posted by SgtDuster View Post


But what the hell does it have to do with the discussion here?!


Give this guy some pills please
I though we where making fun of a dead motorcycle rider that made the wrong decision?
I was just comparing decisions
that children made
when they did not go to church that day.

I need pills
because my comparison to bad decisions,
upset a thread about bad decisions?

I have learned that my thoughts only upset
the people that are on pills,
and cannot cope with life.

Who are these people that judge,
and decide what is the proper way to die?
And if the story of their believe, of what they think is truth,
they recommend pills?

I am more worried now, about the amount of motorcycle riders
riding while under the influence of pills,
then first time riders.

I learned a long time ago people only recommend what works for them.
I decline your experience with pills and how you think it will work for me at this time.
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