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Old 08-08-2013, 05:36 AM   #31
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OK. Bottom it is.



So what do you guy's think about the idea of using the round Ultra Plastic tube on a bolt. I thought I could make it where the tube could spin to cut down on wear. Again. Just thinkin here.

Or do you think it would be better with something bigger. More contact area.
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CalsXS2 screwed with this post 08-08-2013 at 05:56 AM
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Old 08-08-2013, 06:28 AM   #32
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Here's what I did. The tensioner is made out of one piece of UHMW. It sits in a depression in the engine case and gets sandwiched between the engine case and the alternator cover to hold it in place.

20130806_170927 by albaljeu, on Flickr

appiebroomer screwed with this post 05-15-2014 at 05:46 AM Reason: 1 year and 5000 miles later I've had the opportunity to check on the UHMW chain tensioner. All is fine, it didn't melt.
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Old 08-08-2013, 06:32 AM   #33
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Cal, about the popping. Have you checked for tight exhaust valves? I think the factory spec of .002 is a little tight, I run mine at about .004
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Old 08-08-2013, 07:33 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by appiebroomer View Post
Cal, about the popping. Have you checked for tight exhaust valves? I think the factory spec of .002 is a little tight, I run mine at about .004
Opening and closing ramps of the TX camshaft are both 0.10mm, so you will destroy valve shaft/adjuster screw ends on the long run. Valve clearance is usually 1/2 of ramp height for removing the play in valve train smoothly. Otherwise the rocker goes immediately into full acceleration while hitting the flank.
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Old 08-09-2013, 02:47 PM   #35
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Let's talk about the starter chain mod.

I liked the idea of Al's using the UHMW plastic. The problem is finding a small enough piece with out having to spend $30 plus shipping.

I did get lucky and found a place very near me that makes the stuff. I was able to buy some scrape piece's for $8.

I did have a huge concern.... Heat!!. How hot does the oil inside of the engine get. I mean hell. Yamaha put a cooler on the dam thing.

So the point is, I along with the rep from Cope Plastics was concerned about the heat. He said at 180* the UHMW gets soft. At 200* it gets gooey. I assume he is talking 200*F. But I guess we need to research that point.

Well I thought it probably didn't get that hot. So I was all set to go with it, and start wittlin me some plastic.

If you guy's decide to go this route, and are having a hard time finding the material, you can get a hold of Andy at Cope Plastics in Alton, IL. He can hook you up with a small piece for cheap.

You can go to their website and while on the home page, look for "excess inventory sale". It will list everything they have at the moment. Tell him Calvin sent ya.

http://www.copeplastics.com/



So after all this,,, I went another route. I'll start another post.
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Old 08-09-2013, 02:48 PM   #36
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reserved...........
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Old 08-09-2013, 03:08 PM   #37
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If the temps you're talking about are on the Fahrenheit scale, the oil gets too hot. Yamaha said the basic engine w/o the deep sump could get as high as 380F. Until I put the oil cooler on mine I saw oil temps around 285 or so, and it holds pretty constant at 220-230 with cooler and deep sump. I'm assuming the case area temps would be similar, so I'd double check on which scale the soft/gooey conditions occur before putting one on.
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Old 08-09-2013, 03:09 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by CalsXS2 View Post
Let's talk about the starter chain mod.

I liked the idea of Al's using the UHMW plastic. The problem is finding a small enough piece with out having to spend $30 plus shipping.

I did get lucky and found a place very near me that makes the stuff. I was able to buy some scrape piece's for $8.

I did have a huge concern.... Heat!!. How hot does the oil inside of the engine get. I mean hell. Yamaha put a cooler on the dam thing.

So the point is, I along with the rep from Cope Plastics was concerned about the heat. He said at 180* the UHMW gets soft. At 200* it gets gooey.

Well I thought it probably didn't get that hot. So I was all set to go with it, and start wittlin me some plastic.

If you guy's decide to go this route, and are having a hard time finding the material, you can get a hold of Andy at Cope Plastics in Alton, IL. He can hook you up with a small piece for cheap.

You can go to their website and while on the home page, look for "excess inventory sale". It will list everything they have at the moment. Tell him Calvin sent ya.

http://www.copeplastics.com/



So after all this,,, I went another route. I'll start another post.
Teflon blocks handle the heat. www.mcmaster.com
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Old 08-09-2013, 03:21 PM   #39
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You guy's are too fast. Or is that half fast.

That is exactly the point I was making. I assumed he was talking 200*F.

Better check your temp's Al.

But I came up with another solution I think you guy's will approve of.

I'll try again to reserve a spot and post it,,,,lol.
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Old 08-09-2013, 03:22 PM   #40
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So on my way home from the plastic shop, I stopped in at the local Harley dealer to see my Brother that works there. I showed him my project. I had a piece of plastic that the plastic guy gave me that was just happen to be laying there. It was close to what I needed. My Brother said, "Hell. That looks like a Harley cam chain guide".

Sure enough. He pulled one out, and I couldn't believe what I was looking at. A dam near perfect part.

It's a cam chain guide for a 2,000 and up Harley 1450cc Twin Cam Engine. Part #39965-99.







All it took was very little work on the bench grinder to make it fit. The part has webbing in it. It's like it was there just for me.







I did question him about the temperature. He said those big Harley's get well over 300*F. I had no idea these bike's get this hot.

So do you guy's think this part will be ok for the heat issue. I don't have an oil cooler. But it's on the want list. I do have the deep sump.
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Old 08-09-2013, 04:16 PM   #41
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As Argo point's out, if you have the later motor, it will not have mounting hole's like the early design that actually had a tensioner for use with a longer chain they had then. If you choose to use this method, you will have to drill and tap 6mm hole's.







Here's a bracket that i made while I thought I was going to have to order plastic online. I was going a totally different route then.









Finished product.







With the chain installed.







There is one detail I still need to work out. You have to use thin metal at the top, or the chain will rub the screw's. I was going to just shim the guide at the bottom so the chain runs in the center of it. All this still has to be dialed in.

But I think since this part cost less than $5,,, I'll just screw 2 of them together and save some fab work.





I was going to go into greater detail,, but I think not for now. Unless someone decides to try this. Then ask away.

Please let me know what you guy's think. Do you see anything I need to do different. Do you think this frickin Harley part can handle the heat. Input please.





I guess I better throw in a disclaimer too. DO THIS AT YOUR OWN RISK!!

I have not tested this yet. Hell. It may not get rid of any of my noise. But Al said it got rid of his.

If you guy's decided to do something similar,,, please post your pic's. Good luck.
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Old 08-09-2013, 04:40 PM   #42
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You say you want to take it for a "SPIN".







Now that I have watched this video a couple of time's, I noticed you can really see how much the chain moves upward. Just think of what it must have looked like with out a tensioner.
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Old 08-10-2013, 08:48 AM   #43
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After reading about your temperature concerns regarding the use of UHMW for the chain tensioner and after completing a 150 mile ride, the last 25 miles at 85 plus MPH, I thought I'd had better take a look at the tensioner. Fully expecting to find a blob of plastic in the bottom of the chain case, but I was happy to find it fully intact and having suffered no degradation as a result of excess heat.
I do think Argo's tensioner is a better solution, but the UHMW was an easy way for me to determine if the noise was coming from the chain contacting the cover.
Also happy to report no new scuffing on the rotor or stator, how ever I did find an area around the sprocket on the chain cover where the chain was still rubbing (very minor). Maybe the way to fix that would be to use a thicker cover gasket.
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Old 08-10-2013, 09:30 AM   #44
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Also happy to report no new scuffing on the rotor or stator, how ever I did find an area around the sprocket on the chain cover where the chain was still rubbing (very minor). Maybe the way to fix that would be to use a thicker cover gasket.

I don't think mine has any damage from the sprocket. Can you post a pic of what you're talking about.
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Old 08-10-2013, 12:00 PM   #45
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around the top right arrow, you have some rubbing there too.
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